Posts by Ucantnome

28

Reason why you didn't have the Heavenly hope, Anointed..

by James Mixon in

when i found out what was in store for those with the heavenly hope, no thank you.

i love you jehovah.

but i also love the fruits here on earth.

Ucantnome

when I got baptized if id said I had a heavenly hope my father and mother would have said I was just being a very naughty boy and I wouldn't get any pudding for a week or more. So I had an earthly hope.

57

How do we know JWs are wrong and how do we convince others JWs are wrong: logic versus persuasion

by slimboyfat in

we like to think we are logical and have good reasons for for our beliefs.

no more so than when it comes to our reasons for rejecting the truth claims of jws.

we reject their version of history, such as the date of the fall of jerusalem, because it doesn't agree with the historical evidence.

Ucantnome

How do we know that JWs are wrong

I understand that theologians argue about things. a JW that i have talked to although agreeing with me on some things felt in their opinion being a JW was closer to the first century. a theologian said to me that the early christians faith was more works based than today, maybe closer to the JW I thought.

57

How do we know JWs are wrong and how do we convince others JWs are wrong: logic versus persuasion

by slimboyfat in

we like to think we are logical and have good reasons for for our beliefs.

no more so than when it comes to our reasons for rejecting the truth claims of jws.

we reject their version of history, such as the date of the fall of jerusalem, because it doesn't agree with the historical evidence.

Ucantnome

for me it wasn't about whether they were specifically chosen by God it was about what I would/could do which was related to a personal experience regarding belief. Therefore coming to a site like this or talking to others or reading books would have made no impact on me. I assume there are others like me.

9

"Stay alive until 75"

by Sour Grapes in

this video speaks volumes about watchtower failed prophecies and hyped up dead end promises.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhn6zf1hl2a.

Ucantnome

A short while ago I had an elder from the local congregation of JW stop round at our house, he came in and we had a chat. The conversation came around to 1975 and he explained to me something along the lines of that some of the brothers and sisters had made too much of 1975 and their expectations and it was nothing to do with the Society and some thought they could borrow money and not pay it back etc. I offered to show him somethings regarding what was in print in the Watchtower and other publications regarding 1975 and how it relates to the Divine Plan of the ages, but he wasn't interested and left fairly quick. I don't think he had been born by 1975 and if he had been, he was a small child and not a witness at the time whereas I was.

I find that it is this sort of behaviour that is most annoying and not what was said at the time.

In the last day or so a photograph has emerged which shows my father in the very early 70's with his siblings they are smiling and having a drink. We believe that this is the evening where he gave away what would have been part of our inheritance. He/we would never need it. This wasn't because he was some spiritually weak person in the congregation, he had been a baptised JW for some years and served as a servant before the elder arrangement and then became an elder. He and my mother wanted to simplify their lives so as to have a greater share in the preaching and raising us with a view to pioneering which we later did. He was a man with faith, it wasn't for some personal gain that he simplified our lives and we lived on less and he gave away our part of our inheritance but it was to make use of the available remaining time to help in the preaching. Here are just a couple of quotes on faith.

Watchtower September 1st 1969 page 532.

'Jehovah has made many promises of things yet to occur, One may hope that such things will come to pass, but such expression may only be a whimsical wish, not real faith. Faith is more than just an expectation. It is expectation that is assured to such a degree that it is able to support , uphold and guarantee that what is hoped for will become a reality. This is the meaning of hypostasis, a word common in ancient papyrus business documents in reference to guarantees placed on the transactions.
...Substantially the words [hy.po’sta.sis and e’leg.khos] mean that faith gives to things future, which as yet are only hoped for, all the reality of actual present existence,; and irresistibly convinces us of the reality of things unseen and brings us into their presence.” The Expositor’s Greek Testament, Vol.IV page 352.

Watchtower July 15th 1961 page 423
‘And since faith is also “the assured expectation of things hoped for,” it follows that we must also have knowledge of what are the things we may and should hope for. Again, God’s Word provides us with the needed knowledge. It assures us that paradisiac conditions will be restored to this earth, and that on a world-wide scale, and that this restoration work can be expected to begin within the present generation.’

Now my father is dead and Armageddon didn't come in the 70's and so are his siblings that generation of the family passed away as did his father my grandfather who fought France in the First World War and that is why I'm irritated when someone who wasn't in the 1970's there tries to tell me how it was.

