Posts by pale.emperor

40

Did Jesus pre exist? Yes or no?

by UnshackleTheChains in

when i first became a witness, i always found the teaching about jesus being the arch angel michael hard to swallow.

i did however believe that jesus pre existed as a master worker alongside god (the first of his creation).. but now everything is brought into question having watched anthony buzzard explain why jesus could not have pre existed as it is impossible to pre exist yourself.

also the fact that it all sounds contradictory to suggest, he was already alive millions of years before he was transferred to mary's womb to be born as a human - the son of man?.

pale.emperor

I dont believe the bible - BUT treating it as a work of fiction as i would The Lord Of The Rings or something like that... he definitely IS NOT the Archangel Michael. Anthony Buzzard is very good at proving that. I find the Jesus being God idea to be contradictory. For every "proof" a trinitarian gives me i can give another proof showing that he cant be. I think the original teaching was that he wasn't god, but as the Jesus cult grew people started making bigger claims as they got carried away. Next thing you know people think he actually was god.

As for his per-existance... i'd say no. If i were reading the story for the first time without any preconceived ideas i think it's clear that he was a man who became divine. And that the example is that we all can be divine too if we copy him.

149

why jw's commit suicide?

by notalone in

jw
friends

we all know the rate of suicide is high among jw's.

my question is this- was there some subliminal messages that encourage this.

i was a born in and my entire life i would have these thoughts that could come out of nowhere,"kill yourself.

pale.emperor

There was a lovely lady in my last congregation that suffered from depression. She was about 25 years older than me. She always put a smiley face on and was really quiet and unassuming. Because she wasn't in any of the social cliques she was left on her own all the time. I always made a big effort with her, talking to her and remembering our conversations so i could refer to things she'd said previously to show i was listening.

It was so sad to see nobody bothering with her, even though they knew she was suffering. I wonder how she is now that im DFd and no one else ever bothered. I do think if she stopped going and made real friends in the real world she'd feel at least a little better.

28

An infographic I just created...

by HappyHappyHappy1914 in

hey everyone.

i don't post here often, but i lurk pretty much everyday.

i just created the following infographic based on the recent yearbook stats.

pale.emperor

Take away all the born-in's that are indoctrinated since birth and the so-called growth would be even more pitiful.

19

"No junk mail". How witnesses ignore these signs!

by stuckinarut2 in

as we know, many people have "no junk mail" signs on their home letterboxes.

this clearly means that they do not want unsolicited mail or advertising material.. so how are witnesses getting around this?.

during the campaign to distribute the convention invitations, when they come across a house with "no junk mail", they are just putting the leaflet inside an envelope and hand writing "to the householder" on the front and putting it in the letterbox!.

pale.emperor

Actually, in the past few years the direction on this issue from Watchtower has flip-flopped.

I remember being told from the platform that if we see a "no soliciting" sign we should respect their wishes and not call on that door.

Simple yes? The brother delivered the announcement with complete conviction. That this is what we should do and it's come directly from Bethel.

Then about 6 months later... we're told to ignore those signs because we're not soliciting. We have sayings of eternal life and would we ignore a "do not disturb" sign if their house was on fire? The same brother gave this announcement with complete conviction.

Then and year later... back to the original idea of not calling on doors with signs on.

The result? Depending on who you work with in the ministry you'll see some ignore the sign and some respecting the sign. Those who were not at the meeting on the day of one of the announcements are convinced that the announcement they heard was the correct one.

So it's made no difference. We're back to where we started. The overzealous nuts will call on the door with signs and the ones that dont like the ministry wont.

18

Where is the proof?

by stuckinarut2 in

we all know that the governing body claim to be "god's representatives" and the "faithful and discreet slave" that dispenses spiritual food..... but where is the proof?.

according to the bible (if we just for a moment take it as a reliable source), all of god's representatives in the past furnished proof of their appointment - not just self referential claims or statements.. for instance, moses and aaron performed miracles before pharaoh (such as the snake staffs.).

other prophets performed signs and miracles such as making the sun stand still, healing sick people, making walls fall down, etc etc.... even jesus performed miracles as proof of his divine appointment!.

pale.emperor

You're right. Moses asked God for a sign and he wasnt told off for asking. Jesus performed signs. Hell, every prophet in the bible performed signs as evidence.

