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I only got baptized at 11 years old because my younger sister was.
Tell me about it. I got baptized at 10, and can totally relate to all you said.
I didn't want to do this at all, yet the maternal unit suffocated me. It had to be done. Either through guilt trip or physical force.
i would like to hear people's opinions on intolerant religious groups?
who wins?.
somehow, i have this notion that pentecostals would win 1st place, followed by baptists, followed by jw's.
JW's certainly always are condeming Christianity though.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
I spoke with my sister, she's been giving me great advice to stand firm. I've decided not to give in to mother's pleas any longer. I am only enabling her to continue to control me through this "last thing I am asking from you. Do it for me." That's the only reason I spoke with the first 2 elders.
The vicious cycle must end. I cannot give her hope of returning. All I can do is expose the WT for what it is, and be branded apostate by my mother, or make her reason and react. I wish I could give it time, but that would only be enabling her. Control isn't hers any longer.
i would like to hear people's opinions on intolerant religious groups?
who wins?.
somehow, i have this notion that pentecostals would win 1st place, followed by baptists, followed by jw's.
Depends on the time period. Christianity was horrible (Crusades, Inquisition, New World)
Islam is probably the worst nowadays, and it is growing at an alarming rate.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
A fade is not possible. Also, I would not care about the consequences of shunning, were it not for my mother. I have nobody else "in."
On top of that, I announced I did not want to be a JW on the first day of my discussion with her. I will not feign to be somebody I am not any longer.
The only thing I hate so much about this direct process is that I have to see her suffer greatly. But, my conscience is free. I don't have to be somebody I no longer want to be.
I do not advocate fading. The sooner more leave, the better.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
Nobleheart, message read. I replied.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
I have some serious updates. My mother was unable to sleep last night, because I informed elder 2 I would not accept the elders' help, which meant that my DA decision was final. My mother cried up a serious storm. I've never seen her so devastated, and to be honest, I don't know how much longer I can hold out.
Even though I don't really believe in any of this, there is that very strong conviction in her, and on the back of my head, it's always "What if this is the real deal?"
However, this morning she awoke me @ 6:45 to show me in "Insight on the Scriptures" the meaning of apostasy. She thought that my DA was not that severe, but she looked into this that I was essentially an apostate and would therefore have no means of ever coming back.
I started telling her, not just that I didn't believe in the organisation, but why. She began to reason, and actually calmed down. She saw that some of the things I told here were legitimate. Ex. False dates that were categorically stated as the end of the world such as 1914, 1925, and insinuated in 1975. This would prove WT false prophets. I also showed that the WT would then parallel Harold Camping’s May 2011, for if Camping was a false prophet for announcing a date that never came, then so was WT.
However, for this I would have to find an article that stated it first as categorically, then white-washed it into possibility or turned its interpretation around. I know jwfacts has this info, but I would like to get a legitimate copy, and not simply a quote. That ain’t so easy.
I also reasoned with her on the Bible, on subjects like 2 flock hope.
With the “Organized to do God’s Will” book, I showed that baptism was being done in the name of an organisation, which clearly went against Scripture in Matthew 28:19.
Ultimately, I told her outright my feelings that everything I have been “fed” has been from non-other than the organisation. I also reasoned with her that I was baptised at 10 and essentially was forced to do it, for fear of being wiped out at Armaggedon and to please her. Expressing how I truly felt about all this helped her a great deal in seeing the reality of the situation. She was beginning to understand.
But, then the cult-persona came in again. Seeing she was losing ground with me on reasoning and was beginning to doubt herself, she told me to address these questions with the elders.
I stupidly accepted. I am in the mouth of the wolf here. She is out to assembly now, while I stay home for the weekend.
What do I do now? Do I tell her I changed my mind, don’t want to meet with the elders, and that I have simply made up my mind? Or do I go all out with a bang, prove the WT is a false organisation, and possibly even shake her enough to come to reason?
