Posts by roxanesophia

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

Everything is observed and noted - sizemik
Thanks man for explaining everything i spent hours uselessly 'worrying' about - and that phrase alone is enough reason to leave, and will remind me in future why i did.

This cult has obviously given you something you don't want to walk away from. - dgp

You're spot on. At first I thought I was going to God. When that fell through, I stayed around for the morals and tried to justify continuing to study a false religion with "Well, they do read the bible." OH YES, THEIR CORRUPT BIBLE. I had already been sucked in by the teaching that the world was much worse than being in the organization. Basically everything that kept me in "the lie" was lies.

LongHairGal, i liked reading your story, getting to "good riddance" made me smile, i can sense how happy you were to get out. Really made me wonder why I'm still IN. Rest assured, I won't be for much longer.

Honesty, your post confirms what I suspected. I bet these brothers exist in my congregation. They're literally stuck... and screwed.

Thanks, hybridous, your post means alot because you just spoke from MY heart. I was looking for something, and i haven't found it.

I actually got invited out by the in crowd tonight and it's like the invite was accidentally sent. Such a horrible night, and i knew it would be before i went, but i had to go to confirm to myself that the jesus I pray to (that would be the right one, not the Watchtower one) is telling me it's time to go. I won't go into the pathetic details, but let's just say i saw firsthand how mean and vindictive witnesses are outside the hall. Oh, there was a lot of fake hugging, and "hiiii's" but then there were the whispers and the looks, and just anything else they could do to make it obvious that even though i was invited by someone in the clique, it was no group decision. Part of me wanted to fall to pieces, but another part wanted to hold my head high and tell them they can go to the hell they don't believe in. The only part of the night where I felt human was when i was leaving and a table of worldly (seriously, fuck that word, forever) guys said bye, but it was really just "Welcome back."

Got home and lost it. Not because of how I was treated, but because I'm done with this bullshit. Whatever kept me there, what ever illusions i was enticed by, were destroyed. And just to let me know he's still there, ironically, the first song that came up on the iPod was the Killers "When You Were Young" and the lyric goes "He doesn't look a thing like Jesus." and i relate that to the witnesses themselves and their false Jesus.
It ended up being a good night.

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

You're awesome, blondie. Thank you tons for all that info - and from their own literature, no less. I have a heap of watchtowers stored away and i have the library but i don't feel like touching any of it at the moment.

So Roxane, if you now believe that you are indeed being lied to, what do you think you should do?

I wish I knew! I know it's ridiculous, but I'm having a hard time walking from something i invested a lot into. But it's not a matter of IF I leave, it's when.

He's trying to establish your connections in order to position himself in relation to that. - sizemik

Thanks for explaining that... i just figured he was being a judgmental bastard. As I said, this girl is in his circle, i guess. I took it to mean he didn't want me in it, but i didn't know it was usual behavior for them to enquire about associations. What does "position himself in relation to that" mean? I get the establish connections part: they are already in the habit of needing to be in the know when it comes to who hangs out with who. I just wasn't aware MS' took notice of that.

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

I kinda do because it appears that way. I've seen photos from their parties and it's all the same freakin' people!

Here's something funny: i mentioned to a JW the other day that i was thinking of just giving up on religion and getitng on with my life career wise, looking for another job etc. Well a girl I've never met prior comes up to me at the hall and says her parent's company need a receptionist. Her JW parents of course. WHOA, talk about NOT SUBTLE AT ALL. I think if i take that job, i may as well be circling the drain. Knowing I'm in danger of quitting the study, now they're trying to put employment into the picture.

I'm pretty sure i can see what's going on there, unless I'm too cynical...

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

Black Sheep: Oh i completely believe in Satan, just through people I know who dabbled in the occult, but everyone has their own beliefs. My point is they can use Satan to justify anything and they do.

sizemik: They will be more natural out of the KH (when among their genuine friends) and more guarded inside the KH (when they are being observed by rivals).

Ah, I see what you mean. Well, that's REALLY shitty. I have to think long and hard about subjecting myself to that environment. I don't cope well with hypocrisy and two faced people. Didn't know having a study was a trophy, but i always suspected it.

