one of the contributing factors to me leaving was the realisation we were being led by idiots.
bethel life reinforced that, middle aged ego's trying to suck up to brooklyn.
ray franz book was a final nail for me, because he described the same incompetence along with the same ego's.
There is no way I could be a JW now and not look at them and see the sham. It is so transparent.
These are men then want to be adored. The followers want security, health, a nice home and may miss dead loved ones. The leaders simply promise it and the game begins.....
one of the contributing factors to me leaving was the realisation we were being led by idiots.
bethel life reinforced that, middle aged ego's trying to suck up to brooklyn.
ray franz book was a final nail for me, because he described the same incompetence along with the same ego's.
One of the contributing factors to me leaving was the realisation we were being led by idiots. Bethel life reinforced that, middle aged ego's trying to suck up to Brooklyn. Why would it be any different there? Ray Franz book was a final nail for me, because he described the same incompetence along with the same ego's. The GB were described as untruthful and ill equipped.
The RC is making evident just how inexperienced and ..... this will sound mean, but.... uneducated, these leaders and 'teachers' are. They couldn't even keep up with the RC questions and points, constantly getting themselves lost in the defence of the GB.
The RC had the goal of protecting and representing damaged children so as to learn from it, these JW men have arrived to do battle ...and left found wanting.
Between the RC and JW broadcasting, I can't help but believe that they are showing the world their achilles heel. These men are not mysterious, godly men, with superhuman knowledge and spiritual experience.... they are in fact ...bumbling fools following the protocol in a flawed elders/branch book.
As for the GB such as AM 3rd, they have come across as draconian, backward , bullies. None of them are a leader you would vote for, they are obviously there from ego, ambition and Watchtower politics.
Do you find yourself surprised and amazed that we once held them in such high regard? Do you think their mistake of enjoying the limelight will be there own downfall?
so i was fooled by the witnesses.
what can i learn from that?
not to accept things at face value but to seek out opinion and different view points.. hence my question " do you believe man landed on the moon?.
My great uncle worked in Australia on the audio transfer from the lander to earth, whilst the USA was facing away from the moon. He listened in to the mission live.
i discussed it with him, I said I struggled to believe a live video transmission from the moon back then. After discussing it for some time we came to a mutual maybe that they got there but the video footage was not live.
Also I think SOME of the photos are doctored for PR, if not some being totally faked. The flag waving is not abnormal, the flag has a rod running through the top of it, without gravity it would move for longer not a shorter time.
joe rogan sent out a tweet earlier today that he is having steven hassan on his podcast.
this podcast goes live at 6pm est today (8/7).
watch it live: ustream.tv/joerogan.
wednesday 5 , day 7 live hearing.
case study 29, july 2015, sydney.
Wow, easily the most incredible thread on JW.net if not any forum on the whole Damn internet.
i have not meet all atheists, and it would be foolish for me to assume that all atheists, share the same prototypical view points.
i am inclined to feel that this classifies the views of a large percentage of atheists.
"atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.
There is a misconception here, that you are an atheist or agnostic. You can be both.
I'm agnostic about Bigfoot as we have yet to find credible evidence, I'm also a-bigfootist in beliefs ...,,as I don't think they exist.
As with he issue of God, we are all willing to change our mind with evidence.
I'm agnostic in stating as fact there is no God, but atheist in belief as there is currently no evidence.
i'm just listening to this so called doctors testimony.
where did the watchtower dig her up from.
her answers have mostly been maybe's and i think!.
Vivianne, I too was amazed when she stated something like ,,,.. "but I'm not paid to do that" .... When asked if she had ever criticised the JW's, it indicated her level of intelligence, her lack of insight into the unbiased roll of an 'expert' and just how cunning WT tried to be. The problem is, the smartest man with influence in the WT is peanuts to the intelligence, skills and efforts of the RC.
i am shocked that an expert would simply examine only the literature given to her by the organisation she was defending and simply accept it.
also the ease she has in making huge sweeping statements when comparing the jw's to all other international religious organisations simply undermines her professionalism.. i am also thoroughly shocked at her blatant, 'expert for hire', 'will defend anyone' apparent decision making, the organisation is responsible for covering up thousands of abuse victims by its own records, in australia alone!
never mind their judicial process being heartless and traumatic!.
As a JW in the 80's and 90's that a...
catholic
female
psyxhologist/social worker
......would represent GODS ORG ON EARTH in court and have access to all the elders/bethel letters and elders book etc, would be laughed out the kingdumb hall.
But it happened!
i have no idea where all the conspiratorial ideas that she is a secret JW or not qualified etc are coming from, but they are ridiculous. She works for a forensic investigator firm as an expert for hire, with a speciality in defence of child abuse management in organisations (in that she has chosen to represent largely defendants and specifically religious orgs), her life choices wouldn't be mine and I wonder how well she sleeps. The reality is bad enough without diluting this incident with baseless conspiracy nonsense. It sounds whacky and undermines what we say and do here,
https://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.
anyone know who this monty baker is?
i'm sure this guy will be able to tell the rc how things work behind the scenes without all the evasiveness, being that he is an "apostate".
Oubliette
Most JW's know of several child abuse incidents and know how few have reached police/court level. When I say 'things going on' I refer to all the doctrines, rules and JW going's on that clearly shocks him, like male only elders in committees, judicial comittees themselves! The obvious elder ignorance, the obvious hierarchy or power, the obvious lack of training the elders have in such issues. Bro Jones the painter and decorator should not be handling a judicial case of child abuse, doing 'fact finding' .........we all knew this was going on and it is obviously BONKERS.
It's why we left isn't it!? I can't believe people stay or adopt these beliefs and rules. The second I was of age and independence I was out of there.
https://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.
anyone know who this monty baker is?
i'm sure this guy will be able to tell the rc how things work behind the scenes without all the evasiveness, being that he is an "apostate".
Mephis, I'm in the UK, in fact Wales, where that happened. So I know it well.
I completly agree with you and assumed the same, but I worry that they will only deal with Austalian issues.
To be honest this can't end well for WT in that court room, whether that means anything in reality however, I'm not sure. I can imagine in 3 years time the results and laws made by the RC based on its findings may be causing issues with how the WT conduct judicial committees, but the WT will put it down to persecution and any adjustments will be thanks to the kind, loving new light arrangements from the gov body,
i have to say, the real responsibility is with parents raising children in this dangerous cult. Not one JW parent can deny knowledge of child abuse in the religion and its misuse and high prevalence. The JW's are a business shrouded in the disguise of s charity/religion. They are out there protecting their brand snd business model (doctrines) and as much as I despise them, I don't blame them in the sense of....that's what greedy predatory organisations do ( a scorpion will kill its prey and eat it, it's what they do). But if you knowingly raise your children in a predatory organisation, you need your head examining,
Imagine judge McCellan being given the opportunity to raise his kids in the JW's!? He just wouldn't do it! Yet the average JW knows far more than him about what goes on and simp,y ignores it.
Get out of this cult and get your kids out too!
