Bart, it's my own interpretation from information gleaned from Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament. I tried to make sense of Is. 19 within the context of the book of Isaiah and the other prophetic books (cf. Is. 9:6, 7; 11:1-5, 10, etc.).
Posts by Vidqun
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250Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
This is where prophetic interpretation comes in. It’s great fun, you should try it:
This is an indication of what would happen during the Messiah’s reign. Even Canaanite nations would be enjoying God’s approval (cf. Is. 19:18 ). There will not be a curse anymore on the inabitants of the land (Zach 14:21b). These would grab at the chance to learn the “pure language, in order for them all to call upon God, in order to serve him shoulder to shoulder” (cf. Zeph. 3:9 ). In the LXX “The City of Tearing Down” is called polis asedek, “City of Righteousness ”. This is a figurative city, in a spiritual sense to be torn down completely, then rebuilt at the behest of the Lord of armies ( Jer. 1:10 ; 2 Cor. 10:4 , 5 ; cf. Amos 9:11 , 12 ).
Some of Israel ’s neigbhours, like Assyria , had been heavily militaristic. Other nations had been more liberal, like Egypt —at one time “the king of the south” in Daniel’s prophecy ( Dan. 11:5 , 8 ). Millions of individuals from the militaristic nations and the more liberal nations would be taking up the way of true worship. Thus, people from all nations would be united. There would be no nationalistic divisions among them. They would love one another, and it would be said that ‘Assyria comes into Egypt and Egypt into Assyria .’ It would be as if there were a highway from one to the other.— 1 Pet. 2:17 . Coming out of the nations—foreshadowed by Egypt and Assyria—individuals would stream to God’s house of worship and invite others to join them ( Is. 2:2-4 ).
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
No, Jwfacts, I think you're missing the point. I refer you to the following article (repetition for emphasis). In connection with Egypt of Is. 19:1-15, Ringgren of TDOT, vol. VIII, p. 529, had the following to say:
The series of statements in Is. 19:1-15 is more problematical, and its authenticity is generally disputed based on stylistic considerations. A prediction is made for the dissolution of national order, the collapse of economic life, and the confusion of Egypt’s rulers. “A fierce king will rule over them” (v. 4: historical allusion or a prediction for the future?). Isaiah’s usual warning against reliance on Egyptian aid is absent. These assertians are followed by a series of statements introduced by bayyôm hahû’ [an eschatological marker] which are doubtlessly secondary….
As seen, a historical fit for Is. 19 was missing. Such a period in Egyptian history cannot be identified. However, above statements would make perfect sense as a prediction for the future, as of now.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
Read Is. 19:2 Civil war. 9, 10, 15 Economic problems. 11 Foolish leaders. Sums up with what is going on in Egypt and the world.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
No, it's a partially fulfilled prophecy. You'll have to wait for the full package. It's even more interesting if you apply the clue of Rev. 11:8 where Egypt is used as an eponym for the world. So, then the prophecy has an even wider application.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
Let's say the prophecy has had a partial fulfillment. According to above prophecies, there's some interesting developments to look forward to. Time will tell.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
Here’s two prophecies of Isaiah that scholars had a problem with, especially Isaiah 19. If these did not come to pass in the past, they have now.
Syria, the country where the original King of the North was based, would be plunged into a vicious civil war during the latter part of the days. In Is. 17:1 we read of God’s pronouncement against Damascus : “Look! Damascus removed from being a city, and she has become a heap, a decaying ruin.” To me this is a reminder that Biblical prophecies should be taken seriously.
In connection with Egypt of Is. 19:1-15, Ringgren of TDOT, vol. VIII, p. 529, had the following to say:
The series of statements in Is. 19:1-15 is more problematical, and its authenticity is generally disputed based on stylistic considerations. A prediction is made for the dissolution of national order, the collapse of economic life, and the confusion of Egypt’s rulers. “A fierce king will rule over them” (v. 4: historical allusion or a prediction for the future?). Isaiah’s usual warning against reliance on Egyptian aid is absent. These assertians are followed by a series of statements introduced by bayyôm hahû’ [an eschatological marker] which are doubtlessly secondary….
