Posts by WireRider

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

Please show us that.

Google "sumerian tablet showing solar system"

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

ie god does not exist

And that's what people argued about the atom with no contrary proof. Then they proved it. It is a good example.

I never suggested anything about the nature of "something". I never suggested "supernatural". I think you have been feed a real load in the past about the nature of a "something". I never suggested that a supernatural being is going to help you change a tire or help advance science or help us discover natural science around us or help any life situations. That's completely overblown by organized religions to make you dependent on them. For all I know "something" probably stopped by, perhaps some genetic engineering, and moved on. (although if you believe the stories, it took several tries and had to keep wiping everything out and starting over) (personally I think we may have been engineered as slave labor - many people still have remnants of wanting to be a slave for no reason - and all those churches trying to keep the herd in line for a return - but that's a whole different discussion) I doubt they would stay to babysit the minutia in our lives. Were here - it's up to us to figure it out. "something" may be here or not or may come back someday.

If you would like - prove to me that "something" does not exist.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

You've yet to show me there is a god we don't understand.

That's a bit circular. I'm afraid you misunderstand me. I have made to attempt to claim/prove a God is real. I claim no tangible or empirical proof. But then again God cannot be proven to not be, or have been, real either.

Is the atom worthless and pointless? A couple of hundred years ago people said it didn't exist - they argued about whether it existed or not - they couldn't prove it either way. "Prove it". Where was the science and definitions then? We grew and learned, and now have particle theory that was once considered a joke, for lack of the right science and understanding.

No one doubts the contribution of science for society. Science is not worthless. Where will science be in 100yrs. I can't prove life exists on other planet - science and technology are not there yet. But I can say I have some degree of confidence base upon the context.

There was a Sumerian tablet uncovered by archaeologists that dated back to some 7000BC. On the tablet was an imprinted picture of the solar system with orbits. It also included Pluto. ?? Even though it has been there the whole time, our science didn't discover/prove it until about 1930.

I'm not saying that anyone has to believe in a God, or follow one if they did - but I'm not closing the door. What if they closed the door on the atom because they didn't understand it? Or life on other planets?

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

First show me any proof that any god exists, then we can discuss all gods.

(see my post above) I don't think there is any proof that humans can comprehend or have the words to describe. Human science is worthless here. Can you not fathom a being greater than humans that may be millions of years beyond our knowledge? As a scientist you cannot rule out the possibility of something just because you cannot understand it, don't have words for it, and cannot measure it. The possibility still exists. It would be arrogant to think otherwise.

I don't claim to know or have proof of "something" we don't understand. I'm still looking for answers myself. My point was that if you look at sociology and some of the biology there are too many coincidences to just write off something we don't understand. Is the want of religion, or a higher being, genetic? Running from something is pretty universal - what about the compulsion to run towards something we cannot even see? Why were the same fundamental traits of the need of religion, or for example pyramid building, happening all over the world at nearly the same time? "something" happened - I know not what.

I don't think there is really any proof required - it's really academic. I don't know if "something" was here, or if it left? But one trait is obvious - a lot of people do believe - real or not - and that shapes socio/economic behaviors and a lot of bloodshed.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

What if ALL Gods are the same one - perceived in many ways according to the individuals beliefs and filters? Would kind of suck if we found out that the Christian and Islamic and Hindu and Aztec and Mayan etc - all turned out to be the same "something" - as they interpreted it - and had so many useless wars in the name of "their" God.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

I believe in "something". Something that is still beyond any definitions we have. I think the gaps in evolution more recently, happened by something. If you look are the world, virtually every culture has a "something" story that compels them to gather and for lack of a better word, worship. Cultures that never could have had communicated at the time have very similar ideas of "something".

I think there was genetic manipulations of species. Perhaps in a petri dish sort of way. When under a PET scan (or which ever) certain isolated areas of the brain light up when devote religious people pray. Ironically it was found that the same isolated areas light up when you show a addict pictures of drugs. Go figure. What compels people to have a slave mentality, that is very universal? Built that way? Programmed into genes?

I believe in "something". But not in any conventional way - and certainly not as organized religion tries to TELL me how. I don't need to pray to "something". I don't need to serve or be a slave to anyone. But ... I would like to take a walk with "something" some day. I have a few questions.

I reject the non-believers of the Trinity, and I think the people that do believe are seriously limiting themselves to what "something" is. "something" could separate into a million parts, each equal and the same being, inhabit everyone at the same time, and then merge and make it home in time for dinner as still the same being. Why is that so far fetched. Created the world, genetically created millions of planets and species - yet people still think of "something" with only human traits they can understand? We have yet to understand "something" and have no words that can be used.

