Posts by nicolaou

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Horsefeathers. First because false premise assume evolution

No. All the available evidence proves evolution. Proves, not assumes.

substances such as justice, love, kindness, etc., exist on their own and didn’t evolve

Again, no. Social evolution and the development of a sophisticated brain with complex cognitive abilities pretty much explain these 'higher' qualities.

Reciprocal altruism and group transmission would ensure the long term survival of the species so it's really not difficult to understand how and why these traits emerged and survived. Look at any animal with a complex enough brain. Elephants, chimps, whales etc. Look at the emotional bonds between parent and offspring.

If you can't see how love evolved you are blind.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Morality is a product of evolution just like everything else. In parts it's messy, fluid and open to debate but at the core is something that all primates have learned over millions of years.

Protect your group.

It's so simple a monkey can understand it.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

God made everything. He has every right to do as he pleases with his own creation

I can imagine Josef Fritzl making a similar defence. There's an awful lot of word salad in this discussion but ultimately you either condemn someone for failing to save a life or you don't.

It's no defense to say that we can't understand the mind of god. We do understand that it's wrong to let a child die when it could have been prevented.

Argue all you like that it's not as simple as that but in so doing you lose the moral high ground.

Christians (and Muslims etc) regularly denounce atheists as having no moral code. Well you know what? We aren't the ones worshipping and defending the atrocities of a child killer.

You are.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

I was a child!!! Where was this supposed help?

Listen to this plea from the heart and feel ashamed if you dare to try excusing God for failing to lift a finger.

I don't know your story Lee and won't ask you to share anything you don't want to but I can imagine. I hope you are doing well now.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Try taking Jesus at his word. Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father. That is all we need.” Jesus replied: "Philip, I have been with you for a long time. Don't you know who I am? If you have seen me, you have seen the Father."

John 14:8,9 Contemporary English Version

I really would like the Christians on the forum to engage here. Doesn't it bother you that Jesus aligns himself with the child killing God of the Old Testament/Hebrew Scriptures?
The moral gymnastics you have to perform to maintain your view of Jesus as the 'Good Shepherd' surely betray an unwillingness to see the obvious for what it is.
Don't forget I've been where you are, most of us here have.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Cofty: Then there is no possible excuse and the person is morally responsible for a child's death.

I agree. That's the only conclusion I can arrive at.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

You assume correctly.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

Stan, I'm not ignoring parental responsibility, guilt can lay with several individuals all at once, it's the inaction of the observer I'm asking about.

Whether anyone else has failed to care or not would you be guilty if you'd failed to act?

Slim', you have of course seen where I'm going with this so c'mon, give me a good reason for God's failure to act?

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

There's no reason for inaction Cofty. Acting to prevent the child's death would incur no penalty or injury to you.

And I understand what you say about legal liability but put that to one side, it's just the moral responsibility I'm interested in.

168

Moral responsibility.

by nicolaou in

no subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where i'm going with this.

please consider the following scenario.. you're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train.

a high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge!

nicolaou

No subtlety here, it's going to be obvious where I'm going with this. Please consider the following scenario.

You're seated on a railway platform bench waiting for your train. A high speed intercity is about to hurtle through without stopping when you see a small child running to the platforms edge! Thankfully, disaster can be averted. You don't even have to get up off the bench, just put out your arm and scoop up the child.

But you don't. You watch as the little boy falls onto the tracks and is pulverised by 185 tonnes of metal.

My question. What responsibility do you bear for the child's death?