As seen, a historical fit for Is. 19 would cause both exegete and interpreter untold problems. Such a period in Egyptian history cannot be identified. However, above statements would make perfect sense as a prediction for the future, as of now.
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Nebuchadnezzar's Dream--The Death of His Dynasty
by Tiresias infollowing my departure from the jehovah's witnesses, i have done my own research using preterism as a primary lens.
i would like to share my understanding of daniel chapter 2:.
31 "you looked, o king, and there before you stood a large statuean enormous, dazzling statue, awesome in appearance.
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Vidqun
Interesting interpretation Teresias, but going against the writer's own exposition. He would have said "king," but instead he mentions "kingdom" (see all versions and translations). I view the prophecy of Daniel as a unit, thus preferring the traditional explanation of Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, and Rome, especially in the light of the four beasts of Dan. 7:
38b Wherever they live, he has made you ruler over them all. You are that head of gold.
39 "After you, another kingdom will arise, inferior to yours. Next, a third kingdom, one of bronze, will rule over the whole earth.
40 Finally, there will be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron--for iron breaks and smashes everything--and as iron breaks things to pieces, so it will crush and break all the others.
41 Just as you saw that the feet and toes were partly of baked clay and partly of iron, so this will be a divided kingdom; yet it will have some of the strength of iron in it, even as you saw iron mixed with clay.
42 As the toes were partly iron and partly clay, so this kingdom will be partly strong and partly brittle.
43 And just as you saw the iron mixed with baked clay, so the people will be a mixture and will not remain united, any more than iron mixes with clay.
(Dan 2:38-43 TNIV)
Coming back to the date of authorship, it seems to be moving back in time, according to the latest research. Three examples come to mind:
1) It is certainly possible that Daniel is the author of the book (Ant. 10:267), which would put the date of the book somewhere in the latter half of the sixth century B.C. [Footnote 1: On purely linguistic grounds, the similarity of the book’s Aramaic with that of Egyptian Aramaic texts from the fifth century B.C. makes a date in the latter part of the sixth century B.C. at least remotely possible.][1]
2) John J. Collins, a staunch defender of a late date Daniel, makes an unusual concession. While acknowledging that a “precise dating on linguistic grounds is not possible,” he concludes that the Aramaic of Daniel is later than that of the Samaria papyri (Wadi Daliyeh, fourth century BCE) but earlier than that of the Genesis Apocryphon (1Q20).[2]
3) The form of the prophecies of Dan. 8:23-25 and 11 is best explained if they originated in the Babylonian Dispersion and the author was well acquainted with the Babylonian omen literature, someone skilled in the language and letters of the Chaldeans, as the account in Dan. 1 indicates.[3]
[1] Michael B. Shepherd, Daniel in the Context of the Hebrew Bible (Studies in Biblical Literature, vol. 123), Peter Lang Publishing, New York 2009, pp. 65, 66.
[2] John J. Collins, A Commentary on the Book of Daniel, Hermeneia-series, pp. 16 [footnote 156], 17, and R. J. Korner, “The “Exilic” Prophecy of Daniel 7: Does It Reflect Late Pre-Maccabean or Early Hellenistic Historiography?” in Prophets, Prophecy, and Ancient Israelite Historiography [ed. M. J. Boda and L. M. Wray Beal; Leiden: Brill, 2013], p. 348.
