jgnat said:
"She would have lived longer with further blood transfusions. She was deceived in to believing that quack remedies could substitute for blood."
--> EXACTLY!!!
Also, I wonder if the court-mandated transfusion would have been more beneficial if the patient wasn't under the stress of thinking that they were "the equivalent of rape".
See the WTS self fulfilling prophecy in action? They said "Transfusions are useless, dangerous, and make god angry." Then, when the patient is given a forced transfusion, they are at maximum stress level, due to their beleiving the WTS lies. As a result of the stress, their condition deteriorates. At this point the WTS says "See? we told you they were useless".
In the end, this case must make WTS very happy. They get everything they want: supposed "proof" that transfusions don't work (of course, they do, but don't tell JWs that); proof that Satan wants to violate JWs with the 'rape' of transfusions, and most importantly, a martyr to top it off. Could not have worked out better for WTS if they had written the script themselves. They must be thrilled.
From the Globe and Mail article:
"“There's no evidence to support any claims against us,” the teen's lawyer, David Gnam, told reporters outside the court."
Uuuummm.... the teen's lawyer? Doesn't globe and mail know that David Gnam is a Watchtower lawyer? Isn't it clear that although he claims/claimed to be present Bethany "pro bono", that due to the intimate and inextricable connection between Gnam and WTS, that he clearly was in a CONFLICT OF INTEREST situation? And why doesn't the Law Society of Upper Canada know about Gnam's SANCTIONABLE BEHAVIOR?
Also, doesn't this sound like something Bart Simpson would say?
Homer: "Boy, did you steal a cookie?"
Bart: "You can't prove that!... um, I mean.... there's no evidence to support any claim that I stole a cookie" (as he finishes destroying the evidence by shredding it... I mean, eating it.
~Q
Posts by Quotes
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25Damn, Lawrence Hughes' Case Was Thrown Out of Court...
by jamiebowers inbut he promises to appeal.. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/rtgam.20080620.wtransfusion21/bnstory/national/home.
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83
2008 Drama on YouTube. Oh boy!
by Open mind infellow jwders,.
let us join in giving heart-felt thanks to the loyal worshiper of jehovah who took the time to post this year's dc drama on youtube.. i'm sure the wt is cool with this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6vfmgkwfp4&feature=related.
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Am I the only person that thinks is is funny, or perhaps over-the-top stupid, that they stagehands that setup and break down the scenes, are in period costume?
Is that really necessary?
Does WTS really think that we have some illusion that we have been trasnported back in time, and are totally lost in the play, and they don't want to break the forth wall by having non-costumed stagehands?
What is going on in the minds of the directors that they think costumed stagehands is necessary?
~Q -
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2008 Drama on YouTube. Oh boy!
by Open mind infellow jwders,.
let us join in giving heart-felt thanks to the loyal worshiper of jehovah who took the time to post this year's dc drama on youtube.. i'm sure the wt is cool with this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6vfmgkwfp4&feature=related.
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Quotes
I posted a comment on the first scene.
Since the comments are moderated, I'll bet money that they won't approve my comment.
For the record, the dangerous, offensive comment I posted was:
"Question: what scripture(s) was this based on?"
I know, pretty subversive stuff, eh? Imagine my nerve. Asking what scriptures from, you know, the bible, were used to prepare this play that was supposed to be based on, you know, the bible!
:)
~Q -
47
Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!???
by Quotes ini was speaking to my mom on the phone yesterday, and despite my trying to avoid it, we got to talking about wacky jw topics -- again.
actually, it was nearly unavoidable, since she had just returned from her summer convention.
aside: nice way to celebrate your wedding anniversary, mom & dad; at an assembly!
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kerj2leev said:
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No shit! Stop bitching about not being called on. Grow up and move on!! -----
Wasanelder Once said:
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Those of you who DA'd or are actively speaking against the congregation, what makes you think they are stupid enough to waste their time? It's hardly fair to complain that they are falling down on their job when the are respecting your wishes by not calling.
