Posts by NeonMadman

9

Jesus as Jehovah's physical manifestation

by Rev BII in

isaiah 45:11thus saith jehovah, the holy one of israel, and his maker: ask me of the things that are to come; concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands, command ye me.

45:12i have made the earth, and created man upon it: i, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens; and all their host have i commanded.. apart from calling jehovah one here, it says that god made the heavens with his own hands.

jeremiah 27 says his outstretched arm.. note that the trinitarians switch platform in this situation.

NeonMadman

All though some cults have caused people’s death even today the crimes of the cults are minimal compared to what crimes the church and its followers still do. A single fascinating example is that they teach you can be christian and soldier at the same time!

The Bible teaches that you can be a Christian and a soldier at the same time. Read Acts 10. Cornelius was a soldier (which is what a centurion was) and became a Christian without abandoning his profession. Oh, I know the Watchtower reasoning - he must have stopped being a soldier, but if it were such an important issue, why is it not mentioned in the scripture? It's unfortunate that Watchtower doctrines are so twisted that they must add things to the Bible that are not there in order to make them work.

Actually, under the Watchtower's rules today, Cornelius would have had to sever all connection with the military before being allowed to be baptized. So even if we could argue that Cornelius must have stopped being a soldier (which we can't, because the Bible doesn't say so), the Watchtower's rules are shown, albeit in a small way, to be out of harmony with biblical example.

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

3

Adventism and the year day principle

by barry in

jw
friends

after reading the excellent post by farkel i thought i may be able to contribute.. this principle [year day] is held as a biblical principle by adventists, jehovah's witnesses and the worldwide church of god.

it is also rejected by most adventists scholars also administraters and members.. the nineth chapter of daniel is used by some to try to prove the existance of the [year day] as it is clamed that it foretells the comming of the messiah.

so is the year day necessary here?

NeonMadman

This principle [year day] ... is also rejected by most Adventists scholars also administraters and members.

Does this mean that the SDA interpretation of the 2300 days of Daniel 8:14 has been changed? That, of course, was the key prophecy that led to 1844 as the projected date for Christ's return, and was based upon the year-day principle. After Christ failed to return, 1844 was reinterpreted as the date for the heavenly sanctuary to be cleansed and the investigative judgment to begin. That was still being taught at least as late as the 1960's that I am personally aware of. Has there been a doctrinal shift since then?

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

31

Response from the Society

by Sirona in

jw
friends

i posted a while back with a copy of the letter that i sent to the society.

its at : http://www.geocities.com/lovelight75/socletter.htm.

here is the response.

NeonMadman

typical answer from someone influenced by the world sad soul u say jesus is not the saviuor even tho the bibles says so so all that extra crapola you spew means nothin but demonic proclamations have fun

Of course, the Watchtower also teaches that Jesus is not the savior, except in a very limited sense of the word; according to them, Jehovah is primarily the savior. So I guess that means that the Watchtower is spewing out "nothin but demonic proclamations," too. But then, we already knew that...

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

207

IS THE WATCHTOWER A FALSE PROPHET?

by You Know in

when jesus was on earth the devil approached him quoting scripture in order to tempt and entrap him.

it is no wonder then that the apostate angel would be behind the effort to use the scriptures against jehovahs people today in order to mislead them.

one of the most cunning and effective uses of scripture against us by satans agents is the charge that we are false prophets.

NeonMadman

The brothers were not predicting, but trying to understand Bible chronology and prophesy. They were not telling the reader what to believe, but to come to their own conclusions on the scriptures.

The statements that were made about the generation of 1914 were presented as "Jehovah's prophetic Word through Jesus Christ" and "the Creator's promise." If that is not 'predicting,' I don't know what is. And the Watchtower absolutely forbids Jehovah's Witnesses to 'come to their own conclusions on the scriptures.' Such is considered "independent thinking," and one who persists in it can be disfellowshipped as an apostate. JW's are expected to accept completely what is published by the "slave" class, and to "wait on Jehovah" if they disagree with it, saying nothing publicly, or even privately to other JW's. Many here can attest that these things are true.

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

207

IS THE WATCHTOWER A FALSE PROPHET?

by You Know in

when jesus was on earth the devil approached him quoting scripture in order to tempt and entrap him.

it is no wonder then that the apostate angel would be behind the effort to use the scriptures against jehovahs people today in order to mislead them.

one of the most cunning and effective uses of scripture against us by satans agents is the charge that we are false prophets.