[3] E. C. Lucas, “Daniel: Resolving the Enigma,” Vetus Testamentum, Vol. 50, Fasc. 1 (Jan., 2000), pp. 72-76.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
Dan. 2 doesn't meet all your criteria (no specific dates), but is impressive nevertheless. Daniel tells Nebuchadnezzar: “However, there exists a God in the heavens who is a Revealer of secrets, and he has made known to King Nebuchadnezzar what is to occur in the final part of the days” (Dan. 2:28). Modern scholars don't believe in predictive prophecy, so they prefer the sequence of the metals as Babylon (gold), Media (silver), Persia (copper), and Greece (iron). Problem with that explanation is that the writer of the book viewed the combined Medo-Persian Empire as the second kingdom (cf. Dan. 5:28; 8:20). If that is the case, the next kingdom would be that of Greece, with the fourth being Rome. The feet of iron and clay indicate the fragmentation of nations, very much like we have today. The destruction of the image and the setting up of God's kingdom would occur sometime in the future, "in the final part of the days." Why would his prediction be special? Because Rome only came on the scene in 63 BCE, when Pompey annexed Palestine. Even if Daniel was written 165 BCE as modern scholars contend, the author's prediction is quite accurate.
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250
Biblical Prohecies That Came True?
by Viviane inrecently there have been several claims made regarding prophecies that came true.
i've not personally seen a prophecy that i would consider as having come true.
i would consider the following as the requirements to say something is a prophecy and evaluate whether or not it came true:.
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Vidqun
SG098, I believe one's faith must be built on knowledge. This knowledge one attains through study. Study fields: History, language studies, everyday events, and yes, prophecy.
Viv, some prophecies pertain to the future. E.g. some of Daniel's prophecies. Here's a few quotes:
Daniel tells Nebuchadnezzar: “However, there exists a God in the heavens who is a Revealer of secrets, and he has made known to King Nebuchadnezzar what is to occur in the final part [’acharith] of the days” [“the latter days,” KJV] (Dan. 2:28).[1]
Later the angel Gabriel informs Daniel: “Understand, O son of man, that the vision is for the time of [the] end” [“the end time,” NAB] (Dan. 8:17b).[2] He continues: “Here I am causing you to know what will occur in the final part [’acharith] of the denunciation, because it is for the appointed time of the end.” The “final part of the denunciation” refers to God’s anger during “the time of the end” (cf. Dan. 8:19, 25).
The small horn or fierce king will rise “in the final part [’acharith] of their kingdom, as the transgressors act to completion” (cf. Dan. 8:23). Gabriel concludes: “And you, for your part, keep secret the vision, because it is for many days” [“it concerns the distant future,” NIV] (cf. Dan. 8:26b).
Concerning the final vision, the angel reveals: “And I have come to cause you to discern what will befall your people in the final part [’acharith] of the days, because it is a vision yet for the days [to come]” [“for the vision pertains to future days,” NET] (cf. Dan. 10:14). [Cursive script added.][3]
The final King of the North “will certainly prove successful until [the] denunciation will have come to a finish.” Again the “denunciation” here refers to God’s wrath, indicating that the final King of the North would from hereon remain the same, enjoying great success, until his destruction during the closing phase of “the end time” (cf. Dan. 11:36, 40, 45 NAB).
[1] This eschatological marker often occurs in the prophetic books of the Bible, corresponding to a new era in human history (Is. 2:2; Jer. 23:20; 30:24; 48:47; 49:39; Dan. 12:13; Hosea 3:5; Mic. 4:1; cf. Ezek. 38:8, 16).
[2] This eschatological marker occurs six times in the book of Daniel. Only the prophet Daniel would make use of it (cf. Dan. 8:17, 19; 11:35, 40; 12:4, 9).
[3] Like the Septuagint text of Jeremia, the Messianism of Daniel would look towards a future fulfillment beyond the historical fulfillment of Ezra-Nehemiah (cf. Dan. 7:13, 14; 9:25). In Dan. 2:28 the Hebraism (“at the end of the days”) sets the stage for the eschatology of the book. It is also a connection between the Aramaic and Hebrew section (cf. Dan. 2:28; 10:14). See Michael B. Shepherd, The Verbal System of Biblical Aramaic: A Distributional Approach (Studies in Biblical Literature, vol. 116), Peter Lang Publishing, New York 2008, pp. 14, 15.