I discussed this on my channel here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWs6LsBZFOQ

149

why jw's commit suicide?

by notalone in

jw
friends

we all know the rate of suicide is high among jw's.

my question is this- was there some subliminal messages that encourage this.

i was a born in and my entire life i would have these thoughts that could come out of nowhere,"kill yourself.

pale.emperor

Lets face it, when we were in the cult we were told we wernt good enough, not worthy of God the way we are, unacceptable, unclean, "dust"... and that's when we're doing all we can in the cult! So i think those who still feel it is the truth may think that if they leave they're even worse than useless. Which simply isnt true.

Couple this with the shunning and you have a very dangerous situation.

Im not bothered about being shunned, but if my daughter were to die i know i'd want to kill myself. Watchtower takes away everything that should be sacred to you, your self worth, your opinions and even your family. Once you're stripped off all those things you're an empty shell. Which is why it's very important to speak to others, especially ex-JWs and/or a mental health professional.

41

Watchtower Doctrines JWs most commonly don't believe

by Diogenesister in

there was a recent thread on another site where posters maintained that many of the *most* long-standing jw's don't believe at least one official watchtower doctrine.

i've even read reports from bethelites saying they've heard bethel overseers say they don't believe some watchtower theology.

this made me think - i believe there are a few official doctrines that are common for many jw's to be either in denial about or simply not really believe ( often one and the same thing).. i'd say these are pretty high in the ranking:.

pale.emperor

I used to deny that only JWs will survive. It was actually an apostate on Quora.com that corrected me and pointed me to the many Watchtower articles.

Kudos to that apostate

40

Some Good News About Me (Although Anthony Morris Will Be Furious)

by pale.emperor in

just wanted to share with you some good news i'm really excited about.

i have been accepted for university to study psychology and counseling.

my goal is to become a counselor and, in time, to specialize on treating those who have left high control relationships/groups like we all did.. it'll take a few years before im qualified but studying in university has been a dream of mine since i was 12, which was systematically dashed to pieces by watchtower.. .

pale.emperor

Hello everyone

Just wanted to share with you some good news I'm really excited about. I have been accepted for University to study Psychology and Counseling. My goal is to become a counselor and, in time, to specialize on treating those who have left high control relationships/groups like we all did.

It'll take a few years before im qualified but studying in University has been a dream of mine since i was 12, which was systematically dashed to pieces by Watchtower.

Well Tony, lets hope so. I may even wear tight pants to class and grow a beard.

14

Hospital refuses surgery on JW patient - Switzerland

by TheWonderofYou in

switzerland - .

jw files a suit because his surgery was refused!

supreme court decides against jw.. in the present case, the dilemma to which the hospital refers is not at all.

pale.emperor

This whole non blood thing may a well sound like this to me:

Doctor: Good news, we can perform your operation in the morning.

Patient: That's wonderful news doctor. Only, i'd like you to do the operation using only your left hand, cutting with a knife only, no scissors, and instead of stitching me up i'd like you to use cellotape.

Doctor: I... im not willing to do that...

Patient: You're discriminating! Im being persecuted for my beliefs. The prophecies were right!

Quack Doctor: Hallo everybody! I'll do the operation for you.

Patient: This surely is a blessing from Jehovah!

Patient dies.

Mother: What a wonderful display of faith! We'll see her in the resurrection.

12

Worse than the maggots apparently...

by NoviceLocs14 in

so after a couple of years, i've finally re-established contact with a close relative (not revealing too much for privacy reasons).

it turns out that he is dfd (for the typical jw reasons, of course).

we caught up about a lot of things, including family.

pale.emperor

My mother and sisters warned my non-JW brother to be careful talking to me because i was an apostate. Dont know why he needed to be careful because he's not even a JW. It's almost as if leaving the Watchtower contaminates us with a filthy disease that can be caught by only speaking to us.