NeonMadman

This statement is an exageration. Could you post all the blunders and then post all the Bible truths that they go right?

Here's a link to a list of several hundred "blunders":
http://www.freeminds.org/history/part1.htm
And remember, it only takes one "blunder" when claiming to speak in God's name to be a false prophet.

As for what they got right, uh, hmmm...well, they do teach that there is a God...

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

19

Robert - Cutting To The Bottom Line....

by hillary_step in

jw
friends

hello yk,.

trying to precis your long post, i quote the following:.

alan wrote : they declare that anyone who publicly disagrees with their opinions is also disagreeing with god, and therefore is an apostate.. yk replied : thats because they blaspheme god by denouncing those whom god appointed over his household.

NeonMadman

Of course Christ's presence is invisible. His coming and arrival is invisible too. Jesus is invisible. So the ridiculers ridicule the evidence of Christ's parousia.

This statement demonstrates that you are basing your understanding of matters upon Watchtower dogma rather than the scriptures. The Bible is clear in many places that Christ's return will be a visible event.

Mark 14:61,62: Again the high priest asked him, "Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed One?" "I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

Mark 13:24-27: But in those days, following that distress, "`the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.' "At that time men will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.

Matthew 26:63,64: But Jesus remained silent. The high priest said to him, "I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God." "Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied. "But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."

Matthew 24:29-31: "Immediately after the distress of those days "`the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.' "At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory. And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

Acts 1:9-11: After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight. They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. "Men of Galilee," they said, "why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven."

Revelation 1:7 Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen.

I am aware of all the sophistry used by the Watchtower in its attempt to demonstrate that the Bible does not mean what it says (as is so often the case with the Watchtower). However, the Bible is the Word of God, and I believe that it does mean what it says. Jesus' return will be a visible event.

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

207

IS THE WATCHTOWER A FALSE PROPHET?

by You Know in

when jesus was on earth the devil approached him quoting scripture in order to tempt and entrap him.

it is no wonder then that the apostate angel would be behind the effort to use the scriptures against jehovahs people today in order to mislead them.

one of the most cunning and effective uses of scripture against us by satans agents is the charge that we are false prophets.

NeonMadman

How does Jehovah notify his servants? It's through the Bible. That's what they were talking about. Nice try though.

Then in what sense does that constitute "special knowledge that others do not have?" All Christians have the Bible.

And if there is one thing the Watchtower has amply demonstrated it does not have, it's "advance knowledge about this system's end." If they actually knew anything about it, they wouldn't have to keep guessing about dates as they have for the last hundred years. So, again, by their own definition, the Watchtower proves that they are not God's servants.

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

62

How Long A JW ( Baptised )?

by hillary_step in

jw
friends

i frequently read on this board that somebody has 'been a jw for over 25 years' and then learn that they are in fact 25 years and three days old.. i am very easily confused, in fact i actually got inside a car of similar color to my own recently and spent at least five minutes with a furrowed brow trying to force my car key into its ignition, fortunately, i realised my error before i was arrested.

so, just to humor me, can you all post how long you were/are baptised jw's?.

thank you -- hs.

NeonMadman

Baptized in 1969.
Stopped going to meetings (mostly) in 1995.
Stopped going (absolutely) in 2000.
Never disfellowshipped or disassociated.

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

207

IS THE WATCHTOWER A FALSE PROPHET?

by You Know in

when jesus was on earth the devil approached him quoting scripture in order to tempt and entrap him.

it is no wonder then that the apostate angel would be behind the effort to use the scriptures against jehovahs people today in order to mislead them.

one of the most cunning and effective uses of scripture against us by satans agents is the charge that we are false prophets.

NeonMadman

Notice already that YK has faded from this thread, because he's in over his head here...

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

17

Injured at Bethel--then what?

by LDH in

jw
friends

for 'lookin' who stated in another thread that he was asked to leave bethel after 8 years because he was injured.. is there any form of worker's comp if you are injured at bethel?

is there any disability insurance if you are disabled?.

how does this whole thing work?.

NeonMadman

These are the exact quotes from the Bethel application before signing:

Any chance of getting scans of the actual application?

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan