I was surprised when this was read at our meeting this week because it wasn't posted here first. I wonder if the org is wising up to releasing letters too early.
leaving_quietly
JoinedPosts by leaving_quietly
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BORG running low on $$$??
by fader77 indear brothers:.
re: personal literature supply.
reducing existing stock at the branch office before the revisions are released.
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How would you answer?
by punkofnice ina friend of mine (who is waking up), recently had the elders do a sheep herding visit.. they were browbeating my friend about attending meetings.
my friend has been ill and unable to attend anyway.. what response would you give to this garbage?.
if we were in a house and it was on fire and we couldnt walk we would have to crawl.. an example of a sister with an iron lung was brought up to show that if shes in this condition, we need to examine ourselves.
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leaving_quietly
If we were in a house and it was on fire and we couldn’t walk we would have to crawl.
Uhhh... what does this have to do with attending meetings?
A n example of a sister with an iron lung was brought up to show that if she’s in this condition, we need to examine ourselves.
This sister was confined to a machine 24 hours a day. Her account does not say at all that she went to meetings in this condition, but that people visited her and that she looked for every opportunity to witness.
My friend apparently needs to pray for Holeeeeee Spirit to give the 'power beyond what is normal'.
Paul wasn't discussing going to meetings. He was talking about enduring despite challenges.
Going to meetings is not optional but a command. (I have to say I've never heard of it being a 'command' to attend).
Please show me where it says it's a command. Oh, and please look up the definition of "forsake" in the dictionary.
We need to look at a divine hand in our life. Eldurr said that he shouldn’t be alive. In so many situations he can see God's hand in his life.
And the point is...?
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July WT Study magazine - How can any intelligent person believe these things??
by Faithful Witness ini haven't been paying attention, i admit... but thought i would go and look at their latest magazine, and see what my parents are spending their precious energy on this month.
my mom retired in may, and we have seen her just once since then.
our invitations have been rejected, due to meetings, conventions, service work requirements, etc.
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leaving_quietly
Witness of Jesus = Witness of Jehovah - (Yes, you can call yourself a Christian, and still be a Jehovahian)
([Jesus] came to be a witness of his Father [Jehovah]... in fact, he was the best Witness of Jehovah EVERRRRR...and since no one could ever be a witness of Jesus Christ, if Jehovah had not sent him here, then everyone who witnesses for Jesus, is actually witnessing for Jehovah. When you Witness for Jehovah, you are witnessing his [Jehovah's] power to appoint Jesus to rule over his earthly Kingdom!! Hallelu-Jehovah! Ohhhh... how did I ever miss that connection? It was so obvious and simple all along! ... Thank you, faithful and discreet slave, for that little twist on the truth. Spinning it around like that, it suddenly becomes SO clear! It all makes perfect sense now. How do I become one of Jehovah's Witnesses [of Jesus's Witness of Jehovah's power to give Jesus the power to save us from death]?)
JWs are quick to point out that Jesus was described as "the Faithful Witness" (capital F and capital W) in Revelation 1:8 and "the faithful and true witness" at Revelation 3:14. But very few are aware that God gave witness about his son. (1 John 5:9). Both are witnesses about EACH OTHER.
1 John 5:11,12 makes this powerful point: "And this is the witness, that God gave us everlasting life, and this life is in his Son. The one who has the Son has this life; the one who does not have the Son of God does not have this life."
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A Different Kind of Apocalypse
by Ingenuous ini made a version of this cake for the step-kid's birthday:.
rainbow cake recipe inspires comment apocalypse.
yes, things were frozen.
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leaving_quietly
That's pretty awesome! Do you have a pic of yours?
BTW, kudos for using the term "Apocalypse" correctly. It means, literally, "revealing" or "uncovering", which is exactly what this cake does. Nice!
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Are they still teaching christ millinial 1000yrs then letting satan loose again????????? sheech
by dugout inwhat are ur thoughts on this subject just wondering.
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leaving_quietly
And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven with the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand. He seized the dragon, the original serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for 1,000 years. And he hurled him into the abyss and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he would not mislead the nations anymore until the 1,000 years were ended. After this he must be released for a little while. - Rev 20:1-3
The only problem with this teaching is calling it "Christ's Millenial Reign". Revelation says Satan will be bound in the abyss for 1000 years. It also says in verse 6 that those who are part of the first resurrection will rule with Christ for the 1000 years. However, the Bible is clear elsewhere that Christ's rulership last much longer, and had actually started after his resurrection. So, it would be better to call this the something like the "Millenial Co-Reigning of the Chosen Ones", or the "Millenial Abyssing of Satan", or something like that. Other than that, the teaching matches what the Bible says in these verses.
