Posts by cobweb

To what extent is Christianity contingent on a belief in the book of Genesis. I know there are some Christians who accept that the creation story is a myth, and maybe the Adam and Eve story too. But that puzzles me. Surely the idea of original sin, that we needed to be redeemed by Jesus Christ are all based on the beginning chapters of Genesis? Disbelieve that and there is no foundation to the value put on Jesus supposed sacrifice as Paul described.

To me at least, the creation story, Adam and Eve and a talking snake are a bit of a weak fanciful idea to be the foundation of ones sense of personal salvation.

Goodreads members who liked Catherine Cookson also liked:

by cobweb in

jw
friends

the watchtower bible and tract society, apparently.. i wonder if this is a suggested approved reading list for jw's.. https://www.goodreads.com/author/similar/83837.catherine_cookson.

cobweb

The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, apparently.

I wonder if this is a suggested approved reading list for JW's.

https://www.goodreads.com/author/similar/83837.Catherine_Cookson

8

jw party goes very wrong.

by cobweb in

jw
friends

https://youtu.be/q6b77gm8xxi.

came across this audio recording on youtube which i found compelling.

an xjw recounts the story of how jws recently had a big party in the us.

cobweb

Sorry I didn't see it had been posted before. I know what you mean Slimboyfat. I kinda listening to it on that level - it is very salacious - but don't know whether to believe it or not. I found the second conversation with his wife authentic sounding. The idea of an ex jw crafting an audio play deception with fake hidden microphone etc is a bit bizzarre to me, but there does need to be external verification to treat it seriously.

8

jw party goes very wrong.

by cobweb in

jw
friends

https://youtu.be/q6b77gm8xxi.

came across this audio recording on youtube which i found compelling.

an xjw recounts the story of how jws recently had a big party in the us.

cobweb

https://youtu.be/Q6B77gm8XxI

Came across this audio recording on youtube which I found compelling. An xjw recounts the story of how Jws recently had a big party in the US. They all get wasted. A drunk jw brother leaves and drives his car over a drunk brother passed out on the ground and kills him. The first thing the JWs at the party do is call the elders. When the police come they lie about what happened.

The guy posting this recorded his jw wife secretly, telling him about this and it is ethically dubious that he has posted it on youtube. But its a screwed up story if true. Perhaps there is someone here that can verify it?

31

Latest Metal Detecting Find

by cofty in

now the harvest is underway up north i can get out for a walk with the metal detector in the evening.

i am lucky to live on a historic rural estate and i have permission from the landowner to detect.. this is a coin that popped up last night.

it was only about 2 inches deep and had been tumbling around in the plough soil for the last 750 years.. it is a silver penny of king henry iii.

cobweb

I loved the BBC comedy The Detectorists. I am thinking you are probably a fan also.

11

Benefits to Faith over Reason

by cobweb in

i wrote this earlier for my own benefit in order to get some thoughts straight in my head.

it is just my own personal pondering on what i think might be the motivating force behind having a faith.

it is not intended to attack, provoke or patronize anyone who has a belief and i hope it is not taken in that way.

cobweb

I wrote this earlier for my own benefit in order to get some thoughts straight in my head. It is just my own personal pondering on what I think might be the motivating force behind having a faith. It is not intended to attack, provoke or patronize anyone who has a belief and I hope it is not taken in that way. I come at this from the perspective of someone without Religious Faith and I am sure it will show.

Regarding faith in God: to suspend ones rational mind in order to believe in a supernatural benefactor where the evidence does not support it does not seem sensible to me. Yet people choose to do it. Why? There are bound to be many reasons but here is one reason I would like to consider.

Faith means giving up ones sense of self reliance, letting go of all doubt and this action sets off certain feelings in the brain that are powerful and very positive. Uncritical Faith is the pre-requisite for spiritual sensation to flourish.

This is what i think atheists such as Dawkins and Hitchens miss because they have not and would never suspend their critical faculties. The powerful effect of faith on a believer's state of mind is under-appreciated by those who have not experienced it. There is a calculation involved in putting Faith over Reason. It is a trade off and religious people make a different choice because they see greater value in the feelings that Faith provides. I do not think it registers as a conscious choice for the most part. I think there is an unconscious sense that 'this feels good' and 'this feels bad' and they are guided accordingly.