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kerj2leev,
Let me be clear: I DO NOT want any elder's calling me. If you re read my original post, I think you will find it is missing any "bitching". I am simply pointing out that it appears that the elder's don't follow the "mercy rules" which they claim to follow -- the fact that this makes me very happy, notwithstanding. According to some who have responded here, the elders actually LIE to their superior (CO) to further the charade, is, IMO, significant.
I have no doubt that if we were talking about Catholic Priests not performing some act of shepperding, yet claimed to their congregation that they did that particular act, and even lied about it to the Bishop, this dereliction of duties would be spamvertised at every chance the Watchtower gets in their vacuous monthly rags.
Wasandleder Once,
I agree, likely there may be some subjective sorting of who will get called and who won't, based on the elders perception of the situation.
But IMO that is a weak defence. Firstly, the whole (alleged) point of the program is the see if the person's situation or attitude has changed. If the elders decide, a priori, that the person's situation hasn't changed, and they don't make any attempt to find out, then they will never know if/when it happens. IOW this subjective selective sorting befuddles the entire point of the program.
Secondly, it is a case of special pleading. Why can they make subjective descisions to judge the heart condition of these former members, without enquiry, and yet the general public never gets the same consideration? For example: a non-JW householder could say, plainly, "I am and will always be a Unitarian. There is no need to come back to my house. I will not change." And yet, every time the territory is worked -- sometimes as frequently as every 3 months, sometimes every few years -- that Unitarian householder will have the JWs knocking on their door (unless, of course, they are savvy enough to explicitly demand to go on the Do Not Call list). In fact, the whole "we never know when someone'e heart may change" is the standard rejoinder to the complaint "Why do you keep calling on me?" So to say it is OK for elders to be subjective in one situation, but not another, is, IMO, special pleading.
~Q -
47
Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!???
by Quotes ini was speaking to my mom on the phone yesterday, and despite my trying to avoid it, we got to talking about wacky jw topics -- again.
actually, it was nearly unavoidable, since she had just returned from her summer convention.
aside: nice way to celebrate your wedding anniversary, mom & dad; at an assembly!
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Thanks for the input, TMS.
That part about reporting "duty completion" to the CO is particularly interesting.
~Q -
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Ever fake ring a bell? Take a long time writing down not at homes?
by yourmomma inmy whole life, even when i pioneered, i dreaded field service.
i was always uncomfertable rolling up to peoples houses uninvited.
so i used to have this technique where i would pretend to ring the bell.
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No, I never faked a knock.
No, I never faked a doorbell ring.
Yes, I was an idiot.
Seriously where were all these great ideas when I really needed them?
~Q -
47
Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!???
by Quotes ini was speaking to my mom on the phone yesterday, and despite my trying to avoid it, we got to talking about wacky jw topics -- again.
actually, it was nearly unavoidable, since she had just returned from her summer convention.
aside: nice way to celebrate your wedding anniversary, mom & dad; at an assembly!
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Interesting; so far the consensus is that the "contact once per year" is yet another Elder Fairy Tale.
Hey, any former elders that *DID* make an effort to contact DF/DA persons? Anyone? If so, what was the situation? How did you decide who/when to call; and did you phone first or just go and knock on their door? Surely there are some interesting stories you can regale us with! ~Q -
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I just might attend this District Convention next Saturday
by Terry inreligion posted on mon, jun.
09, 2008reprint or licenseprintemail digg itdel.icio.usaimjehovah's witnesses to gather on six weekends in fort worthby terry lee goodrichstar-telegram staff writer most-read stories .
more than 42,000 jehovah's witnesses from the north texas/south oklahoma district will converge on fort worth over six weekends, with the first of the three-day events this weekend.