I try to talk to whoever is around, and i often wonder what my study teacher thinks of it. I'm always thinking "Is she friends with this person?" and I hate it. Your post confirmed my worst fears. But you're right, they're human. I'm being the unreasonable one here with high expectations. I never experienced this before though because i wasn't a regular at the hall. I liked it better when i wasn't. my teacher is pretty highly valued in the congregation, and seems to get along with everyone, but i guess that could make her the secret rival of at least someone in there.

All this is making sense why an MS saw me with someone he hangs out with and made a point to come over and ask "Did you come together?" as if he was concerned or curious if we were friends. Maybe it's me, but that's just something people don't ask someone, RIGHT? But it didn't make me feel good and i still wonder what he meant.

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

Hi Pam's girl, sorry to hear you struggled with agoraphobia ... I had some degree of that myself. And i know too well how quickly witnesses dump what they consider a defective model and no use in the organization. My intellectually disabled bro experienced that. The brothers calling on him said "But he looked normal!" and never came back.

It's wonderful that you moved on after associating with the organization. I've had panic attacks over it when i' m not even actively a part of it yet. I'm sorta scared to leave because i went so far into it and now i worry what gossip there'll be when I'm gone.

Go to dinner with one or more of them and you will become a close friend of the elders (evil grin) - HAHAHAHA! Damn, this is completely terrifying me. The elders are so overly nice to me right now being a study and all. I can't imagine how they change once i become Watchtower property, but i believe you.

If you become unconsciously attached to a certain set, some of the others can be a bit cool just because of that - sizemik
Can you explain further what you mean by that? Does "a bit cool" mean stand off-ish?

Outsmartthesystem: EXACTLY. They can use Satan in every argument and it's frustrating because they CAN.

.the day is coming shortly when everyone in the Hall WILL feel more comfortable around you. You'll be invited to EVERYTHING....which will "prove" how much love they have among themselves....and will (possibly) be the last bump you need to move towards baptism.
Hahaha this sounds like sarcasm. Are you saying this will happen to trick me into baptism (and HELL, it'll probably work), since you said "which will prove how much love they have among themselves." OH JEEZ, I'm so looking forward to the day they decide to involve me in everything because it sure as hell ain't here yet. Yes, that was sarcasm. OH GOD, here comes high school 2.0

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

More like hypocrites. I've tested the apostate card, saying "I can follow Jesus without an organization" and the response was "No, you can't. There's a reason it's called spiritual food, because without you'd starve."

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

- You're not in yet, but you're not out, either.

So I'm told constantly! I've heard different things like "You're not with us yet" and "You're practically one of us already." I also often hear "Everyone already thinks you're a witness." Maybe they just don't like me and i wont get that association regardless. That was my thought until my study teacher said "You don't have anything to worry about, everyone likes you." That's why i don't understand why I get 'tempted' with these social outings but then I'm not invited. It's not like i call them either, though... but that's only because even though they apparently like me, i still don't feel like I'm "one of them" yet. But how do i know if I'll ever be! "You're not one of us yet" could be a convenient excuse. Will it change once I am? I dunno. I do know I'm being told now to start answering up at meetings. I want to reply with "But I'm not one of you yet!"

- I have no idea why they aren't inviting you to functions. That's just stupid on their part. Maybe they don't live up to their professed high standards when they let their hair down.

The ones i have been to were just awkward. These are people who have known each other 10 or more years and have their inside jokes and stories. I also find it slightly hypocritical that girls can't even sit with a guy in the hall and i was under the impression it was all very strict, until i went to parties and they'd hug me hello and goodbye. Then back at the hall, barely even a hello. IT'S JUST SO WEIRD. And it's not just that that i find hypocritical: it's the dress when they're being "god's people" compared to party dress (worldly dress, in other words.) Then seeing these sisters lying down on the couch with brothers they're not dating or married to. OK, they aren't fooling around, and there's other people there, but still! I can't imagine elders would be pleased. It's not weird in the world, but it is in their cult, so am i to be blamed for feeling confused? It's that double lives situation that kinda irritates me.