Is there some problem with this teaching other that what I've identified already?
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Topics Ive Been Pondering On
by JWINQUESTION inthis is my first post on here so bear with me.
currently i am still an active jw with serious questions about the jw org.
i was hesitant signing up but really need as much input from the people on this forum to get a clear understanding on things.
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leaving_quietly
Welcome to the board. First, your questions and comments are not at all bad. I feel pretty much the same way. The problem, for me, is in the doctrines. Specifically, claiming to speak for God and being so dogmatic about their teachings and practices to the point that if we don't fall in line, we are expelled from the organization and our families cannot speak to us.
I am still an active, in good standing JW. But I have found many doctrines and practices to be unscriptural. The WT study this past weekend that said that we must reject unscriptural teachings, regardless of the source, weighs on me heavily.
Does WTBTS teach things that are unscriptural? A deeper study into doctrines unique to JWs shows that, yes, some are. For example, please find for me ANY scripture that teachings that only 144,000 go to heaven. If you can find it, then I'll deem it scriptural. If you cannot, then it is unscriptural, right?
Anyway, welcome again. Best wishes on your journey, whereever it may lead.
~LQ
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July WT Study magazine - How can any intelligent person believe these things??
by Faithful Witness ini haven't been paying attention, i admit... but thought i would go and look at their latest magazine, and see what my parents are spending their precious energy on this month.
my mom retired in may, and we have seen her just once since then.
our invitations have been rejected, due to meetings, conventions, service work requirements, etc.
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leaving_quietly
Paragraph 15 on page 32: "Thus, being hated for bearing Jehovah's name is the same as 'being reproached for the name of [Jesus] Christ,' who said to his opposers: 'I have come in the name of my Father, but you do not receive me.' (John 5:43)
This actually bears looking at closer, both paragraphs 14 and 15.
Par 14:
Today, millions may claim to be Christians, "but they disown [God] by their works, because they are detestable and disobedient and not approved for good work of any sort." (Titus 1:16) It is good for us to remember that in the first century, genuine Christians were hated by many--if not the majority--of their contemporaries. That is why the apostle Peter wrote: "If you are being reproached for the name of Christ, you are happy, because . . . the spirit of God . . . is resting upon you."--1 Pet 4:14.
Comments: Why leave a part of 1 Pet 4:14? In it's entirety, it reads:
If you are being reproached for the name of Christ, you are happy, because the spirit of glory, yes, the spirit of God, is resting upon you.
Is there something about this WTBTS is ashamed of???
Par 15:
Can those inspired words be applied to Jehovah's Witnesses today? Yes, indeed, because we bear witness to Jesus' kingship. Thus, being hated for bearing Jehovah's name is the same as "being reproached for the name of [Jesus] Christ," who said to his opposers: "I have come inthe name of my Father, but you do not receive me." (John 5:43) So the next time you experience opposition in your witnessing work, take courage. Such mistreatment is proof that you have God's smile of approval and that his spirit "is resting upon you."
Comments: What is this bait and switch? "bearing witness to Jesus' kingship" is not the same as "bearing Jehovah's name". The transition in thought here is just strange.
What about all the other people / groups who bear witness to Jesus' kingship? There are plenty more out there than Jehovah's Witnesses who believe Christ is king. This doesn't make JWs special.
As for bearing witness to Jesus' kingship, this is a red herring. Nowhere in the Bible are we told to bear witness to Jesus' kingship. We are to bear witness about Jesus, but neither the phrase "bear witness" nor "bearing witness" occurs in any verse in connection with his kingship.
As for being hated for bearing Jehovah's name being the same as being reproached for the name of Christ, this is simply a false claim. How is this the same? In this same article, in paragraph 5, they DO make a distinction: "Why did Jesus say: "You will be witnesses of me," not of Jehovah? Jesus could have said the latter, but the ones whom he addressed were Israelites and as such were already witnesses of Jehovah." So, we see that the Israelites already bore Jehovah's name but were NOT reproached for that. They only were reproached when they started bearing Christ's name.
As for experiencing opposition in the witnessing work being proof of God's smile approval, what about others who also witness who experience opposition, such as Mormons or Baptists or other evangelical groups? If it's proof for us then it's proof for them because ALL of those groups claim to come in Christ's name.
