Posts by roxanesophia

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Someone here suggested to ask her if she can name one negative thing about the cult and if she couldn't it was indeed a cult. Sure enough I said “if we were to focus on the flaws..” And she interrupted me with “but there are no flaws” LOL. Oh boy. So I emailed her and some other JWs this little something I came up with. Claim to have the truth and you're better than me / won't let me walk away with my dignity/ but I gotta tell you its you who was misled / the men at the top have left you for dead/ wasting precious time on a futile cause / spreading vicious lies and expecting applause / the truth escapes you/ can't you see/ that you're the victim of the devil's mockery Drop that bookbag and run/ the man behind the door aint got a gun/ but he's got a book to prove you wrong/ run away your faith in twelve faceless men ain't that strong Accuse me of being an apostate/ convinced that you're entering through the narrow gate/ but the broad road to destruction is the doctrine of men/ you're no different to the churches you condemn/ wake up and smell the coffee before its too late/ or will it take another failed dooms date? / ah that was therapeutic :) The book I'm referring to is the bible since it indeed proves them wrong.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Oh,and sorry for the double post but i had to get this thought down before i forgot it and i can't edit my post...

The anglo-american power isn't even a reality, but an entirely fictious world power designed to fit watchtower prophecy???? Excuse my ignorance re: politics.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

"'New light' = new revealed 'truth.' Often it's been found that 'new light' is rehashed 'old light' that was temporarily discarded in favor of 'newer light' but which has then been discovered not to be 'light' after all. You follow? ;-)"

Haha, yeah I'm with ya... and like all things JW it's ridiculous. Truth is truth is truth! It never becomes not truth, a lie is always a lie, if YOU follow ;-)

"The path of the righteous ones is like the bright light that is getting lighter and lighter until the day is firmly established"

Ah! yes! They have mentioned this to me before as if the flip flops are entirely justifiable because of it. But the scripture has nothing to do with doctrine changes when it's read in context, does it?

" Watch Tower publications also say that unfulfilled expectations are partly due to eagerness for God's Kingdom "

I've heard that one before, too! I could almost have bought it, until I researched it more and they were claiming them as definite prophecies. Thats when i knew God had nothing to do with the org, because there's a scripture about if something doesn't come to pass, the prophet is a liar. Plus, it makes the watchtower look no different to nutcases like Harold Camping. I've heard witnesses mocking him and his doomsday predictions, too. How ironic.

LOL punkofnice, i love the art. And it's true, every one of them is ALWAYS better than the last.

I'd just love to hear one of them say "It was the most boring shit I ever sat through."

"You should ask her if she can name three things she does not like about Jehovah's Witnesses. If she can't, she's in a cult."

That's such an excellent question. So far she has nothing but positive things to say. Even saying "If you're out in a restaurant, and there's a table of witnesses, they're always the happiest people in the room." Apparently no human on earth's happiness can compare to the happiness of a Jehovah's Witness.

"What did the Toes on a Statue mean?..

Answer:"Nothing"..

LOL, exactly. She said there wasn't enough time (what, in 3 days!?) for the speaker to go into it, but it was the weakened anglo american power. I brought up something i learned about revelation, implying the witnesses have it wrong, and she snapped "DON'T listen to other people! They don't even know the Bible."

Thanks so much for all the links, ziddina. Amazing how much to this corrupt organization there really is.

" Shove it in her face and make her feel GUILTY."

Yeah, i was considering telling her I forgive her for wasting my time, filling me with false hope, teaching me the lies of a religion I almost became emotionally attached to, that she hasn't even bothered to research on her own, figuring that should plant a seed. I did tell her I am going to read the book Crisis of Conscience. She said "don't waste your time, you know it's the truth." (she stresses "you know it's the truth" a lot) So i said "If it's the truth, it'll stand on it's own, and the book will be proven to be rubbish. So there's no harm in me reading it." She's always telling me i obviously don't trust Jehovah enough to look after me when I'm door knocking, since I haven't done it, so I said "If I'm wrong to read this book as you say and it puts me on the broad road to destruction, I'm going to trust that Jehovah will direct me back to the narrow road, that you say is you."

