In fact, can anyone point to any white supremacists? I mean real genuine ones, not political drivel like "OOooh, how can you not see TRUMP!!!"
rh3988
JoinedPosts by rh3988
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White supremecy
by Yomama inwith all the black lives matters stuff going on i was wondering why would a mostly white gb splash a picture of an all white heavenly group of white europeans.
ask some of your pimi relatives that one..
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rh3988
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Article "Would You Stand up to an Opressive Regime or Would Conform? Here's the Science"
by Bill Covert inthere is a article on firefox "would you stand up to an oppressive regime or would you conform?
here's the science" taken from "the conversation" by nick chater.
10-9-2019.. perhaps someone with computer skills can copy and post this article on this forum.
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rh3988
Would You Stand up to an Oppressive Regime or Would You Conform? Here’s the Science
We all like to think of ourselves as heroes. But according to science, the vast majority of people aren’t prepared to rebel against totalitarian rulers.
The Conversation | Nick ChaterPhoto from Jasper Savage / Hulu / Channel 4.
Margaret Atwood’s novel, The Handmaid’s Tale, described the horror of the authoritarian regime of Gilead. In this theocracy, self-preservation was the best people could hope for, being powerless to kick against the system. But her sequel, The Testaments, raises the possibility that individuals, with suitable luck, bravery and cleverness, can fight back.
But can they? There are countless examples of past and present monstrous regimes in the real world. And they all raise the question of why people didn’t just rise up against their rulers. Some of us are quick to judge those who conform to such regimes as evil psychopaths – or at least morally inferior to ourselves.
But what are the chances that you would be a heroic rebel in such a scenario, refusing to be complicit in maintaining or even enforcing the system?
To answer this question, let’s start by considering a now classic analysis by American organisational theorist James March and Norwegian political scientist Johan Olsen from 2004.
They argued that human behaviour is governed by two complementary, and very different, “logics”. According to the logic of consequence, we choose our actions like a good economist: weighing up the costs and benefits of the alternative options in the light of our personal objectives. This is basically how we get what we want.
But there is also a second logic, the logic of appropriateness. According to this, outcomes, good or bad, are often of secondary importance – we often choose what to do by asking “What is a person like me supposed to do in a situation like this”?
The idea is backed up by psychological research. Human social interactions depend on our tendency to conform to unwritten rules of appropriate behaviour. Most of us are truthful, polite, don’t cheat when playing board games and follow etiquette. We are happy to let judges or football referees enforce rules. A recent study showed we even conform to arbitrary norms.
The logic of appropriateness is self-enforcing – we disapprove of, ostracise or report people who lie or cheat. Research has shown that even in anonymous, experimental “games”, people will pay a monetary cost to punish other people for being uncooperative.
Psychopaths? Photo from the German Federal Archive (Deutsches Bundesarchiv).
The logic of appropriateness is therefore crucial to understanding how we can organise ourselves into teams, companies and entire nations. We need shared systems of rules to cooperate – it is easy to see how evolution may have shaped this.
The psychological foundations for this start early. Children as young as three will protest if arbitrary “rules” of a game are violated. And we all know how punishing it can be to “stick out” in a playground by violating norms of dress, accent or behaviour.
Authoritarian Regimes
Both logics are required to create and maintain an authoritarian regime. To ensure that we make the “right” personal choices, an oppressive state’s main tools are carrots and sticks – rewarding conformity and punishing even a hint of rebellion.
But personal gain (or survival) alone provides a fragile foundation for an oppressive state. It is easy to see how the logic of appropriateness fits in here, turning from being a force for cooperation to a mechanism for enforcing an oppressive status quo. This logic asks that we follow the “rules” and make sure others do too – often without needing to ask why the rules are the way they are.
Regimes therefore supplement rewards and punishments with self-policed norms, rules and conventions. A “good” party comrade or a member of a religious cult or terrorist group will learn that they are supposed to obey orders, root out opposition and not question authority – and enforce these norms on their fellows.
The authoritarian state is therefore concerned above all with preserving ideology – defining the “right” way to think and behave – so that we can unquestioningly conform to it.
This can certainly help explain the horrors of Nazi Germany – showing it’s not primarily a matter of individual evil. As the philosopher Hannah Arendt famously argued, the atrocities of the Holocaust were made possible by normal people, manipulated into conforming to a horribly abnormal set of behavioural norms.
Would You Rebel?
So how would you or I fare in Gilead? We can be fairly confident that most of us would conform (with more or less discomfort), finding it difficult to shake the feeling that the way things are done is the right and appropriate way.
Just think of the fervour with which people can enforce standards of dress, prohibitions on profane language or dietary norms – however arbitrary these may appear. Indeed, we may feel “morally bound” to protect the party, nation or religion, whatever its character.
A small number of us, however, would rebel – but not primarily, I suspect, based on differences in individual moral character. Rebels, too, need to harness the logic of appropriateness – they need to find different norms and ideals, shared with fellow members of the resistance, or inspired by history or literature. Breaking out of one set of norms requires that we have an available alternative.