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Today's WT study!. Watch out for the "wicked" in the cong!
by stuckinarut2 inhow strange today's study was!.
warning examples of apostacy, and saying to all witnesses "watch for bad associations in the cong".
talk about paranoia and distrust amongst themselves!.
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leaving_quietly
@Bobcat, what you said is exactly why I don't comment anymore.
I wanted to comment on the phrase "renounce unrighteousness" since the Greek word for what the NWT translates as "renounce" is, quite ironically, "Apostētō", which means "let depart", "abstain from", "draw away". This should actually translate to "let him depart from unrightousness" or "let him abstain from unrighteousness".
The word "renounce" is an interesting choice. The primary definition of renounce in English is: " formally declare one's abandonment of". Th
What Paul was actually saying here is: "Apostasize yourself from unrighteousness".
How do you like that? The word "apostacize" can have a GOOD meaning!
Check out the following link for synonyms for "apostacize" and look farther down at the related words. Yep, there's "renounce".
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w14 12/15-E Study Edition
by wifibandit inclick "premium download".
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pdf: http://bayfiles.net/file/1kv2k/uaqn2y/w_e20141215.pdf.
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leaving_quietly
More revisionism in the Insight book. This WT has the article about grasping the meaning and discusses the mustard grain in Matt 13:31,32. It describes the birds. If you look back through the publications, the birds went through a change in meaning from 'enemies of the Kingdom', 'the wicked one' to 'righthearted ones'.
Man's Salvation, 1975 says: "Whom did he explain those “birds” to be like? “The wicked one,” “the Devil.” That is to say, the earthly agents of the wicked Devil."
This remained until 2008, (w08 7/15 p. 18 par. 8): "These birds do not represent enemies of the Kingdom who try to eat up the good seeds, as was true of the birds in the illustration of the man who scattered seed on different kinds of soil. (Mark 4:4) Rather, in this illustration the birds represent righthearted ones who seek protection within the confines of the Christian congregation. Even now, these ones are protected from the spiritually defiling habits and unclean practices of this wicked world."
Interestingly, the Insight book under "Illustrations" on page 1179, says:
The mustard grain was tiny and so it could be used to designate anything extremely small. (Lu 17:6) When fully developed, some mustard plants actually attain a height of 3 to 4.5 m (10 to 15 ft) and have sturdy branches, thus virtually becoming “a tree,” as Jesus said. We are helped to identify the “tree” if we take note of the fact that the series of illustrations in which this one is included was introduced at Matthew 13:13-15 by a statement regarding a negative factor. It should also be noted that in the context “birds” are referred to in a negative sense; they are shown to represent “the wicked one.”—Mt 13:4, 19; Lu 8:12. (WT Library CD 2013 Edition, Insight book, Illustrations, p. 1179)
The Insight book on wol.jw.org changes this:
The mustard grain was tiny and so it could be used to designate anything extremely small. (Lu 17:6) When fully developed, some mustard plants actually attain a height of 3 to 4.5 m (10 to 15 ft) and have sturdy branches, thus virtually becoming “a tree,” as Jesus said. In a comparable way, the Christian congregation started in a very small way on Pentecost 33 C.E. But in the first century, it grew rapidly, and in modern times, the branches of the mustard “tree” have expanded to beyond expectations.—Isa. 60:22. (Watchtower Online, Insight book, Illustrations)
Just thought you'd like to be aware of this. Apparently, they are editing multiple subjects in the Insight book. If you have your hard copies, keep them.
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The insensitivity and opportunistic nature of witness at the 9/11 site !
by stuckinarut2 ini saw an online post with pictures of all the witnessing carts all around the 9/11 site during the anniversary of the tragedy.... im appalled at how opportunistic they are, and how they prey on people in a mourning and vulnerable state!.
apparantly they boast of: "there are 65 carts, with 200 witnesses manning the area... and so far 15 new studies started!".
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leaving_quietly
Let's see: considering that their target audience here are very vulnerable emotionally...
200 people
65 carts
Only 15 studies??? (These can't really be counted as studies until the THIRD study, so I'm thinking they got 15 people to give them their contact info to be called on at a later time. I doubt these are ACTUALLY studies.)
Essentially, only one in 13 of those 200 JWs got someone to give their contact info.
And only 4(ish) visits per cart. (EDIT: probably a lot more visits than this, but only 4 per cart who gave contact info)
While higher than normal results, keep in mind the emotionalism of the event.