Posts by Jonathan Drake

22

How do flood apologists explain these?

by marmot in

10 years ago

spear points dating to thousands of years before the flood (or even adam's alleged creation, for that matter) found preserved in situ among mammoth bones in naco, arizona.. or the 14,000 year-old footprint of a child at a mammoth hunting camp unearthed in a bog in monte verde, chile:.

the kicker is that this isn't even the oldest evidence for human settlement of the americas.

since the wt loves to trot out frozen mammoth carcasses as "proof" that mammoths died in the flood, who were these mammoth eaters in north america?

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

Jonathan Drake
here is another one you could check out. Things like these are ubiquitous on the information superhighway we all call the net
http://ncse.com/cej/3/2/answers-to-creationist-attacks-carbon-14-dating

Thank you, that was very informative and I'm going to bookmark that page. I believe in evolution myself, but I hadn't researched this in particular. I have no idea why but I feel compelled to explain my feelings toward God and evolution at this point. I don't believe the earth to have been made in 7 literal days, I find it not out of the realm of possibility that God made everything over a much longer period of time than literal 7 24 hour periods, and that he used evolution to bring about life almost like an artist painting a mural if that makes sense.

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18

Why do Jehovah's Witnesses do this?

by runForever in

jw
friends

10 years ago

why do jehovah's witnesses as individual members readily think that apostates are having a sweeping mass delusion?

if some jw's have known you for a long time do they really think you based everything on some random delusion you randomly had instead of confirming the information?.

it's quite retarded even the bible itself is contradicting them in jeremiah about the 70 years.. i know some know, and some choose not to know but what about the rest?.

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

Jonathan Drake, while I can't answer for what the opening post means, I can comment on what you are asking. JW's are taught that the "machinations of the devil" are so slick and so powerful that, yes- apostasy can be just like a disease you can catch from someone infected by listening to their words.

Thats what I think he meant, I've not been accused of it yet but I'm sure it's coming. I was going to say that it really makes no sense, if that's what he meant. Everyone starts to doubt for different reasons, and most experiences (not all) that I've read involve a scriptural example of something that goes against a JW doctrine. Its like they are saying this "disease" comes from the bible itself on these occasions.

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18

Why do Jehovah's Witnesses do this?

by runForever in

jw
friends

10 years ago

why do jehovah's witnesses as individual members readily think that apostates are having a sweeping mass delusion?

if some jw's have known you for a long time do they really think you based everything on some random delusion you randomly had instead of confirming the information?.

it's quite retarded even the bible itself is contradicting them in jeremiah about the 70 years.. i know some know, and some choose not to know but what about the rest?.

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

Do you mean they think "apostates" all fall victim to the same delusion? Like its some hive mind of disagreement?

Im asking because I'm not sure I understand your post, and I have encountered people who think this - like "apostasy" is a disease and if you catch it you "think like one of them."

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22

How do flood apologists explain these?

by marmot in

10 years ago

spear points dating to thousands of years before the flood (or even adam's alleged creation, for that matter) found preserved in situ among mammoth bones in naco, arizona.. or the 14,000 year-old footprint of a child at a mammoth hunting camp unearthed in a bog in monte verde, chile:.

the kicker is that this isn't even the oldest evidence for human settlement of the americas.

since the wt loves to trot out frozen mammoth carcasses as "proof" that mammoths died in the flood, who were these mammoth eaters in north america?

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

The problem you radiocarbon deniers run into is that multiple dating methods are used to determine the age of these sites, such as uranium dating and stratigraphy and they all point to the same age.

Don't get me wrong, I don't know that much about radiocarbon dating. But I've asked the same question in your OP and this is what I got. And it is factual (this much at least) so at the time I accepted it, it led me to think that I had to choose between believing carbon dating or believing the flood happened. I know at least I did preliminary research and reading about this water damage point, but I still want to read more about it.

do you have any book, or article suggestions?

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40

Need advice on a comeback to my wife: when she is in cult mode she says faith without works is dead.

by goingthruthemotions in

10 years ago

so i have gotten into arguements with my wife in the past about this cult.

now a days after reading steve hassan books...i just try and avoid anything jdub with her.

try to keep her in authentic mode..(not sure she really has one).

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

I would try using the account beginning at Acts 9:36 about Dorcas.

Dorcas is praised in the bible for her, "fine works." But these works are clearly spelled out for us in these verses and they absolutely do not include preaching. Yet it was for these Christian works that she was praised in the bible, resurrected, and left as an example to follow in Christian works. Why, if the works only partain to preaching, would the bible leave us an example of works to follow that includes no preaching at all?

I've used this approach myself, and they never have an answer for me. So it must get them thinking.