But most of the time when I talk to her, I feel like I'm trying to hold water in my hands. She has an answer for everything and for some reason i always come out looking & feeling like the stupid one.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Everyone's words of encouragement, and advice is helping A LOT, so a million thank you's for that.
Black Sheep: that's a great suggestion, and it's exactly what I wanted to do: anti witness. I'm sure you've all had the same yearning to tell people the truth about the truth. I know I do. If I could save ONE person i met in the hall from the Watchtower, I'd be happy.

More updates: She came around to talk to me all about the convention. How it was the "greatest one ever", how I "really missed out", how "new light" was revealed. Then she said "All through the past, the slave class knew things before they happened. So if the slave class is saying the end is very soon, we know it must be."

What is "new light?" supposed to mean?

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Hi everyone, here's an update:

I'm getting hounded to hell and back. Everyone i know from there is calling me and playing dumb as if it hasnt' gone around the whole congregation that I'm gone. Bullshit. My conductor is a bitch because she knows how much i hate confrontation and I'm feeling very victimized.

8

Part of me wants the Borg to carry on doing what it does

by TheyCantDoATing Man in

there are times when i hate the borg.

when i think about my lost childhood in it, the draconian level of authority and all the idiots i had to put up with over the years, i get very bitter, angry and resentful.. i went through a stage of turning the other cheek and praying for thine enemies but that didn't really work for me.

i remained on boiling point, simmering under the surface.. i now have reached a more pragmatic viewpoint.

roxanesophia

The last convention I went to, the speaker concluded one of his talks with "There may come a time when we'll be cut off from the governing body" and there were gasps all around. By this time I already knew the truth about the truth so i wasn't surprised at all to learn the watchtower will fall with every other false religion they harp on about. But what that speaker says contradicts the belief that they WILL be the last religion standing because they're the true one. Would God allow his organization to fall? No. And no JW even questioned it. Made me think the speaker didn't really believe it himself or the GB is now preparing people for the TRUTH!

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Wow, you wonderful people weren't wrong about feeling free, even if I wasn't that deep into the cult. I hadn't gone out witnessing yet because something just kept telling me "No" regardless of their not so subtle pressure, including a talk by a ministerial servant where he looked at me saying "We've all got those studies who know everything and as much as we try to help them, can't get them to make that full dedication to Jehovah"

Aussie Oz - And when they talk about you they will say probably it was that "jehovah" did not want you . And thats why he let you fall to Satan.

I remarked to my Elder friend one day (many years ago) that i hoped my disfellowshipped brother would come back, his reply?

"Have you not thought that perhaps jehovah does not want him back".

That's disgusting. I didn't like 3 of 5 elders in the congregation i was in and these are the men supposedly appointed by holy spirit. One of them, if you saw in the street, you'd run like hell, he was that unapproachable. It just never made sense that they were CHOSEN to "sheperd the flock." But I guess they have to say anything to feel better when someone leaves because they learn its a huge crock of shit when they're taught (and so was I) that there's no love anywhere else, no friends anywhere else, no truth anywhere else. So WHY WOULD ANYONE LEAVE in that case? I tried to get out 2 months ago saying "I don't like how cruel the disfellowshipped are treated and how they could be possibly sinning against an entire congregation of people who can switch off any human sympathy and love for that person because they're told to." and she makes me speak with 3 former disfellowshipped people who all said "It was the best thing ever happened! If the friends hadn't cut me loose i never would have known what i was doing wrong and rely on Jehovah to help me fix it."

I told a MS that I had watched the disfellowshipped's videos and it made me sad and he said "Those people are just there to make YOUR life harder. Half of them are acting, too." More Then he changed the subject with how well I'm doing. SO I changed it back to why the doctrine has changed since the "Bible students" were founded. He said "Yes, but the light gets brighter, and we admit to our mistakes, other religions don't." Then he changed the subject to: "You come here now and you know what we're about. You don't need the opinions of disgrunted ex members" So i changed it back to "I don't like the pedaphile scandals" and he said "The catholic church have more than us." So i said "How can God have an organization full of imperfect people no different to the worldly ones you condemn?" and he said "We are trying the hardest." ANSWER. FOR. EVERYTHING.