I am reminded of the scripture in the NWT Romans 11:11

'For the Scripture says: None that rests his faith on him wil be disappointed."

I think my father felt some disappointment phoning me up whilst he lay dying in his bed still talking of Armageddon in his lifetime.

33

A sucker is born every minute

by Sour Grapes in

i was an elder in the 1970's and i was not a big fan of the "stay alive until 75" dogma.

i was looked down upon by the heavy hitters on the body of elders and in time i changed my mind.

i knew of the failed prophecy of 1914 being the end of all times which was repeated for the year 1925...yet i came to believe well maybe this time they've got it right.. with every new watchtower, i combed over every word to find support for my change in my belief that the end was coming in fall of 1975. at the district assembly in 1975, everyone clung onto every word in the final talk.

Ucantnome

I think that prior to the Watchtower being published Pastor Russell believed that 1914 would be the end of the gentile times. I find that I cannot prove that from God's viewpoint this did not happen

I believe the Witnesses view 1919 as the birth of the nation and we find there are millions of JW since then and the anointed going to heaven from that time forward, I cannot prove hasn't happened.

We do find them claiming to be anointed and commissioned to engage in the witness work of the events of 1914 which they do on a worldwide scale supposedly in fulfilment of Matthew 24:14, I believe.

No doubt many realize that the king isn't wearing any clothes, but they dare not say one negative word because they would rather believe in a lie and stay in the congregation rather than believe the truth and be set free.

So although like you I was there in 1975 and our family had simplified our lives and I was pioneering and today I no longer attend the Kingdom Hall or engage in the work. I feel I am no longer convinced of the message we preached but do not feel that I can comment on whether they are anointed or were commissioned in 1919 I therefore can understand that some maybe convinced of this even though they recognize some errors of the past.

70

If you believe in nothing, then how do you know JW's are wrong?

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

many who leave the witnesses go on to affirm other recognisable sets of beliefs.

some become christians of various sorts, others tend toward patriotism as a kind of rejection of the anti-patriotic stance of the watchtower, while yet more simply affirm in general the secular values of mainstream society.

do you believe jehovah's witnesses are wrong?

Ucantnome

no looter they maybe right but I'm not convinced

46

"You will never grow old in this present system of things" -- some campaign tools

by FatFreek 2005 in

i am approaching 76 years old.

i can clearly recall that awake!

statement and similar during the pre-1975 hype -- "staying alive in '75", et al.

Ucantnome

I cry inwardly for those who bought in to that influence, giving themselves permission to take the easy way out as to advanced education.

I didn't find being a regular pioneer an easy way out

My children went to university and one has a phd and recieved an award for it being the best in the university. I know what they did and I know what I did.

70

If you believe in nothing, then how do you know JW's are wrong?

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

many who leave the witnesses go on to affirm other recognisable sets of beliefs.

some become christians of various sorts, others tend toward patriotism as a kind of rejection of the anti-patriotic stance of the watchtower, while yet more simply affirm in general the secular values of mainstream society.

do you believe jehovah's witnesses are wrong?

Ucantnome

Do you believe Jehovah's Witnesses are wrong?

for me it's more to do with being asked to join with them in the preaching and not being able to do so anymore as I cannot justify the message.

whether they are right or wrong isn't why i left.

11

Planning ahead for the desires of the flesh.

by Xanthippe in

i've just booked some cinema tickets for later today and also ordered a book i want to take on holiday.

from nowhere that scripture they were always quoting at us came to me, something about don't be planning ahead for the desires of the flesh.

you always had to be planning spiritual, theocratic stuff, entertainment and pleasure were a bit dodgy, better not tell anyone.

Ucantnome

we were just reminiscing about the years I never took a day off from work other than Christmas as I was raised with the viewpoint vacations were wrong, materialism.

29

"Inactive" non Attenders, how much power do the JW's have over YOU ?

by Phizzy in

i was thinking about this because of the constant reminders we get in posts that we inactive non attenders have to be careful what we say to jw's, and what we do that they may learn about etc, if we don't wish to be before a j.c. the power they have is limited by what we give them.

now, i do not wish to be declared df'd of da'd, it would kill my old mum i think.. but i refuse to live my life looking over my shoulder, that, in my opinion, is giving them too much power.. i openly vote, i openly donate blood, i enjoy the odd cigar etc etc.. how much power do you allow them to have over you ?.

Ucantnome

more than i like. I work at killing the emotion.