Posts by stuffwotifink

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

So you were commenting because of something he said yesterday?
And you speak of relevance?

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

It is a cop-out. "some stuff is really complex so there must be some unknown god". Yawn...

That is neither stated nor implied in my comment.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

RE a definition: [Please remember, I don't believe in a god. But I think can speak on what you were asking, a little.]

The "god" that most people I have spoken to, seem to be speaking about when they discribe their often ill defined god concept, is obviously similar to the god of the gaps.
But these people are "Finding god in what they know, not what they don't know", to paraphrase Dietrich Bonhoeffer's famous objection to the god of the gaps. (Before I'm accused of describing that god.)
They may well be wrong, but it is still not the same as the god of the gaps, it's the very opposite.

It is abductive reasoning.
"Stuff looks designed, a designer explains this best".

Most deists don't go beyond that. (The rest is "who knows")
Oh, sure, an educated deist can wax lyrical about where they see design in biology or whatever. But the argument is pretty much "Stuff looks designed", however complex the phrasing gets.

And that is not stupid or steeped in fable.
One need only look at the fields of teleology and teleonomy.
Even the staunchest of materialist atheists in biology uses the terms "apparent design" and "apparent purpose" [or variations thereof].

It is simply a matter of opinion as to if there is the appearance of design because of a designer, or if the appearance is no more than an illusion due to human psychology.
Apophenia? Maybe, damned if I know.

Hence my confusion when some deists are scorned and mocked alongside those with bloated theologies and reduced gods. Not everyone believes because of some desperate scrabble for hope - some people just think there is a "god/maker" of some kind and make no further claims, as they are not pretending to know anything about the "maker/god" they think they have abduced from looking at the things that seem "made" to them.
This is perfectly logical abductive reasoning. However bad people think the conclusion it draws.
It's "inference to the best explanation", people just differ on what that "best explanation" for "apparent design" is.

If it doesn't seem like a strong argument, that's because it doesn't try to be an argument at all. It is simply a statement of belief and it seems a shame to lump these people in with biblethumping fuqtards, simply because they are honest enough to express what they think.

Jmo.
[Btw, you seem like a theological noncognitivist. If so, it seems odd to ask people to define something you don't think can be defined. If you are not a theological noncognitivist, feel free to ignore that remark. It was simply an impression I got from your previous posts, I'm in no way pinning the tag on you.]

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

To simply dismiss a claim as "irrelevant", would be (for the third time now) an argumentum ad lapidem. It would also be rude, and dishonest if a person knew what they were doing... Because, I dunno, someone had told them, more than once, in this very thread.
Jus' sayin'.

If someone posits a god with a personality you don't like. I dunno, let's say an asshole god. Your dislike of said personality is not a sound reason for disbelief.

I don't personally think it's reasonable to even provisionally accept the god concepts people posit, I've no desire to have such an overburdened and stuffed ontology. So I don't.
But your reasons given for dismissing said gods are nonexistent. If you are going to be so smug, do better. It is easy to justify your position, refusing to do so seems needlessly obtuse.

Unless you want to tell everyone how being "irrelevant to Viviane" or being an "Asshole" are obstacles to existence or logical possibility?
That'd be full-on fascinating.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

In any event, I hope you figure out what is causing your short man's disease and get over it.

Your attempt to use subtle misandry to minimize and belittle me was not unnoticed and frankly, is cheap and foolish...

You've the potential to actually know things.

lol, dat ego.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

Eh, I brand you the pumpkin queen of obfuscation and pedantry.
Live with it, pumpkin.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

So, when talking about the Abrahamic God "El" (who has been combined with the Canaanite God Yahweh), there is evidence that he is make-believe. I was just responding to that comment you made about avoiding making claims like that. Claims like that CAN be made once the theist defines which God they're referring to.

Certainly, very true.
After all, we do not simply lack a belief in the biblical God, we reject it as false and for good reasons.

Why use the word 'God' as all? What can you claim about this.... idea? Is it he? She? It? Them? A series of never ending responsible parties? The monolith from 2001? what is 'God'?

Because that is what the title of the thread asked about and what people are talking about. Am I expected to define what I mean differently to say, I dunno, everyone else commenting? Odd. Have you not used the word yourself in this thread??
And why would I claim anything about a deistic version of god? I don't believe in one.

Oh, and kindly refrain from telling me what I think.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

cappytan

I don't know how much of the thread you've read, but I have never been speaking about the god of classical monotheistic theology. Not once and I've stated so repeatedly.

If you didn't see that, no worries.
(I agree that the most reasonable position to hold in regards to Yahweh, is that He is a complete fiction. A position I'm happy to justify, if asked.)

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

stuffwotifink

Well, the problem is that you've neither the right nor authority to do that.

lolz
If authority is needed when asking people on an online forum to support their claims about reality, where exactly are you getting yours from, pumpkin?
You're funny.

23

How Jehovah's Witnesses could become a huge mainstream religion without harming people. Any thoughts?

by JWchange in

if jws did the following, i believe they would grow exponentially and become one of the largest 'religions' on earth : .

1. no more dfing or shunning......its up to your conscience who you like or don't like.

in the same way if i was catholic living in ireland, i wouldn't hang out with my neighbor if she was a drunk fornicator, just had an abortion, had a taliban boyfriend and also supported liverpool soccer club.

stuffwotifink

The only way they can survive is to water things down to the point that they almost cease to be a religion. Either way it's a win IMO.

Ha.
I can see it, 100 years from now.
Non-denominational chapels, full of people taking part in happiness and helpfulness rituals. And expressing a faith in the hopebuilding and happifying effect of their belief in the power of the idea of the concept of the undefined masculine energy of historical imagination...

Seems legit.