Ha, my conductor would always say to me "I want you to ask me the tough questions!" but i don't think she meant as tough as anything on JWfacts.com. I did ask her where the hell 1914 came from since it's not in the Bible and of course the society books come out. AS IF I'm accepting that. They even had a part one night on doing research to find truth (the nerve!) and the demonstration was a guy at a desk with 3 stacks of society literature ONLY. I didn't know whether to laugh or throw up. It's practically criminal to plant in people's heads that they never need to use outside literature to research things. REVOLTING. VERY different to what I learned at college.

Anyway, update on the present situation:

I got the phone messages and emails. They're using the "You mean so much to Jehovah, that's why things got hard for you, and you felt you had to make this decision, but Satan is NOT stronger so if you only kept going..." Took everything in me not to write back "Satan is not here. He's at your assembly laughing at you." And I can't blame him because if i had to go, laughing would be the only thing to get me through it.

And the "I love you's"

I'm upset on one hand because I really did like some of the people I met. It's not fair... i went into this with the decision to make it my life because I truly believed it was truth, so I worked hard at making friends and it's hard to let go of those ones and harder knowing their interest in me is most likely limited to my progress. On the other hand I dunno if I can be friends with people who are so misled and don't care to learn that. I prayed and read the bible last night (and i know religion isn't for everyone here) but I found all the scriptures that assured me I hadn't "left God" when i left the witnesses.

like:

"He said to them: "Isaiah aptly prophesied about you hypocrites as it is written. This people honor me with their lips but their hearts are far removed from me. It is in vain that they keep worshiping me because they teach as doctrines commands of men."
Mark 7:6-7

then it hit me like a ton of bricks: JW's are the pharisees! Then I found scriptures that JW's made me read out of context about going house to house and shaking the dust off your feet blah blah, and Jesus was talking to his disciples, not us. I believe in talking to people about Jesus but thats very different to bombarding them with literature and forcing them to attend all those meetings, and the rest. Jesus' command for us was more along the lines of feeding and clothing our fellow man, etc, which the JWs DO NOT do from what I've seen. Unless you're a JW, and even then, only when you're favoured. It's just from what I've seen, maybe it's different in other places.
Oh, but an elder told my mother at the door "We do the biggest charity work there is!" My mother said "What? Going door to door annoying the living shit out of people while believing you will live and they will die?"

So i do feel better, i'm just sad now about the 'friends'. But that only would have gotten hard had i stayed longer.

On that note, there's more love in this thread than at the kingdom hall!

OH! I said to her before saying i didn't want to go that i didn't want to hear another word about Satan, or apostates. She said "It won't be about any of that." YEAH, RIGHT!

I'm sure she'll email me how great the convention was, too and how good it would have been for me. I think I'll just ask her how many girls there couldn't walk in their shoes.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Thanks everyone, with your support and encouragement I made the call. I said "I have issues with Jehovah God and cannot continue studying with those doubts. And since you're always saying to put Jehovah to the test when it comes to trials, I'm going to test if he brings me back to the organization."

"I think she's still studying because she really wants to be her friend. I may be wrong, but the OP might not have friends and that's why she's going through the bible study."

That's what it came down to. I believed it was the truth and i did what I was asked: cut off worldly friends. I found myself wanting to be around them less and less because i honestly believed what i was studying and only wanted to be around other JW's. I thought my study conductor and others were my friend and it wasn't until i came here that i learned how conditional friendships are.

A few years ago someone told me I was the kind of person to join a cult, and i thought people knew a cult when they saw it. I thought it was "the truth."

She said that if I just got through this trial i could get through anything Satan throws at me, so I said "I honestly don't believe Satan cares what I'm doing. If he exists I'm sure he'd rather attach himself to bigger things like politics and entertainment."

Then she said "It's a shame you feel that way... that's Satan's trickery"

I said "It's also Satan's trick to break up the family unit and i see a lot of broken families in the congregation."

Then she read a scripture where Jesus says anyone who leaves family to follow him gains more family.