So that last point rings true. I am going crazy making my own assumptions now, like "Maybe I'm kept away from parties where there's spiritually weak people" and other parties where there's "spiritually strong" ones. In the former group, something could corrupt me, or i could further corrupt them, and in the latter group, they don't want to hang with worldly people at all and they don't want me influencing them in any way. Am I warm here? lol

18

Worldy opposition is interpreted as confirmation of the truth

by MrMonroe in

interesting comment on the talk page of the wikipedia article on the governing body here:.

one dopey jw (wandering-teacher) who complained that the article was "biased" against the jws was supported in a comment by another assumed jw (galik) who whined that the article was "peppered with quotes from known opposers of jehovah's witnesses in order to use this article as a propaganda vehicle".. wandering-teacher replied: "thanks for the support, galik.

the difficulty of having a neutral point of view in the ... article strengthens my faith that i have made the correct religious choice for me.".

roxanesophia

Hahahaha sometimes their reasoning is so asinine. Then they'll say how smart they are.

18

Worldy opposition is interpreted as confirmation of the truth

by MrMonroe in

interesting comment on the talk page of the wikipedia article on the governing body here:.

one dopey jw (wandering-teacher) who complained that the article was "biased" against the jws was supported in a comment by another assumed jw (galik) who whined that the article was "peppered with quotes from known opposers of jehovah's witnesses in order to use this article as a propaganda vehicle".. wandering-teacher replied: "thanks for the support, galik.

the difficulty of having a neutral point of view in the ... article strengthens my faith that i have made the correct religious choice for me.".

roxanesophia

Oh yes... you tell a JW "Hey, there's a lot of stuff on the internet about you guys. Ever thought of investigating it, since you have the truth and all, there's nothing to worry about..." (this was after they said they can respond to anyone's ridiculous claims about them because "Who knows more about Jehovah's Witnesses than Jehovah's Witnesses?" was said on the platform that evening. )

The response? "That just strengthens my faith! Why would anyone bother to attack us if we weren't doing something the world hates." Then they used the scripture "Broad is the gate leading to destruction, narrow is the road leading to life" or whatever it is. Apparently all the internet sites is the broad road and the positive sites (which they admitted were only the official sites) was the narrow road.

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

THANK YOU!

I'd like to reply to people individually, but given the amount of responses, my post would be massive. But EVERYONE gave such helpful responses and I honestly appreciate it. Definitely a great thread for anyone who comes into the org and has the same doubts I do. I've been having anxiety attacks over this issue because I thought I was making real friends at the hall but I feel it getting colder because i should be out in the field service. But I've stopped mentioning it, etc. Now that I'm bringing up my doubts, they're saying anything to sugar coat the religion. I really needed to hear it from people who know best, I'm definitely not IN the cult yet, and I'm also being told nothing will change when I am. That contradicts everything I've ever read here, and I'm not going to believe one person over 20 + people.

Prior to me coming right out and saying I don't like the idea of JW's only associate with JW's, I told her I had worldly (UGH if i never hear that word again, it'll be too soon!) friends sending really heartfelt emails, and the JW's turn this around, implying i don't have good friends, and say:

"What kind of person even cares what religious beliefs their friend has? They should want to be friends with you regardless of what you believe. Heaps of people we work with want to be friends with us, they don't care about religion."
Then i asked "So you'd be friends with people at work?"

Then she says, "No." and rattled off scriptures.

But then sometimes she sweetens it with "But it's a conscience matter." as if to say they are still completely in control.

She's also said in the past "You've dumped your worldly friends, but you're not with us yet, so this is Jehovah testing you now."

She'll mention things like "You have to start coming with us." when talking about social outings, then i'm never actually invited. What's this? Is it reminding me that I'm not entitled to the association yet?

And another time we were discussing the unbaptized publisher requirements and we got to the part about association and I proudly boast "YEAH I'VE DUMPED THE WORLDLIES" and she says "That includes people on the internet." Well, I hadn't done that.

And just other things I've heard, from people who tell it like it is. I say I have no family in it, and they're like "Oh, that makes it really hard." Well that just totally contradicts that i can be a JW and maintain Non JW relationships with ease.

So I KNEW she was lying to me. I just appreciate all the confirmation.