What really burns me are humans that claim to speak with "something" and be their representative. TO USE GOD". I give a resounding Bullshit. It drives people away to have humans claim to be in control FOR God. "God wants us to do that" - "Jesus wants us to do this" ..... Really - you had a conversation with God lately? Give me his phone number. How do you know he picked YOU to run my life in his name? Organized religion is organized blasphemy. I don't care how nice your office looks.

98

My Opinions on whats going on in WT land - Insider Information

by thedepressedsoul in

first off, i'd like to state that i currently have "privileges" in the congregation and volunteer at bethel on and off throughout the year.

that's as much information as i will currently give about myself.. starting off, i think something big is coming in the form of lawsuits and bad pr.

they seem to be batting down the hatches in preparation for something the last few years and even more so the last few months.

WireRider

Was this the impetus to "forgive" mortgage loans in favor of committed donation rates? To plan mass sales?

22

How accurate is the Bible?

by WireRider in

how accurate is the bible?

the "compiled" version (council of nicaea) was not established for hundreds, or even thousands, of years after events happened.

stories were handed down generation to generation to generation before being written down.

WireRider

I think if you read the entire Bible you would walk away a better person for it. What I don't get is all the propaganda that quotes a verse and think that undoubtedly proves the point, and usually if you look it up and read the chapter in context - it had nothing to do with the point. You must obey the JW, because this verse says so. The world is wicked, that verse says so. And we are chosen because if you take this verse and that one and put them together - the "Bible" says so.

I'm sure if I said "No religion should ever hold a service inside of a building, never after midnight, and always serve fish - or you will be banished for not obeying". I'm sure I could cherry pick a dozen verses from wildly various books to prove what I say is true.

22

How accurate is the Bible?

by WireRider in

how accurate is the bible?

the "compiled" version (council of nicaea) was not established for hundreds, or even thousands, of years after events happened.

stories were handed down generation to generation to generation before being written down.

WireRider

How accurate is the Bible? The "compiled" version (Council of Nicaea) was not established for hundreds, or even thousands, of years after events happened. Stories were handed down generation to generation to generation before being written down. Scrolls were copied over and over again - by people - capable of mistakes, establishment, redaction, plain changes. Translations of translations. Books describing personal experiences with Jesus were not written down for hundreds of years.

Historians date Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John as having been written between 250 and 300AD - and not by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. How did matters of private conversations with Jesus and other disciples accurately, verse by verse, and word by word, get to the Bible?

Yet everyone seems to get very involved with citing books, chapters, and even words to advocate their personal beliefs or argue against someone else's belief/practice. Can we really argue about things like "to become" vs. "will become? Really?

Can a "religion" just cherry pick random verses from the Bible and tell people YOU MUST OBEY - SEE THAT WORD SAYS SO IN THE BIBLE. Really? What if someone coping a scroll in 245AD, just changed a line because it sounded better? What if they missed a word, line, page?

Don’t get me wrong - I have a lot of respect for the Bible, it's meaning, and its' effect on the whole planet. But I don't see how cherry picking singe verses, usually complete out of context, can used to argue for/against anything or be used to control people and make them obey human people. If you want to make a case, quote entire chapters or books.

6

Who the heck was Arius?

by Will Power in

re: previous discussions about the should you believe in the trinity brochure.. i found it surprising that the "truth[tm]" about the history of this little doctrine just plum forgot to include any reference whatsoever to arius, one of the main characters in the story.. there is much to read on this guy & his movement.. arianism - a heresy of the early christian church relating to definitions of the human or divine status of the person of jesus christ, was the first important doctrinal difficulty in the church after the legalization of christianity took place under emperor constantine i. .

arius was a priest of the catholic church in alexandria, egypt.

in a.d. 321 he was condemned by a synod at alexandria for teaching a heterodox view of the relationship of jesus christ to god the father.

WireRider

I don't understand why the JW uses the "Bible". They are followers of Arius. Russel took interest in a long dead religion and thought he was onto some secret no one else knew. But when Arius exposed his view rejecting the believe in the Trinity - he was not only thrown out of the Council of Nicaea, but banished from the region. This left the bishops to choose from a 100s of gospels/books, they deemed worthy, to organize the New Testament with everything in alignment with the Trinity Doctrine. Everything revolves around the Trinity.

So why do the JW follow Arius when he was the one guy thoroughly kicked out of the "Bible creation/making committee" - all his papers ordered to be burned - banished - but they still use book? The Bible itself is a condemnation of the Arius/JW beliefs - that's they way it was put together intentionally.

I think it is also important to know history. Know where your religion comes from. And to know how the Bible was really created - as a political book to solve local unrest.