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11

WT for March 15, 2015: “Consider the context”

by Doug Mason in

10 years ago

my study on the watchtower magazine for march 15, 2015 is available at:.

http://www.jwstudies.com/the_watchtower_and_the_contexts_of_jesus__stories.pdf.

this watchtower presents jesus stories at matthew 25: the ten virgins; the talents; and the final judgment (sheep and goats).

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

My greatest hope regarding this article is that witnesses will read the context of the cited verses in the article, "Loyally Supportimg Christ Brothers".

Every single scripture cited as proof of how we should all preach is out of context, context which re-asserted removes this requirement completely and shows that the requirement was only for the apostles and those who "ate and drank with Christ."

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11

A Tutting of Christians

by andrekish in

10 years ago

a tutting of christians:.

a tutting of muslims:.

a tutting of jews:.

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

Dude, you're spamming this forum and nobody is going to appreciate it.

why don't you step away from the computer, take a few deep breaths and address your anxieties, and come back with a real character and personality. (I mean this with all the tactful concern for your well being I can possibly muster)

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18

Watchtower Accused of Intellectual Dishonesty

by wannaexit in

jw
friends

10 years ago

watchtower never learns.. i applaud dr. singh for speaking out and his open letter to watchtower.

http://jwalumni.org/2015/01/17/rama-singh-awake/.

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

Yea, I hadn't had a chance yet to actually look up what it means to be intellectually dishonest. The post earlier defining it, and some research proves this is what they did.

Regardless of being a misquote or out of context, it's intellectual dishonesty and they should be held accountable.

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22

How do flood apologists explain these?

by marmot in

10 years ago

spear points dating to thousands of years before the flood (or even adam's alleged creation, for that matter) found preserved in situ among mammoth bones in naco, arizona.. or the 14,000 year-old footprint of a child at a mammoth hunting camp unearthed in a bog in monte verde, chile:.

the kicker is that this isn't even the oldest evidence for human settlement of the americas.

since the wt loves to trot out frozen mammoth carcasses as "proof" that mammoths died in the flood, who were these mammoth eaters in north america?

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

The way the explain it is with facts, such as water damage or exposure causing objects to date thousands of years older than the really are. This then implies, to me at least that, you must choose between believing or not with no reliable proof of either one.

The following is taken from a wiki page about carbon dating, and yes I know wiki isn't the best source of information; however, there are many other credible references to establish the effects water has on the objects being dated. So the conundrum becomes, if there was a flood, nothing pre-flood would date properly.

Other effects
If the carbon in freshwater is partly acquired from aged carbon, such as rocks, then the result will be a reduction in the 14
C
C/12
C
C ratio in the water. For example, rivers that pass over limestone, which is mostly composed of calcium carbonate, will acquire carbonate ions. Similarly, groundwater can contain carbon derived from the rocks through which it has passed. These rocks are usually so old that they no longer contain any measurable 14
C
C, so this carbon lowers the 14
C
C/12
C
C ratio of the water it enters, which can lead to apparent ages of thousands of years for both the affected water and the plants and freshwater organisms that live in it.[12] This is known as the hard water effect, because it is often associated with calcium ions, which are characteristic of hard water; however, there can be other sources of carbon that have the same effect, such as humus.[19] The effect is very variable and there is no general offset that can be applied; the usual way to determine the size of the effect is to measure the apparent age offset of a modern sample.[19]
Volcanic eruptions eject large amounts of carbon into the air. The carbon is of geological origin and has no detectable 14
C
C, so the 14
C
C/12
C
C ratio in the vicinity of the volcano is depressed relative to surrounding areas. Dormant volcanoes can also emit aged carbon. Plants that photosynthesize this carbon also have lower 14
C
C/12
C ratios: for example, plants on the Greek island of Santorini, near the volcano, have apparent ages of up to a thousand years. These effects are hard to predict—the town of Akrotiri, on Santorini, was destroyed in a volcanic eruption thousands of years ago, but radiocarbon dates for objects recovered from the ruins of the town show surprisingly close agreement with dates derived from other means. If the dates for Akrotiri are confirmed, it would indicate that the volcanic effect in this case was minimal.[19]

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5

Questions from a non-catholic

by Sir cid fatos in

10 years ago

hello guys.

since i have few jw friends i thought a lot of jehova witnesses.

they are all nice guys.

10 years ago

Jonathan Drake 10 years ago

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090203105013AAizkOL

As for for everything else you said, I suggest buying a Strongs indexed interlinear bible, vines dictionary, and strings concordance - find your own answers. keep a journal. Follow the direction vine outlines in the beginning of his dictionary (or was it strong.... Well one of them said it) which is to look for frequency and consistency in word use before asserting meanings. What harmonizes with the entire bible is likely the correct understanding of what is meant. (Per strong and vine)

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