Posts by nevaagain

21

Finding time

by Jordandemm in

jw
friends

is it possible to full time pioneer while working a full time job without making up the hours?

i know of a brother who recently got married too a pioneer the guy was really desperate to get married because his wife despite her many 'spiritual credentials' has very few christ-like qualities unfortunately, anyway that's besides the point.

he is a pioneer now and i'm sure he will be a ms soon the organisation likes that type of stuff the 'pioneer couple' so it shouldn't come as a surprise.

nevaagain

I have a ton of those counting time stories, especially with pioneers. Someone told me, you have to find creative ways of counting time or else you are not going to make your hours as a pioneer. And thats the problem. They value a number on a field report more than the actualy quality of field service.

So there was a pioneer who i frequently went to service with and the first thing he did after FSM (probably even before) was to drive to a near supermarket parking lot and try to place a tract. Afterwards we would drive to his territory, which was a 30 minute drive or probably longer.

Then another sister told me about the "pioneer shuffle" That is, walking as slow as possible and stop to enjoy the wonders of Jehovahs creation (no joke) and its best if you do it during service hours.

The best thing was, what I experienced with a young pioneer. He wanted to count our break, so he placed a magazine on the table in the restaurant. Funny thing is, he chose the table which was the farthest away possible and also we were the only ones in the restaurant.

But I also experienced pioneers who wanted to make their hours in a honest way, but they didnt last long being pioneers.

Everytime someone tells me that pioneering brings joy and comfort and is the best life style, i ask them why do many pioners stop then not long after the pioneer school (which is after one year of pioneering), if it is the best life style?

33

Question about visiting bethel ... akward moment at the end

by nevaagain in

jw
friends

since there a couple of ex-bethelites here, and a lot of people from the greater ny area who have probably visited the bethel in brooklyn and patterson many times, maybe they can shed some light into this curious question we (my wife and me) have for awhile.. so a couple of years ago, we happaned to be in the states and also went to visit the bethels in brooklyn and patterson.

we had the full package, what i mean is, not only we took the tour, but we also had someone to invite us for lunch.

while we wanted to enjoy our stay there, there was always a weird feeling being there.

nevaagain

Since there a couple of ex-bethelites here, and a lot of people from the greater NY area who have probably visited the Bethel in Brooklyn and Patterson many times, maybe they can shed some light into this curious question we (my wife and me) have for awhile.

So a couple of years ago, we happaned to be in the states and also went to visit the Bethels in Brooklyn and Patterson. We had the full package, what I mean is, not only we took the tour, but we also had someone to invite us for lunch. While we wanted to enjoy our stay there, there was always a weird feeling being there. A lot of secrecy (the tour included only the boring places) and the lunch with all the rules about who sits where and who gets the food first was also very weird. And we definitely were happy when we were out...

Anyway like I mentioned before. In both places, Brooklyn and Patterson we had someone who invited us for lunch, so at the end when they took us outside, there was an akward moment of silence, after we all hugged and said bye. Like the other party was waiting for something. Maybe an envelope of cash, or some other present? We only thought about it, because it happened on both occasions.

So is this maybe a custom, that you give the bethelite something in return, after you got invited by him for lunch?

Anyway we are already planing another visit to NY, but bethel will not be part of our visit.
(Fun fact, the sister/friend who invited us last time to stay at her home, signaled that she stopped associating with jws)

75

How did you feel when you found out "the truth about the truth"?

by stuckinarut2 in

jw
friends

so when you first found out specific facts about the organisation, how did you feel??.

the un membership.

the way 1914 was calculated from pyramid measurements.

nevaagain

I am a born in, so i was indoctrinated from little age. But I always knew, something is fishy, I just was too young to do my research and rather went with it. Something which never made sense, was the calculation to get to the year 1914. Also "the truth" would not need to fear apostate material. I bet, even if someone didnt know about any apostate material, or didnt care to read them, after mentioning it so often in the magazines, some would be curious enough to read it.

So even though reading CoC was a big reveal, finally everything made sense.

So to this day, I am a member of a group which is led by a few men who claim to be god’s sole channel of communication on earth, but I the truth here is that god doesnt know anything about it.

24

Df brother in shock I spoke to him at kh

by poopie in

jw
friends

i was vis it in a kh last night and i just thought i try something new.

when amen was said i bolted out hall low and behold there was anot her poor soul just ahead of me so since he did not know me but i knew he was df i said a greeting to him he seemed greatabsolutely shocked and horrified thst i was speaking to him he acknowledged my greeting and scurried off in t i the night it was a great moment for humankind..

nevaagain

when I was little like 7 years old there was a disassociated person in our hall but for a reason she came early. Anyway i greeted her like I would greet anyone. I remember my parents telling me not to do that and in fact dont even speak to her, because she was disassociated. Even after my parents councel, I still made a point everytime to greet and talk to her because I guess I didnt want to treat her any different.

34

Gas Pump "Witnessing"....Is this a thing?

by Bob Loblaw in

i've seen this twice now within a month.

a car group hanging out at a gas station.

one of the cult members jumps outs of their car and runs up to a "worldly" gas pumper, arm stretched out, tract in hand, and here comes the juvenile at best question.

nevaagain

In my former congregation a brother and me used to do something similar. We would take the teritories that would be the farthest away from where we lived. Sometimes up to a two hours drive. We would then make the occasional stop on a highway restaurant and would witness to the truck drivers making a stop there. This way we counted the whole jurney. btw he was a pioneer ;-)

On the topic of time counting and pioneers. I once went with a pioneer in service and at the end we got hungry so we went into a fast food restaurant. He got his food first and went straight to the table which was the farthest away from the entrance. Also in the fast food restaurant there were almost no other customers. What did he do? He put a watchtower out on the table and was counting time! Nobody passed our table!!! NOBODY! But he still counted the one hour. I made a comment to him about that, but some pioneers are so arrogant, a normal publisher cant tell them anything.