If I have a chance to save her from this damned religion, it would be tremendous.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
Round 2 was interesting. Let me get to that before I answer your posts. And again, I appreciate the support. This was a much more knowledable elder. He actually came across strong, and I admit that I wasn't able to really "get" anywhere with him. He told me the details(dates such as 75, 14, 25; emphasis the publications and the meetings place on the faithful slave) I was focusing on were minor. He asked me if I still believed in Jehovah, to which I responded, "yes". I didn't hold back in telling him I had read just about everything apostate. He came up with an interesting illustration. He asked, "What happens when you eat too much chocolate?" I respond, "You get a belly ache!" He says, "You have consumed too much apostasy, and that's why you are focusing on the insignificants. Your belly hurts, but for insignificant things. The teachings of greater weight (one God, no hellfire, rejection of idolatry, etc.) are there. Do you believe you can be christian alone?" I responded, "Well, I'll sure try. The point is I cannot fathom God in his infinite greatness allowing for salvation only in an organisation." "But," he said, "would you try to go anywhere else to worship? Would you feel comfortable?" I said, "No." So he pulls out good ol' Acts 10:24,25. "How are you going to do that commandment." (*important side note* keep in mind I had gotten barely no sleep last night, after the freighteningly strong reaction my mother had, after being practically in a daze all day at work (with 2 witness coworkers that I was not yet ready to anounce my decision to), after having had the other elder over for ~1:30 hours, and elder 2 over here at my house at about 10 pm.) (IOW, I was pretty mentally weak already. I was beginning to crack.) I mentioned that where there are 2 or 3, I am in your midst. He also mentioned Micah 7:7. Wait on Jehovah. Alot of brother have had doubts at one point or another. The faithful slave is wrong, but admits it. If you don't believe they are at the right doctrine yet, wait on Jehovah. He finished with a bang with John 6:66. He put a twist on it I had not heard before. He pointed out that the text says He kept pursuing the bigger picture. I ended up acknowledging that 1.) no matter how good worldies are, it's very difficult to find someone you can trust, 2.) in the "bigger picture" I hadn't seen in any other religion what this one does. I basically gave him a carte blanche, and I almost caved. It's perhaps not that he refuted the points so well, as just he was very human in dealing with me. I tryed to point out some of the logical fallacy's, but he pointed out some of mine in my reasonings. Example: I showed him the 8 January 1989 Awake magazine, pg 3 which gives the "Reason why Awake is published." Paraphrasing from Spanish it says, "This magazine promotes trusting in the promise of the Creator to establish a new peaceful and secure world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away." He diverted to overlapping generation, and even went so far as to say that a 7 year old in 1914 would be today 104. Even he knew that was a far stretch. But, he continued firm, and unfortunately I began to waiver. He basically said towards the end, "You still believe in Jehovah, you still want to follow Bible morals. We can help you." I was silent for a long time and said, "I appreciate your coming here, and telling me the things you have told me. I am starting to see things in a different way. However, I need time to decide." I glad that even though emotion was creeping up on me, I didn't make a rash decision as of that moment. I could of so easily gone back in that moment of weakness. But, today I finally confirmed to my mother I am not going back. She is with the illusion I may one day return. I am decided.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
Update #1
The elder came, saw, and left. Victor? Logic and reason.
I refuted every single point. Not to puff myself, just that I was able to respectfuly stand my ground.
Here comes round 2. My mother asked for a more "knowledgable" elder to come. I await his coming, knowing truth and conviction cannot be defeated. This is last round, and I know I won.
More updates as I can.
i spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins.
it came rushing out.
my mother is devastated.
It's all out. I spoke with my mother, told her everything, my doubts, my fears, my sins. It came rushing out.
My mother is devastated. But, inside I am free and even though I am suffering right now, I will come out and eventually see the light. I already see a little bit.
I wish I hadn't held back all these years what I really thought. It would have been much less painful. But, she accepts my decision.
An elder is coming over right now. This upon request of my mother. I will stand up for what I believe in and refute what I don't. Today, I become a man and an individual. Today, begins my life.
Thank you all for your help and your experiences. In ways you can't imagine, this forum helped me so much, and helped me get to this point.
I never wished to shread my mom's heart, and it's gut-wrenching. But, today I can for the first time in a long time, breath. I will keep you posted.
Your fellow emancipated human,
Knowsnothing.
