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I_love_Jeff
JoinedPosts by I_love_Jeff
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In Revelation, why is one verse to be taken literally and the other figuratively?
by I_love_Jeff inwhy is the great crowd in rev.7:9, standing before the throne mind you, to be taken figuratively and on earth if the same description (before the throne) in rev.
14:3 is used in a literal sense and in heaven?.
rev.
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14
In Revelation, why is one verse to be taken literally and the other figuratively?
by I_love_Jeff inwhy is the great crowd in rev.7:9, standing before the throne mind you, to be taken figuratively and on earth if the same description (before the throne) in rev.
14:3 is used in a literal sense and in heaven?.
rev.
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I_love_Jeff
Thanks Bobcat!!
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14
In Revelation, why is one verse to be taken literally and the other figuratively?
by I_love_Jeff inwhy is the great crowd in rev.7:9, standing before the throne mind you, to be taken figuratively and on earth if the same description (before the throne) in rev.
14:3 is used in a literal sense and in heaven?.
rev.
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14
In Revelation, why is one verse to be taken literally and the other figuratively?
by I_love_Jeff inwhy is the great crowd in rev.7:9, standing before the throne mind you, to be taken figuratively and on earth if the same description (before the throne) in rev.
14:3 is used in a literal sense and in heaven?.
rev.
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I_love_Jeff
Why is the great crowd in Rev.7:9, standing before the throne mind you, to be taken figuratively and on Earth if the same description (before the throne) in Rev. 14:3 is used in a literal sense and in Heaven?
Rev. 14:3 Literal "......before the throne......144,000". In Heaven
Rev. 7:9: Figurative "....great crowd....standing before the throne...." On Earth.
#2476 ?στημι histemi {his'-tay-mee} to stand v.
http://www.lexiconcordance.com/greek/2476.htmlIn case the Jehovah's Witnesses decide to do some word magic, the link above will direct them to the meaning of the word "histemi". There are two different meanings (see link above). According to the definition of the Greek word "histemi" it can be used figuratively OR literally. They choose it to be figurative. Why? They use the following argument to prove their point : specific numbers (144,000) are to be understood as literal. Not exact number:symbolic . Here is the problem with this idea: Reading Rev. 21:16-17 the numbers are very specific yet symbolic in JW teachings. 12 foundations and 12 gates bearing the names of the twelve tribes of Israel (Revelation 12:12-14). The city is 12,000 stadia long, 12,000 stadia wide, and 12,000 stadia high (12 x 1000), with walls 144 cubits thick (12 x 12)
Revelation 7:9 describes the great multitude as "standing before the throne" and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes." That puts the "great multitude" in Heaven! The phrase "before the throne" is the same phrase used of the 144,000 in the later vision (Rev. 14:3), and always pictures location in Heaven (Rev. 1:4; 4:5, 6, 10; 7:9, 11, 15; 8:3; 14:3; 20:12).
Again with the information given, why is the great crowd in Rev.7:9, standing before the throne, to be taken figuratively and on Earth if the same description (before the throne) in Rev. 14:3 is used in a literal sense and in Heaven?
Are they trying to force Scripture into validating a preconceived doctrine?
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How do the Jehivah's Witnesses get "city government" out of "heavenly city"?
by I_love_Jeff in"abraham had come out of ur of the chaldeans, and he did not want that city any more.
he and his son isaac and grandson jacob wanted a better place, that is, one belonging to heaven, a city government, namely, the government or city that god has prepared and in which the promised seed or offspring of abraham will be gods king.
this is the kingdom of god, or the kingdom of the heavens, as these two expressions are interchangeable, the expression the heavens having reference to god.
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I_love_Jeff
Blondie you should see the response that CF gave in the link I provided. LOL!
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How do the Jehivah's Witnesses get "city government" out of "heavenly city"?
by I_love_Jeff in"abraham had come out of ur of the chaldeans, and he did not want that city any more.
he and his son isaac and grandson jacob wanted a better place, that is, one belonging to heaven, a city government, namely, the government or city that god has prepared and in which the promised seed or offspring of abraham will be gods king.
this is the kingdom of god, or the kingdom of the heavens, as these two expressions are interchangeable, the expression the heavens having reference to god.
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I_love_Jeff
OOOO shoot, I spelled Jehovah incorrectly...oops.
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How do the Jehivah's Witnesses get "city government" out of "heavenly city"?
by I_love_Jeff in"abraham had come out of ur of the chaldeans, and he did not want that city any more.
he and his son isaac and grandson jacob wanted a better place, that is, one belonging to heaven, a city government, namely, the government or city that god has prepared and in which the promised seed or offspring of abraham will be gods king.
this is the kingdom of god, or the kingdom of the heavens, as these two expressions are interchangeable, the expression the heavens having reference to god.
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I_love_Jeff
"Abraham had come out of Ur of the Chaldeans, and he did not want that city any more. He and his son Isaac and grandson Jacob wanted a better place, that is, one belonging to heaven, a city government, namely, the government or city that God has prepared and in which the promised Seed or Offspring of Abraham will be God’s King. This is the “kingdom of God,” or “the kingdom of the heavens,” as these two expressions are interchangeable, the expression “the heavens” having reference to God. Under that kingdom of the heavens or kingdom of God Abraham, Isaac and Jacob expected to live on earth". (Watchtower 3/15/1962 Questions From the Readers)
I also checked the Kingdom Interlinear Bible Hebrews 11:8-19. Not able to able find any information on "city government" in those verses. What do you guys think? -
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Jehovah's Witnesses: If the 144,000 were not defiled by women, does that not make them ALL men?
by I_love_Jeff inand unmarried, of course, since they are all virgins?.
since you are taking this all literally, perhaps you need to re-read the verses carefully.
if parts of this verse are to be taken figuratively then how do you determine the number, 144,000 to be literal?.
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I_love_Jeff
I posted this question on Yahoo Answers by the way. This is meant for Jehovah's Witnesses and Ex Witnesses on here : )
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Jehovah's Witnesses: If the 144,000 were not defiled by women, does that not make them ALL men?
by I_love_Jeff inand unmarried, of course, since they are all virgins?.
since you are taking this all literally, perhaps you need to re-read the verses carefully.
if parts of this verse are to be taken figuratively then how do you determine the number, 144,000 to be literal?.
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I_love_Jeff
and unmarried, of course, since they are all virgins?
Since you are taking this all literally, perhaps you need to re-read the verses carefully.If parts of this verse are to be taken figuratively then how do you determine the number, 144,000 to be literal?
Women=symbolic for government
144,000=real number of MEN (anointed) who will be in Heaven
How do the Jehovah's Witnesses determine which is real and which is symbolic? Strange reasoning indeed. -
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So 144,000 will go to Heaven? Is this to be taken literally even though......
by I_love_Jeff inwe have something within their own literature stating otherwise?.
"apocalypse, or revelation, is the name of the last book in the bible, written toward the end of the first century c.e.
in view of the prophetic nature and highly symbolic language of this book, the adjective apocalyptic came to be applied to a form of literature that began long before the bible book of revelation was written.
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I_love_Jeff
Where is the latest correction for this particular subject matter? I was not able to find it in the Watchtower Library 2012.