I think most witnesses think the blood issue is complete rubbish but go along with it hoping they'll never have to be in that situation. If they made it personal choice and "dont ask - dont tell" as it should be then there'd be no problem.
pale.emperor
JoinedPosts by pale.emperor
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13
JWs and taking blood
by dogon ini have a brother who works in the medical profession and in particular surgery rooms.
he had a jw woman who needed blood.
while the jw elders were there she said no blood.
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35
Im Going To Approach A Witnessing Cart Today
by pale.emperor inthe city in which i work is flooded with those witnessing carts.
today im going to approach one of them and pretend i dont know what they believe.
gonna try and record it if i can.
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pale.emperor
Darkknight757
I'd like to hear more on the Bible is scientifically accurate portion. That's always a funny conversation.
Usual bull i used to spout:
"circle of the earth",
Plants and animals according to their kind meaning adaptation but not evolution
Israelite's having laws on washing and sanitation without any apparent knowledge of germs.
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Has waking up ever made you physically ill?
by fizzle inhas waking up ever made you physically ill?
perhaps because of the emotional strain etc..?.
if if so what were / are the symptoms?.
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pale.emperor
Quite the opposite actually. I've never been so healthy, happy and friendly in all my life since leaving.
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35
Im Going To Approach A Witnessing Cart Today
by pale.emperor inthe city in which i work is flooded with those witnessing carts.
today im going to approach one of them and pretend i dont know what they believe.
gonna try and record it if i can.
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pale.emperor
Im back!
I found a cart, this one was manned by an elder (i recognized his face from assemblies) and a woman i presume was his wife. I stopped and looked at their cart at the mags and books.
ELDER: Hi. Would you like to take one?
ME: Im just looking thanks. Which religion is this?
ELDER: We're Jehovah's Witnesses.
ME: Oh right. Ok. I've spoke to you people before. On my door a while back.
ELDER: Oh yes? Have you read any of our magazines before?
ME: I study religion in generally actually. I have a copy of your bible at home. It's a new one isnt it? I collect different translations of the bible.
ELDER: Oh thats good. So do you have a belief in god?
ME: I used to. But when i studied it after a number of years i concluded that Jesus was a very wise and good man but only a man. And i dont think he started a religion. To me, it looks as though he gave some great lessons for life and thats great. But people shouldn't be made to follow him. I mean Buddha and Lao Tsu said some profound things too dont you think?
WOMAN: Well we believe that the bible is inspired of God. Have you seen this scripture? (She reads 2 Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is inspired of God..."
ME: Yes but that doesnt mean it's true does it? The bible cant claim to be true because it says it is.
(I wanted to steer the conversation to "shunning" so after some blah blah about the bible being scientifically accurate (ha!) i said:)
ME: It's good that you feel zealous enough to preach. I mean im sure you're not compelled to do it or anything. But is it true that you people shun people who leave?
WOMAN: ... (thinks)
ELDER: People who want to leave a free to leave.
ME: I know but would they be shunned for leaving? That's what im asking.
ELDER: Well we have a responsibility to keep the congregation clean, and that means cutting off association with those who dont want to serve Jehovah.
ME: What if, for example, a person genuinely didn't believe it. They say "i love you, i respect you, but i just dont believe this is the truth so im gonna go join another religion" would they be shunned? Because they're living the same morals and want to worship their god in the way they feel is right.
ELDER: I know it sounds harsh. But usually this wakes the person up and rekindles their love for Jehovah and they return. If they return they're welcomed into the congregation and accepted back again.
ME: Well thats good. So they could come back like a week later and everything would be ok again?
ELDER: Well... it depends.
ME: Can you show me a scriptural reference for this by the way?
(They get out their bibles and shuffle some pages)
ME: Because i've read the bible many times and i know Jesus didnt sanction this.
ELDER: Here. 1 Corinthians 5:11-13 "blah blah blah remove the wicked one from among you"
ME: Wicked? Im not talking about a wicked person. I mean if someone doesnt agree that this religion is true.
ELDER: Maybe you'd like to read this book, it explains it clearly from the scriptures (Bible Teach Book)
ME: But you have the scriptures in front of you. Can you show me yourself?
ELDER & WOMAN: ...
ME: Look, im not trying to be funny with you or anything. It just seems to me like anyone who leaves your religion is considered "wicked". Now, am i wrong there?
WOMAN: No, not at all. We work with non witnesses, we treat them with kindness.
ME: So can you treat someone who leaves with kindness?
ELDER: Look, this is turning into an argument now. Lets just leave it there.
ME: Im not trying to argue sir, im just asking questions. I know shunnng isnt in the bible. And maybe you're getting a little embarrassed because you - deep inside - know it's not right.
ELDER: Embarrassed? Im not getting embarrassed.
ME: Well that's good because i dont want you to. Im a theologian myself and i wanted to ask a real JW rather than looking it up online or asking ex-witnesses.
