Posts by Corney

4

Correspondence between GB and US Branch re WHQ relocation (2005-11)

by Corney in

seven years ago multiple letters between the governing body and the us branch committee, as well as internal memos and e-mails were provided by watchtower to a us dictrict court in the course of discovery in the ramapo property case.

these documents are public records available through pacer, and now they are available for free on the case page here: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/5373802/lorterdan-properties-at-ramapo-i-llc-v-watchtower-bible-and-tract/ (see document no.

45 and attachments).i have also compiled all the internal documents in chronological order here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/15q-1_cylhxgesb0z4pkr5fjohz7u_y-p/view?usp=sharing 124 pages is a minuscule part of their archives but i hope somebody will find these documents interesting..

Corney

If nothing else, it seems the GB are very hands on dealing with the property side of the business, judging by this evidence, their organisational spiritual/legal separation of the GB from Watchtower in 2000 notwithstanding,

Exactly.

Also, the documents show Watchtower planned WHQ relocation as early as 2005 (don't know whether this info is new).

As to their reorganizations, there is another funny GB letter in this regard: "Also, in view of the privacy law’s express exemption of ‘small businesses’... we wonder if the formation of a new legal entity that would supervise religious activities only, but would receive little if any income, might come within the statutory exemption with respect to any judicial or other personal records it would keep. (Mark 12:17; Romans 13:1, 7)" (the Australian Branch was pretty skeptical about this idea).

I'm also curious if other court records contain similar internal WT documents.

25

U.S. Supreme Court Denies Watchtower’s Certiorari Plea

by Jerome56 in

https://www.supremecourt.gov/search.aspx?filename=/docket/docketfiles/html/public/19-40.html.

.

Corney

Slidin Fast,

This was the case where WT clocked up enormous daily fines and lost the case but still did not disclose.

No, this was the case where the judge awarded the plaintiff $4 million without trial because of Watchtower's refusal to provide files received by it in response to the 1997 BOE letter. The appellate court affirmed that ruling creating a very dangerous precedent for the org.

It seems to me to be a very big victory.

IMO, it's not very big but still significant. On the one hand, SCOTUS denial of certiorari doesn't create any precedent and doesn't mean the Court affirms lower courts' decisions - it just doesn't review them. On the other hand, Watchtower has lost its first attempt to bring a child sexual abuse case (and now apparently the first CSA case lost by WT which hasn't eventually been settled) to the US Supreme Court and the Court won't disturb the precedent established by the CA appellate court.

It leaves WT no where to go in its fight not disclose the child molestation records.

No, Watchtower is still continuing this fight. For example, they've orchestrated a lawsuit of a group of JWs (three victims, three victims' relatives, including an individual "accused of, investigated for, and exonerated of, sexual abuse of his daughter," and one elder) requiring annulment of a discovery order issued in Orange County, CA as violating their "privacy rights and religious freedoms" (now pending before a CA appellate court).

4

Correspondence between GB and US Branch re WHQ relocation (2005-11)

by Corney in

seven years ago multiple letters between the governing body and the us branch committee, as well as internal memos and e-mails were provided by watchtower to a us dictrict court in the course of discovery in the ramapo property case.

these documents are public records available through pacer, and now they are available for free on the case page here: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/5373802/lorterdan-properties-at-ramapo-i-llc-v-watchtower-bible-and-tract/ (see document no.

45 and attachments).i have also compiled all the internal documents in chronological order here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/15q-1_cylhxgesb0z4pkr5fjohz7u_y-p/view?usp=sharing 124 pages is a minuscule part of their archives but i hope somebody will find these documents interesting..

Corney

Seven years ago multiple letters between the Governing Body and the US Branch Committee, as well as internal memos and e-mails were provided by Watchtower to a US dictrict court in the course of discovery in the Ramapo property case. These documents are public records available through PACER, and now they are available for free on the case page here: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/5373802/lorterdan-properties-at-ramapo-i-llc-v-watchtower-bible-and-tract/ (see Document no. 45 and attachments).

I have also compiled all the internal documents in chronological order here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/15Q-1_CYlHxGeSB0z4PKr5FJohZ7u_Y-p/view?usp=sharing

124 pages is a minuscule part of their archives but I hope somebody will find these documents interesting.

32

READ: Watchtower's SCOTUS petition

by Corney in

on june 25, 2019 watchtower ny filed petition for a writ of certiorari in the u.s. supreme court.

the society asks to reconsider a $4 million judgment against it in a california child abuse case.

docket: https://www.supremecourt.gov/search.aspx?filename=/docket/docketfiles/html/public/19-40.html .

Corney

Eustace, this petition had nothing to do with the Conti case.

32

READ: Watchtower's SCOTUS petition

by Corney in

on june 25, 2019 watchtower ny filed petition for a writ of certiorari in the u.s. supreme court.

the society asks to reconsider a $4 million judgment against it in a california child abuse case.

docket: https://www.supremecourt.gov/search.aspx?filename=/docket/docketfiles/html/public/19-40.html .

Corney

By an order (see p. 42) published 30 minutes ago, the U.S. Supreme Court has DENIED Watchtower's petition.

51

Annual Mtg Points

by ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara in

jw
friends

matt 28: 19 is the year text.

new understanding on joel ch 2 who are the locusts?.

there is a new building addition to warwick in the works.

Corney

Yes, it's a printed study edition of the NWT (Matthew - Acts)

More photos here

42

Elders accused of playing rape tape to victim, 15; case goes to Utah Sup. Court

by Corney in

a woman is suing a local congregation ("kingdom hall of jehovah’s witnesses, roy, utah, an unincorporated association"), individual elders and watchtower ny after, she claims, a judicial committee forced her to listen an audio recording of her own rape.

the trial court summarized the facts as alleged by the plaintiff as follows:.

at the time of the judicial committee, plaintiff was fifteen years old.