I am still a witness, so everytime someone tells me I am not making enough hours, I tell them stories like these from pioneers and shut them off.

15

Did you know that Satan bump nesties with Eve.

by James Mixon in

some christians explanation for evil in the world.

i came across this "serpent seed".. it claims that cain was the offspring of eve and the talking serpent (sorry i'm lmao while.

writing this) that christians much later identified as satan.

nevaagain

wouldnt that mean that we are all offspring of cain and thus satan?

6

Larry

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

in the congregation where i grew up, the witnesses converted this 20-something young man.

he was very strange, lived in a very shady apartment, and he couldn't afford a car, so he rode his bike around the whole area, which was very strange for our rural part of the country.

according to larry, he came from quite a wealthy family in the country he was from.

nevaagain

I think something similar has happaned to almos every congregation and it happaned to my home congregation as well a couple of years ago. Without mentioning too many details, this is a foreign speaking congregation. So there is this woman with a kid coming to our congregation. She hasnt been baptised yet, but among the help she is seeking (money, work and somebody to look out for the kid) she also wants to "continue" her bible study. After awhile and after the fact that she got all the help that she needed and after getting invited to all the get togethers with free food, she hooked up with a worldy guy and we never saw her again. I also was a lot younger when it happaned so thats why I dont have all the details to the story but this shows that JWs are very gullible. When the prospect of a new recruit arrives, everything is forgotten.

22

A lot of "forbidden" talk is going on among witnesses

by nevaagain in

jw
friends

me and my wife are still "in".

we had the "talk" a couple of times, but shet is not ready to leave yet.

while a couple of years ago she started crying on the thought that i am an "apostate" and even gave me an ultimatum until she would rat me out to the elders (never happened), now i sense that she might is a little bit more open to the the thought to leave one day .... anyway, all out friends and family are still in the truth and whenever we are meeting with other witnesses topic #1 is always the recent changes to the meetings / conventions (reduced to one day) which always lead to the changes to the magazines and the recent lay offs of the special pioneers and bethelites.

nevaagain

Me and my wife are still "in". We had the "talk" a couple of times, but shet is not ready to leave yet. While a couple of years ago she started crying on the thought that I am an "apostate" and even gave me an ultimatum until she would rat me out to the elders (never happened), now I sense that she might is a little bit more open to the the thought to leave one day ...

Anyway, all out friends and family are still in the truth and whenever we are meeting with other witnesses topic #1 is always the recent changes to the meetings / conventions (reduced to one day) which always lead to the changes to the magazines and the recent lay offs of the special pioneers and bethelites.

Most sense that something is not right but still try to justify the changes somehow. Whenever the layoffs are mentioned I always say that its probably a money issue since this topic is always mentioned on the jw broadcast. Then I wait for the question, why is there a sudden need for money which then I carefully mention the lawsuits resulting from child abuse and the Australian Commission hearings. Couple of months ago we had the CO visit our place and for that visit he had the substitude and his family with him and the substitute mentioned the Australian Commission hearing in front of the CO, so I recite him and the CO as the sources to that ;-)

With my parents and especially my elder father the lawsuits are a non topic. He doesn't care about none of that, and for him its always lies and apostates wanting to do "us" harm. Since my father loves to read watchtower magazines and books and often the watchtower literature is not enough which leads him to study spiritual material from the christendom, he often comes at a different conclusion than the watchtower. He keeps this to himself and only get it out of him on our little talks. I then tell my dad that even though its fine for him to read worldy book consisting of spiritual matters, a JW would never be allowed to write such a book because it would be regarded apostacy. This got him thinking ...

Also my dad saw the 1975 fiasco first hand and I always tell them, that for me that was false prophecy and recite the scriptures Matthew 7:15 and 2 Corinthians 11:13-15. So we are having "apostate" conversations whenever I am visiting and I see that my dad kinda enjoys them until my mom steps in of course.

So yeah I am trying to hang in there until the proper times comes to prepare for a smooth exit and see that I get some of my family out :-)

54

What would you do if the Society Declares Bankruptcy

by Quarterback in

jw
friends

special pioneers let go.

bethel workers laid off.

construction halts, what's next?

nevaagain

I dont want to rain on your parade guys but I dont think the WTS will declare bankruptcy ever! If you think about it, whare are their expenses? Printing and paying for bethelites and special pioneers. What did they just do a couple of weeks ago? Announced that they will reduce the magazine and lay off bethelites. So before they declare bankruptcy they will just lay off everybody not essential for putting and translating the magazines/literature and go full digital. They will just let the rank and file know that from now on they have to print the magazines themselves for service and just use digital literature for meetings. They could also ask the congregations for more money.

So the recent measurements taken were probably already to prevent bankruptcy.

Plus it is already known ammong witnesses that the WTS wants to put 4 congregations into each hall. That means there is a lot of real estate to sell. More congregations supporting a hall while assuming the same contributions for hall maintenance and the world wide work would still come from the rank file, more money for the WTS since the maintenance bill would get shouldered by more ppl. I hope I am making sense here.

71

Doing the Right Thing, Making a Choice (shunning)

by Simon in

jw
friends

continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.

so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.

if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.

nevaagain

My best friend and also my best man at our wedding got disfellowshipped some years ago. I wanted to show him that I am not shunning him so I sent him various msges (we dont live in the same city anymore) but he never replied back, only when he got reinstated one year later. I never asked him why he never replied back ... but i still found it rather odd that someone disfellowshipped also upholds that rule.