Posts by WireRider

59

Why don't you do anything?

by WireRider in

i'm not jw, so i see this all standing up and very clear from an outsider perspective (i am still seeking my path).

i joined the blog a few weeks ago.

i dated a divorced jw (jw from birth) for a couple of years recently.

WireRider

Stop playing "the game". Take their game board away.

So many people want to help, but they are so spread out.

59

Why don't you do anything?

by WireRider in

i'm not jw, so i see this all standing up and very clear from an outsider perspective (i am still seeking my path).

i joined the blog a few weeks ago.

i dated a divorced jw (jw from birth) for a couple of years recently.

WireRider

You all know the stakes. I understand. But use that, collectively, to your advantage. How can a million anonymous people undermine the organization? If it blows up from within - all will be free.

If loved ones are trapped - and it is such a horrific thing to comprehend that so many are only trapped because of the construct of the F@#$ING organization - that HOLDS HOSTAGES - that it makes me all that more mad and want to help.

Am I wrong? or do 80% want out but can't because of this organization? The more the fake pretense of fear that they control your family the more they control they have. Break the cycle. It's insane.

Be anonymous if needed. But there is strength in numbers and unity. I don't have a definitive plan but it is certainly possible with this many people. You, the former and fake-active hating-it people, would know better than I. There is a way.

What if everyone came together? A 1000 current websites. Someone draft the message, in fact and in truth, to unite the clan. (sorry, another Wallace reference)

59

Why don't you do anything?

by WireRider in

i'm not jw, so i see this all standing up and very clear from an outsider perspective (i am still seeking my path).

i joined the blog a few weeks ago.

i dated a divorced jw (jw from birth) for a couple of years recently.

WireRider

I'm not JW, so I see this all standing up and very clear from an outsider perspective (I am still seeking my path). I joined the blog a few weeks ago. I dated a divorced JW (JW from birth) for a couple of years recently. Even engaged for a day before her brother found out, and she thanked me for f@#@!ing up her entire life. (I am a guy - I just like the icon). Along the way I did an incredible amount of reading and research on the WT/JW trying to figure the whole thing out. But nothing worked to free her mind. Way too much reading about Russell and Rutherford.

But I know she was with me against the rules - so that says something. Does anyone in the JW really follow the "rules". If you break the rules - God would know. All she really cared about was not getting caught by humans. What does that tell you?

All I see is a publishing company run amok. For many years they have conned so many people into being FREE door-to-door sales people. And more recently FREE workers for their real estate empire. Where does the money really go? I know it sounds simplified - but look at the empire they have built with FREE labor. My personal religious concepts aside - it does not sound legitimate. Who mentally trains people and emotionally brainwashes people "because God said so" with the fear that if they don't obey they will get kicked out and their life will be f@#@!ing over? ding, ding, ding - right answer for 50 points.

I have seen postings from 1000s of active/former WT/JW on hundreds of websites. So many people separated and isolated and recovering and complaining. But no one really does anything. They are one group. ONE GROUP. What if all of the anit-WT/JW people came together as a unified group to stand in opposition? There is a webpage, a document, a video, a page, a book, a testimonial - per every American/Canadian/UK Witness. Attract the people who bailed 20yrs ago to join. I get the sense that all 35% or more don't like it - don't believe in it - feel it's a burden - lie about time sheet (WTH does a time sheet have to do with religion? God would know - why do humans have requirements for sales quotas?) - hate to go - feel trapped. That is ridiculous. The only thing propping them up is that 35% smile and pretend nothing is wrong - encouraging active members that all is good - and enticing new members to electro-shock religion because soooo many people appear to be members. The person next to you probably feels just as trapped as you but can't say anything. They hate it too but put on a smile and don't want to get caught. Their scared shitless to get caught. They may be there just because so many fake people that hide too all still go. Pull the plug. Stop going so that they cannot claim so many numbers and sound so appealing to draw more people in. Shout. Shout a warning to all that this is not where they want to be. Those that do still attend are supporting them - in numbers and presence - stop it.

I like the post about picking a date for a mass exodus. A very significant % left when Rutherford became a dictator and they went back to the true roots of Russell (for what ever it's worth). Perhaps for those trapped can play a roll, if even anonymously. A unified website. A campaign. A letter campaign. Mail bomb them. Use the same type of propaganda to free their minds - our make a change. I saw a fund-me campaign for a billboard outside of a conversion - I like that one - money where your mouth is.

Don't sit around complaining. Do something. Create a "free you mind" manifesto. Collect a million signatures. Free their minds - or create a list of demands to change to GB. There is strength in number is you would just unite with all the other websites and former WT/JW - and active WT/JW whole hate it and feel trapped (paraphrase William Wallace).

Find a way out. Provide a plausible alternative. Start a new church. Online church - I don't know. Usurp donations for a better cause. Those trapped and lost don't know what the alternative is. Create a unified website. Some group sit down and prepare a 12-step program of proof, documents, movies, testimonials. From all of the experience this group has - put it to use. Send an email to every TRUTH website asking them to join a unified front.

What I do know is a 1000 different TTATT dissociated websites isn't going anywhere and has no impact. Which is the basis for the WT/JW - if you leave, or if they kick you out, you'll have no place to go. You're screwed. Give them some place to go and feel welcome. It underminds the whole love you or your f@#$ked mentality that makes them so effective. Half want to leave, and the other half can't figure out how. Give them away. If you countermand their control over people and they will fall. Stop waiting in the wings and talking about gossip and wishing. Propaganda and money is their weak points - be better at it - they will fall. Minds will be free.

I'm going to bow out for now. But you all really have a chance to make a difference if you unify, present a unified front, educate, and provide an alternative for recovering WT/JW.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

Please show us that.