Corney

On September 27, the Supreme Court of Utah granted writ of certiorary in that case to answer the question:

Does the Establishment Clause [separation of church and state] of the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, as applied to Utah through the Fourteenth Amendment, bar all claims for intentional infliction of emotional distress [IIED] arising out of religiously motivated conduct?

- and to decide whether an IIED claim against Roy, UT congregation, four elders and Watchtower NY can go to a jury.

The case will be heard next year.

51

FAKE-NEWS.JW.ORG

by lastmanstanding in

the current “news” on jw.borg.

https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/.

look closely at he picture of “russian” police breaking in to what appears to be a utility shed.. first, you’d have to be a complete moron to believe anything you see.. the “police” are shown using a garden pic to open a door.

Corney

lastmanstanding,

607 BCE is a garbage - just like your posts.

As for the rest, you're really a master of deduction.

https://youtu.be/eKQOk5UlQSc

(I know I already posted it but it's too brilliant, I couldn't help myself).

Obviously,

Your trio of Warwick elders storming a Mormon bomb-making facility.

Athanasius,

The video I've posted six days ago proved beyond any reasonable doubt that the initial post is a garbage. OP might either admit that or shut up. Instead, he's responded with multiple crazy unsubstantiated theories and accusations.

Moreover, that press release mentions a religious group declared "extremist" by the Russian Sup. Ct. There are only four such groups, and three of them are Islamic. The text also mentions group literature studies, preaching activities and an international site, and the video depicts a predominately female group. It could be only JWs, and nobody else. In other words, that page contained enough information. Not to mention nobody disputed that were JWs until you intervened (I don't blame you, just explain why I didn't need to provide that broadcast before).

It's not my fault that someone is so stubborn.

51

FAKE-NEWS.JW.ORG

by lastmanstanding in

the current “news” on jw.borg.

https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/.

look closely at he picture of “russian” police breaking in to what appears to be a utility shed.. first, you’d have to be a complete moron to believe anything you see.. the “police” are shown using a garden pic to open a door.

Corney

Athanasius,

No, it isn't a news report - it's a police press release. And you can compare it with another - but virtually the same - law enforcement agency's press release published in the same region on the same date: https://tomsk.sledcom.ru/news/item/1232729

You also can watch this local state TV report (at 0:10-0:18, 0:58-3:03): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Am0Fx6bjMI

I think now you are satisfied it were JWs.

Also, can you please say whether those articles and videos contain any claim or indication that the video in question was created by Watchtower or by anybody else other than the police? Or accusations of something other than proselytizing and conducting group literature studies - like, say, bomb making (lol)? I would be grateful for your response.

----

lastmanstanding,

As I expected, you were unable to address my arguments. I'll answer the single counter-argument you provided.

The blurred faces are the dubs, not the police.

First, some people whose faces were blurred are law enforcement officers (оперуполномоченные, or опера, who don't wear a uniform). Proofs are here: https://ibb.co/album/dmX4Tv

Second, my argument 3(b) that you ignored applies to JWs.

And as somebody whose native language is Russian and who studied Russian law and read thousands of pages of publicly available court decisions, "expert opinions", legal comments etc., not to mention countless media publications, I certainly can certify those things.

Nobody prevented you from defending your case. But you opted to clown around. You defaulted.

As Justice Holmes would write, five pages of fruitless discussions is enough. I'm not going to reply to your future comments in this thread (but I don't promise I won't). I hope Athanasius will be so kind to spend his time on this nothingburger - and then he'll confirm that your claims lack any merits.

Obviously,

Your trio of elders и примкнувший к ним Шипилов.

51

FAKE-NEWS.JW.ORG

by lastmanstanding in

the current “news” on jw.borg.

https://www.jw.org/en/news/legal/.

look closely at he picture of “russian” police breaking in to what appears to be a utility shed.. first, you’d have to be a complete moron to believe anything you see.. the “police” are shown using a garden pic to open a door.

Corney

Three comments, and no (counter-)arguments relating to the thread subject. So sad!

Well, last try.

I've reiterated and updated my arguments as follows:

1. The video have been first distributed by the Russian police (the Tomsk regional department of the Ministry of Interior, УМВД по Томской области). And neither the text nor the video nor media reports accuse Watchtower or someone else of "concocting" it. I can certify it.

2. Watchtower had no motive to fake the video which doesn't depict something extraordinary, extremely outrageous or very different from what depicted on other photos and videos distributed by the FSB, the Ministry of Interior and the Investigative Committee (examples: 1, 2, 3). The latter also proves its authenticity.

Moreover, AFAIK, Watchtower used only a single screenshot. Would it create a short film just to use a single picture? It makes no sense.

3. As to the blurred faces, the reasons for this are: a) to protect the identity of LE officers, especially police operatives (оперуполномоченные); b) to comply with the requirements of art. 152.1 of the Civ. Code ("Protection of the citizen's depiction") (despite there is no unified policy on this issue).

Case closed, unless you are able to provide valid counter-arguments.

-----

As to the last comment you posted: that's apples and oranges.

I never said or implied that the Witnesses or Watchtower must be immune from any prosecution.

I'm ok with prosecuting them for real crimes, if the basic rule of law & human rights requirements are met.

To the best of my knowledge, the Dutch law enforcement had legitimate reasons to conduct those raids, didn't acted in discriminatory manner, didn't humiliate or intimidate anyone and didn't plant evidences.

Summary: again, it's apples and oranges.