People giving a Nazi salute, with an unidentified person (possibly August Landmesser or Gustav Wegert) refusing to do so. Photo from wikipedia, CC BY-SA.
That said, some people may have more naturally non-conformist personalities than others, at least in periods of their lives. Whether such rebels are successful in breaking out, however, may partly depend on how convincingly they can justify to themselves, and defend to others, that we don’t want to conform.
If so, we would expect a tendency to adopt non-standard norms to be linked to verbal ability and perhaps general intelligence in individuals who actually rebel, which there’s some evidence to support.
How we react to unfairness may also affect our propensity to rebel. One study found that people who are risk averse and easily trust others are less likely to react strongly to unfairness. While not proven in the study, it may make such individuals more likely to conform.
Another factor is social circumstances. The upper and middle classes in Germany during the 1920s-1940s were almost twice as likely to join the Nazi party than those with lower social status. So it may be that those who have the most to lose and/or are keen to climb the social ladder are particularly likely to conform. And, of course, if other members of your social circle are conforming, you may think it’s the “appropriate” thing to do.
Few will fight Gilead after carefully weighing up the consequences – after all, the most likely outcome is failure and obliteration. What drives forward fights against an oppressive society is a rival vision – a vision of equality, liberty and justice, and a sense that these should be defended, whatever the consequences.
Nick Chater is Professor of Behavioral Science at the University of Warwick’s Warwick Business School.
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Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
@redvip2000
Did you see what happened inside that car? You actually think that he simply said he was a gun owner and the cop pulled out a gun and shoot him....smh.
No I didn't see what happened inside the car before he was shot, but I heard it. And yes I actually think that he simply said he was a gun owner and the cop pulled out a gun and shot him, so you can s your h all you want. I wonder how you'd feel if this happened to a member of your family: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85Y_yOm9IhA
I bet if Kennedy had been a black man, you'd find a way to justify his assassination.
What a ridiculous example of racism. Let's see... a pretty young girl getting preferential treatment. Gees what a shocker. I've been home and wondering what is crossing people's minds to feel that they to join this race bait protest. I understand now who is protesting.
That's your opinion, so I'm not really going to get into that. All I'm saying is that if the judge could talk to the white females personally, a member of the staff should have been willing to pass him an envelope from a black guy. Stay home and keep wondering, because obviously you don't understand a goddamn thing.
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Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
@Simon
Can you point to any rights they don't have or way they are not treated equally?
I really don't know how to explain this to you if you don't understand already. Yes on paper all people have rights, but that's not the issue. It's the way institutions and people in authority treat people of color. Do you really think that a cop would shoot a white man after being informed by that same white man that he is a licensed gun owner? And not only that. Do you think he would shoot a white licensed gun owner in front of his girlfriend and her daughter? I guess you think that black people were treated equally during the civil rights movement also.
Then why the "black" part? Why be exclusionary and then demand support and accuse people of racism if they don't give it?
Because black people are treated differently. It's not being exclusionary. It's putting the focus on the fact that being black usually means being treated differently. I'll give you an example. It's not a matter of life or death, but it is something. I have a friend who got a traffic ticket. He planned on fighting the ticket, and even wrote a letter to the judge about it. He didn't mail the letter. He figured he could just have someone hand the letter to the judge when he got to the courthouse. When he arrived, he noticed how the young pretty white girls were allowed to go back and talk to the judge personally. But when he just requested to have his note given to the judge, they told him that anything he had to say to the judge could wait until the trial. No that's not as serious as being killed by police, but I guarantee you that if he had been a white female, or even a white male, he would have had no problems with communicating with that judge.
Again, this doesn't just happen to black people, why does BLM claim it does?. There are worse examples. Making it a "black" issue is misleading and unsupported by evidence.
I don't think BLM claims that these things only happen to black people. But based on the long history of racism against blacks, denying that they continue to be treated as "lesser than" is very disingenuous. I like what Quetzal said about it. Can you post some instances of worse examples?
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Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
@Anony Mous
It's funny how the first site you refer to describes itself as an "entertainment gossip news site". Actual news seems to be of least importance to them. I believe that I asked you to post facts and proof.
So a group of white people protested by saying anti-racist slogans. What's your point?
Both the Forbes article and the Witness BCC article were written by white men in support of BLM. The "pass the mic" thing is not a racist phrase. It just means, "let's listen to what black people have to say about this."
Here are some interesting quotes from the Vice article:
"Some view the partnership that’s emerged between certain chapters and antifa as symbiosis: Antifa is willing to use violence or even damage property to discourage racist gatherings so Black Lives Matter, which is nonviolent, doesn’t have to."
“Though we don’t agree with antifa’s tactics and strategy and adventurism, we respect their willingness to put their bodies on the line to fight fascists,” Brown said. While Black Lives Matter organizers were up on a platform with megaphones, black-clad antifa behaved like security, securing the perimeters of the protest up to where the far-right rally was held.