If I were to examine God or religion with a scientific mindset, I would rely on my own judgement - this immediately creates a mental state where spiritual feelings do not flourish - at least those associated with a belief in God. While it would be possible to come to a greater and more accurate understanding of how belief in a supernatural God developed over time and who, why and when religious texts about that God were written and changed etc - without some level of suspension of my skeptical mind, no spiritual feelings about that God would be present in me. It will merely be a subject of investigation like any other subject, such as History or Biology.

For me, I am satisfied with that to be the case for a number of reasons. I would rather sacrifice the spiritual feelings one can gain from religion because I do not want to suspend my critical faculties in order to get them. I would rather look at reality squarely in the face. I also think one can gain those same spiritual sensations elsewhere. But i can see why the notion of Faith in God continues to persevere even at a time when it seems like human kind know enough to move past it.

While I can see advantages for some people in choosing to believe in God, I do wish that it were possible to be more honest about the motivations. If someone were to say:

'I believe in God because it makes me happy and I enjoy the sensations i get from feeling spiritual' I am completely on board with that.

And even if they then say:

'I believe everything in the Bible as literally true because in order to maintain my spiritual feelings i must have 100 percent total faith in the entire paradigm otherwise those spiritual emotions will evaporate'

The trouble is that religious people tend not to explain it like that, even if it is the case. They do not acknowledge with self awareness, why they choose Faith over Reason. They insist there is a good rational explanation for their belief beyond the spiritual feelings they get from it. I think this is because to do otherwise would cause too much cognitive dissonance. Unfortunately this makes it difficult to have an honest conversation about what is actually going on in order for the non believer to appreciate the true motivation for their religious statements.

I could make a parallel to a couple who are very much in love and before they are to be married, they are advised to get a pre-nup. Rationally this seems the right thing for them to do, looking at the divorce statistics. But considering their loving relationship in those calculated terms would taint the emotion they feel. It accepts the possibility that they could split up which is at odds with their loving intentions and declarations. They deny the possibility because it creates cognitive dissonance.

In that situation, it is understandable to say: screw statistics, i love you, i believe in you. I have faith. Saying that amplifies the emotion. To do otherwise might be more sensible but have the opposite effect emotionally.

That is as far as I have got with it. I feel like I didn't quite get to a conclusion but I hope it makes sense.

8

The book of Jeremiah

by truthwillsetyoufree in

it occurred to me the other day that i don't actually know all that much about the bible.

dont get me wrong, i was a very dedicated and studious jehovah's witness and i studied the bible every day - or so i thought.

i have now realised that during the time i spent in that religion i didn't study the bible - i studied jehovah's witness theology.

cobweb

I recommend this series of Yale University lectures on the Hebrew bible. Watching them is a good way to understand the bible in a more detached way outside the JW indoctrination:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLh9mgdi4rNeyuvTEbD-Ei0JdMUujXfyWi

Lecture 19 covers Jeremiah I believe.

13

Goddard Resigns. A Big Blow to Justice In Britain

by Slidin Fast in

i seems that the child abuse enquiry in the uk has hit the wall again.

its a great pity.. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/04/child-sex-abuse-victims-say-inquiry-has-descended-into-farce-as/.

cobweb

A new person was appointed yesterday to chair the abuse enquiry. Her name is Alexis Jay, a social worker who has chaired an inquiry into child abuse before and has been a part of this inquiry from the beginning so she should be able to hit the ground running. There was talk after Goddard resigned that some of the aspects of the inquiry might be dropped but as far as I can tell it is all to carry on as before.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/aug/11/child-abuse-inquiry-prof-alexis-jay-to-take-over-from-lowell-goddard

24

Perfect Example of JW Dumbing Down

by thedepressedsoul in

just take a look at this video.

i think arguing or debating scriptures is the most pointless thing ever.

everything at their meetings are so basic with no explanation.

cobweb

my thoughts:

1) doing first call using a video is just ridiculous. why can't they just talk?

2) trying to find scriptures in the bible on a tablet just doesn't work well unless they are the pre-selected verses that you happen to have memorized. This video illustrates the problem pretty well.