They then just ignored me and pretended i wasn't there. Both holding the Watchtower out to... no one. I took my leave.
ME: Well, i hope you have a nice day. Merry Christmas.
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35
Im Going To Approach A Witnessing Cart Today
by pale.emperor inthe city in which i work is flooded with those witnessing carts.
today im going to approach one of them and pretend i dont know what they believe.
gonna try and record it if i can.
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pale.emperor
The city in which i work is flooded with those witnessing carts. Today im going to approach one of them and pretend i dont know what they believe. Gonna try and record it if i can. My questions are going to be:
Is it true you shun people who leave? - (i think they'll lie or sugar coat this one)
Who's in charge of your "church"? (that word will make them think i was never a JW)
How do you know they're not just crazy?
So sometimes God get's it wrong?
If they're infallible then how is their opinion anymore valid than the average guy on the street?
Then i'll bring up the Royal Commision.
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Mass JW exodus
by stockholm_Syndrome inmaybe there will be a mass exodus from jws when thinking people read feb 2017 watchtower telling them the governing body stuff up, shouldnt expect correct/ perfect information and basically make up guff as they see fit.....ya reckon?.
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pale.emperor
Hey, if shunning didnt exist at least 60% of active JW's would probably never turn up the the Kingdom Halls again. Keeping the JW label but not really practicing it.
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64
Mass JW exodus
by stockholm_Syndrome inmaybe there will be a mass exodus from jws when thinking people read feb 2017 watchtower telling them the governing body stuff up, shouldnt expect correct/ perfect information and basically make up guff as they see fit.....ya reckon?.
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pale.emperor
I'm with David Jay on this. There's a change brewing, I can feel it.
On a side note there's a really nice brother in my old cong that was a member of the WCG and left when it changed its doctrine. So he went with the next best thing with similar beliefs - the witnesses.
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Beatles poster was "Demonized". We had to take it down. How about you?
by Wasanelder Once inin 1967 richard avedon published a poster of his portraits of the beatles.
my jw aunt attacked it for being spiritualistic!
the "third" eye on george's palm was spiritualistic!
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pale.emperor
Lets see, what was i not allowed to have?:
Star Wars - wasnt allowed to watch it because it had the word "Wars" in the title. So i never actually seen star wars until i was like 25yo.
Three Men And A Baby - because, apparently, there was a demon hiding behind a curtain in one of the scenes.
Crash Dummies - a toy collection i was really into, on day my mum interpreted a Watchtower as saying we shouldn't have them because they simulate death.
Smurphs - never knew the reason why until i visited this forum. Apparently they're demonic.
The Beatles - but only after 1966 because that's when they were druggies. Or so my mum said.
Michael Jacksons Thriller - for obvious reasons
Queen - Because Freddy Mercury was gay (but Elton John was ok, go figure).
Led Zeppelin - Because Stairway To Heaven had satanic lyrics in reverse.
The following symbols: Cross, pentagram, ying-yang
Magicians on TV - including Tommy Cooper, Paul Daniels and especially Derren Brown. Even though Derren Brown openly says it's all a trick and the supernatural does not exist.
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Mass JW exodus
by stockholm_Syndrome inmaybe there will be a mass exodus from jws when thinking people read feb 2017 watchtower telling them the governing body stuff up, shouldnt expect correct/ perfect information and basically make up guff as they see fit.....ya reckon?.
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pale.emperor
The Feb Watchtower wont make a difference im afraid. As a previous poster said, they will say something about "how humble and honest the GB are for admitting they're infallible. Not like the pope of the Catholic Church grr!!".
And as any ex-JW will know, a lot of them sometimes say things like "even if this isn't the truth, isnt it a nice way to live?". Which to me says they're having doubts but their thought stopping process has kicked in.
They're incapable of thinking anything ill of the GB. My only hope is the next generation are more curious about what's written on the internet and eventually this religion will fizzle out to a small size like Plymouth Bretheren or something. I've written off the idea of any of my family leaving. I know many would be happier outside but they're so afraid of the possibility of it being the truth they wont leave. And of course, what's there to lose? "It's such a nice way to live your life".
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23
Standing for the National Anthem?
by eyeslice2 inwe are currently living in a country where at the cinema the national anthem is played before the start of the movie and it is law that you stand.
does anyone know what current jw thinking is on this?
i know there has been various changes over the years.
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pale.emperor
I've never sang the national anthem of this country (England) but mostly because God Save The Queen is a song about the Queen, not England.
I work in immigration and there are foreign brothers who have become UK citizens... in this country you CANNOT get citizenship without swearing allegiance to the queen (or country) AND singing the national anthem at the citizenship ceremony. So obviously those brothers put their beliefs aside for day in order to get a UK passport.
On a side note I sang the German national anthem with a tear in my eye last time I was in Munich. Proud of my German ancestry. But that's just me.