"However, not all Black Lives Matter chapters are down with the idea of an antifa security detail."
"Carico said that some Black Lives Matter chapters are worried that antifa will unnecessarily escalate tensions at their events, or hijack their messaging."
"There’s also concern that coordinating with antifa could do bad things for Black Lives Matter’s reputation."
“Coordination could change the public perception of Black Lives Matter, where people mistake that coordination as an endorsement of violence,” said Pete Simi, an expert in extremist groups and an associate professor of sociology at Chapman University in Orange, California. “Coordinating and being part of are two different things, but that distinction can get lost in the public eye."
For example, right-wing media and President Donald Trump have previously lumped the two movements together under the term “Alt-Left”
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There is no proof in that video that BLM told anyone to do anything. That article didn't even mention BLM. What I saw was one immature young woman and a few people that clapped for her off camera. Please prove that any of those people are BLM protesters.
Please show me where I implied that Trayvon Martin was lynched.
Please post evidence showing that Trayvon Martin was "yet another criminal".
So you're on that psycho George Zimmerman's side in this whole thing? (I don't even know what to say about that one.)
From what I understand, the KKK is not currently recognized as a terrorist organization. The act of 1871 merely restricted some of their activities, (as much as you could "restrict" the activities of a white supremacist group in 1871.) If you can show otherwise, I'll stand corrected.
Please prove that the shooting, robbing, and vandalizing in St. Louis was carried out by BLM protesters.
As to your last point, I don't have to engage in fallacies. Please refer back to the quotes I mentioned from the Vice article.
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Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
@Anony Mous
1.) I specifically mentioned BLM, which was founded in 2013 in response to the acquittal of the man who murdered Trayvon Martin. Its founders are Alicia Garza, Opal Tometi, and Patrisse Cullors. I don't know much about Antifa, but if you can post some facts about the group, I will be glad to take a look at them.
2.) BLM does not have the same goals for a different skin color, which would be black supremacy. To suggest that BLM is similar to the KKK or Nazis in any way is pure and utter nonsense. Yeah sure, three black women got together and decided to start a movement in response to a psycho getting acquitted in the senseless murder of a 17 year old unarmed black boy. That's right up there with Emmett Till, lynchings, and the Holocaust.
3.) If what you're saying is true, it's funny how BLM can all of a sudden be considered a terrorist group, while the KKK is not.
4.) I'm not familiar with any of the phrases, but please post a link to that information so I can see it for myself. Please post links to the kneeling and the black history incident also.
5.) Please post links showing how BLM sees blacks as superior or more worthy or more necessary of legal and societal protections.
6.) Please post proof that David Dorn's killer, as well as the killers of the other victims, were BLM protesters and not just random looters/criminals.
BLM/Antifa's goals are exactly the same as any other fascist group from the past.
I see what you did there. You threw in the phrase "any other" like it belonged. This is what fascism actually means:
A political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition.
Now please explain to me how BLM fits that definition. I'll wait...
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Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
And then they have the nerve to treat his girlfriend like an animal. Imagine the trauma that little girl has to deal with: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MC9fjLfb9pg
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246
Black Lives Matter—Do You Agree With Their Philosophy?
by minimus ini agree with people who say all lives matter.
i think blm is a racist group.
if white people pushed an agenda saying white lives matter, some people would have a conniption..
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rh3988
Black Lives Matter is not a "racist" group. Black Lives Matter is a movement within the black community that advocates for the human rights and equal treatment of black people. The Nazis were a racist group. The Ku Klux Klan is a racist group. BLM is a human rights group that wants to put an end to cops getting away with things like this: https://www.nsfwyoutube.com/watch?v=PD1bXyO05No
Yes all lives matter. This is true. But all lives don't seem to be in immediate danger of being turned into a piece of Swiss cheese in front of their loved ones just for reaching for a wallet. The cop in that video got away scot-free. And remember, there is a difference between looting and protesting. Don't blame BLM because idiots come out under the cover of "justice" wanting to throw rocks, set fires, and steal televisions.
By the way, what Drew Brees said was insensitive, and he has apologized for it. A piece of cloth is not worth more than life, especially when what that piece of cloth is supposed to represent doesn't include you. So if people want to kneel in protest, they have every right to do so.
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Organized Rioting Across America Due To A Black Man’s Death
by minimus incities across america have been pillaged and destroyed these last few days.
a white policeman has been charged with murder of a black man.
protests have been organized across major us cities and horrible riots have occurred.
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rh3988
If them people like George Floyd would just keep to their own kind, we wouldn't be having these problems.
I hope that was sarcasm.
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Organized Rioting Across America Due To A Black Man’s Death
by minimus incities across america have been pillaged and destroyed these last few days.
a white policeman has been charged with murder of a black man.
protests have been organized across major us cities and horrible riots have occurred.
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rh3988
the cops put the guy on his stomach specifically to reduce the risk of sudden death which they talk about in the video.
It's so obvious that they were just trying to help the poor man. And the Ku Klux Klan was just trying to help black people reach their full potential.