Google "sumerian tablet showing solar system"

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

ie god does not exist

And that's what people argued about the atom with no contrary proof. Then they proved it. It is a good example.

I never suggested anything about the nature of "something". I never suggested "supernatural". I think you have been feed a real load in the past about the nature of a "something". I never suggested that a supernatural being is going to help you change a tire or help advance science or help us discover natural science around us or help any life situations. That's completely overblown by organized religions to make you dependent on them. For all I know "something" probably stopped by, perhaps some genetic engineering, and moved on. (although if you believe the stories, it took several tries and had to keep wiping everything out and starting over) (personally I think we may have been engineered as slave labor - many people still have remnants of wanting to be a slave for no reason - and all those churches trying to keep the herd in line for a return - but that's a whole different discussion) I doubt they would stay to babysit the minutia in our lives. Were here - it's up to us to figure it out. "something" may be here or not or may come back someday.

If you would like - prove to me that "something" does not exist.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

You've yet to show me there is a god we don't understand.

That's a bit circular. I'm afraid you misunderstand me. I have made to attempt to claim/prove a God is real. I claim no tangible or empirical proof. But then again God cannot be proven to not be, or have been, real either.

Is the atom worthless and pointless? A couple of hundred years ago people said it didn't exist - they argued about whether it existed or not - they couldn't prove it either way. "Prove it". Where was the science and definitions then? We grew and learned, and now have particle theory that was once considered a joke, for lack of the right science and understanding.

No one doubts the contribution of science for society. Science is not worthless. Where will science be in 100yrs. I can't prove life exists on other planet - science and technology are not there yet. But I can say I have some degree of confidence base upon the context.

There was a Sumerian tablet uncovered by archaeologists that dated back to some 7000BC. On the tablet was an imprinted picture of the solar system with orbits. It also included Pluto. ?? Even though it has been there the whole time, our science didn't discover/prove it until about 1930.

I'm not saying that anyone has to believe in a God, or follow one if they did - but I'm not closing the door. What if they closed the door on the atom because they didn't understand it? Or life on other planets?

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

First show me any proof that any god exists, then we can discuss all gods.

(see my post above) I don't think there is any proof that humans can comprehend or have the words to describe. Human science is worthless here. Can you not fathom a being greater than humans that may be millions of years beyond our knowledge? As a scientist you cannot rule out the possibility of something just because you cannot understand it, don't have words for it, and cannot measure it. The possibility still exists. It would be arrogant to think otherwise.

I don't claim to know or have proof of "something" we don't understand. I'm still looking for answers myself. My point was that if you look at sociology and some of the biology there are too many coincidences to just write off something we don't understand. Is the want of religion, or a higher being, genetic? Running from something is pretty universal - what about the compulsion to run towards something we cannot even see? Why were the same fundamental traits of the need of religion, or for example pyramid building, happening all over the world at nearly the same time? "something" happened - I know not what.

I don't think there is really any proof required - it's really academic. I don't know if "something" was here, or if it left? But one trait is obvious - a lot of people do believe - real or not - and that shapes socio/economic behaviors and a lot of bloodshed.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

What if ALL Gods are the same one - perceived in many ways according to the individuals beliefs and filters? Would kind of suck if we found out that the Christian and Islamic and Hindu and Aztec and Mayan etc - all turned out to be the same "something" - as they interpreted it - and had so many useless wars in the name of "their" God.

447

Does Anyone Still Believe in God?

by LaurenM in

do any of you ex-jw's still believe in god?

even with the new rebranding/softening of this religion, i still don't see how people can believe in him.

the god of the old testimate is an angry murderer who approved rapes and slavery and killed thousands of men, women and children.

WireRider

I believe in "something". Something that is still beyond any definitions we have. I think the gaps in evolution more recently, happened by something. If you look are the world, virtually every culture has a "something" story that compels them to gather and for lack of a better word, worship. Cultures that never could have had communicated at the time have very similar ideas of "something".

I think there was genetic manipulations of species. Perhaps in a petri dish sort of way. When under a PET scan (or which ever) certain isolated areas of the brain light up when devote religious people pray. Ironically it was found that the same isolated areas light up when you show a addict pictures of drugs. Go figure. What compels people to have a slave mentality, that is very universal? Built that way? Programmed into genes?

I believe in "something". But not in any conventional way - and certainly not as organized religion tries to TELL me how. I don't need to pray to "something". I don't need to serve or be a slave to anyone. But ... I would like to take a walk with "something" some day. I have a few questions.

I reject the non-believers of the Trinity, and I think the people that do believe are seriously limiting themselves to what "something" is. "something" could separate into a million parts, each equal and the same being, inhabit everyone at the same time, and then merge and make it home in time for dinner as still the same being. Why is that so far fetched. Created the world, genetically created millions of planets and species - yet people still think of "something" with only human traits they can understand? We have yet to understand "something" and have no words that can be used.

What really burns me are humans that claim to speak with "something" and be their representative. TO USE GOD". I give a resounding Bullshit. It drives people away to have humans claim to be in control FOR God. "God wants us to do that" - "Jesus wants us to do this" ..... Really - you had a conversation with God lately? Give me his phone number. How do you know he picked YOU to run my life in his name? Organized religion is organized blasphemy. I don't care how nice your office looks.

98

My Opinions on whats going on in WT land - Insider Information

by thedepressedsoul in

first off, i'd like to state that i currently have "privileges" in the congregation and volunteer at bethel on and off throughout the year.

that's as much information as i will currently give about myself.. starting off, i think something big is coming in the form of lawsuits and bad pr.

they seem to be batting down the hatches in preparation for something the last few years and even more so the last few months.

WireRider

Was this the impetus to "forgive" mortgage loans in favor of committed donation rates? To plan mass sales?