"But he didn't say to treat family as if they are dead, either."

She went quiet and said "God has an arrangement in place so we follow that."

I said "I'm getting sick over this stuff and really can't afford to invest any more time in it when my hearts not in it too."

More was said but at the end she said "if there's anything i can do to help..." and I said "You've done enough. I'm letting God do the rest. If he leads me back, so be it."

Then i hung up knowing full well that's not going to happen.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

"She'll get brownie points for getting you there"

"you've become her spiritual status symbol."

Bingo. I can see it, but i know she thinks she's actually saving me or some bullshit and I'm not good at standing up for myself and she knows it. It's how i got involved with JW's in the first place.

"Oh weve got an area where you can sit in the quiet and trained medical staff to assist you"...Bulls***!"

Oh yes, I've heard that, too. I went to one convention in the past and i made her sit at the very back with me and the speakers looked like ants. Got nothing out of it whatsoever. We were a million miles away from the platform. But THAT is better than accepting "I have anxiety problems and I'd really rather not come along." I'm realizing that they really don't care about personal situations, it's what the organization requires that matters and that all important spiritual food.

"Problems have arisen at conventions when individuals with chronic health problems were left alone and became ill. "
Fantastic!

Thanks everyone for your comments. I'm just really down and needed that boost of confidence to call her up and say NO and mean it. As I said i tried that earlier and it didn't work, and then above all else i just wanted to know what purpose it serves for me to go but NOT go. I didn't want to sit here all night analyzing that weird suggestion so i thought I'd come where people know how JW's think because "Just come and be with us" instead of going to our brainwashing session actually looked like genuine interest and love there for a second.

125

Stupid suggestion from Study Conductor

by roxanesophia in

hi everyone, first i just want to say if it wasn't this forum, i'd be baptized!

i haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous jw.

she uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i need the org.

roxanesophia

Hi everyone, first I just want to say if it wasn't this forum, I'd be baptized! So THANK YOU for that.

I haven't managed to successfully end my studies with a zealous JW. She uses everything against me to brainwash me into believing i NEED the org. But I don't feel the love of the so called family and all their motives have become questionable. They're obviously desperate not to lose me and I don't know if it's out of love, or because they have to convert people. Everytime I have a problem it's the devil. This is only causing me even more damage because now I'm only convinced Satan is more powerful than God!

Anyway, the 3 day convention is coming up and Hitler my study conductor knowing I'm likely not to go the whole 3 days, arranged for us to stay in a motel with other JW's so I can't go home or decide not to go the next day. I told her I'm sick and really won't be able to do it. She fires back with there's first aid there, so no problem, "oh you'll feel so much better when you're there", Or you don't have to come to the convention, you can stay at the motel.

WHAT!? What is the damn point then of me being there if I'm just going to stay at the motel? Does it look GOOD on her if i go or something or reflect badly on her if I don't because I'M REALLY struggling to understand the logic. I told her I'd drive up on my own for one day and she won't hear of it. I just want to her to accept my "NO" but I'm so confused as to what she's thinking. Is it possible she likes me and wants my company? LOL. I'm a worldly person after all, hard to believe. I'd like to be friends with her but I know JW's don't work like that. I'm thinking it looks better for her if she can tell people she got me there but I'm sick at the motel instead of "she didn't come at all." I'm going crazy anaylyzing the situation and that stupid idea of going and sitting in a motel room instead of just STAYING HOME! She implies I'm in so much better care with them than i will be with my very non JW family at home.

But for some reason she wants to me to haul my sick ass an hour away and then NOT attend the convention if I don't feel like it. It's a really awful feeling not knowing what someone's true intentions are. Since she won't take "No" for an answer, I was thinking of using the waste of time to my advantage like:

-Going to the motel, not going to the convention (since she said it was OK!) and let her see me reading the KJV in the motel room and other religious books that I know JWs aren't allowed to read.

-Going to the convention in a bad mood and showing absolutely no interest and maybe after those 3 days of misery I won't even have to tell her I'm not studying anymore.

All other suggestions are welcome! I don't know what to do. On one hand I like her and the other I don't trust her enough to enjoy this weekend.