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As I understand it, anyone that does not have a "Convention Name Badge" will be immediately recognized as an outsider, and possibly followed or questioned. Of course, the name badges change every year, and you can only get one at the Kingdom Hall, weeks ago. On that topic, a few years ago, someone scanned the then-current Convention Badge and posted it here. A few minutes with a color printer, and bingo, your disguise is complete. I don't know if anyone has done that for this year's badge, though. ~Q
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JW and hate
by is there help out there inthere is a young jw at work and she states that she does not have anyone.
does the wt teach that all worldly people are evil and therefore jw must hate then.
if she does not hate them does this not make her a apostate.
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This is "Double-Think" in action.
JWs are taught to "hate the world and the things in the world" -- and "the world" means everyone and everything outside the JWs.
Yet, at the same time...
...they "love their fellow man, and want them to not be violently killed by the jealous, homicidal sky-daddy they call Jehovah, so out of this love, they preach their story and try to get converts, since only JWs will be preserved through this massive destruction (and even JWs have no guarantee; this Jahoobee can be quite tricky!).
Oh, and if you reject their message and don't join their religion, of if you decide to leave for any reason at all, you are evil and are to be hated. But they don't want to have to hate you, they want to love you, so please, please, don't make them hate you! After all, they love you so much. There is even a quote from a watchtower (I don't have it anymore) where they explain exactly how, in what sense, they HATE former members.
These two ideas may appear, to the outsider, to be mutually exclusive; but to the trained practitioner of Double-Think, there is NO contradiction, and both ideas can be and are held to be completely true.
~Q
P.S. No, it doesn't make any sense to me, either. -
47
Elders supposed contact DF&DA once every year???!!!???
by Quotes ini was speaking to my mom on the phone yesterday, and despite my trying to avoid it, we got to talking about wacky jw topics -- again.
actually, it was nearly unavoidable, since she had just returned from her summer convention.
aside: nice way to celebrate your wedding anniversary, mom & dad; at an assembly!
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Quotes
I was speaking to my mom on the phone yesterday, and despite my trying to avoid it, we got to talking about wacky JW topics -- again. Actually, it was nearly unavoidable, since she had just returned from her summer Convention.
Aside: nice way to celebrate your Wedding Anniversary, Mom & Dad; at an assembly!
Apparently, it was terribly cold inside the Belleville Ice Hockey Arena, and it got colder the closer you got to the speaker (thus proving, IMO, that the speakers are ghosts from the spiritual plane, exuding negative ghost energy), which means the elderly and infirm sitting on the ice area in front were in a meatlocker. Hhhhmmmm.... Cold environment plus elderly people sitting down, inactive for several hours per days, for 3.5 days. Not a good combination. I suppose Jahoobee didn't pour out his blessing this time -- but I digress.
Anyhow, when I mentioned that JWs *NEVER* call on me here (implying how ineffective their billions hours of "preaching work" is), she was concerned, but for an entirely different reason.
She was certain that "the elders contact every DF & DA person ONCE PER YEAR to determine if their situation or attitude has changed."
After I stopped laughing, which I eventually did through great effort, I assured Mom that the elder's had NEVER called me (since we parted ways 11 years ago), and furthermore, I told her that I know a large number of XJWs and I'm quite certain most or all of them have also never been contacted by the elders, as I pretty sure they would tell me if it happened.
"Hey, I'm in the phone book, mom. I'm not hiding. There is no excuse for someone to not contact me, other than they simply don't want to."
Come to think of it, they never had the guts to contact me directly the last time we had any dealings, in 2005; instead they hid behind their lawyer(s). Cowards!
Of course, this shocking revelation -- that some (all?) elders don't actually do some (all?) of "good works" they pretend they do -- won't be enough to awaken her from her WTS stupor. After all, if you can shrug off WTS's involvement with the UN, you can shrug off anything; but part of me hopes that the breaking of yet another WTS myth will eventually have some cumulative effect on her.
So, all my fellow former members, what is your experience? Have the local elders been contacting you?
Former elders: what is the official policy? Are they supposed to try and contact you? How often? And if they are, are there special purification rituals to be followed before and after, to prevent evil, satanic, corrupting -- erm, I mean intelligent and freethinking -- ideas from corrupting their holy elder minds?
~Q