Posts by Saethydd

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

I got this one cofty. Because an all-powerful AND an all-loving creator wouldn't put innocent people in harm's way.

If he's all powerful that means he can save innocents, if he's all-loving that means he's motivated to save innocents. When motive is combined with ability in that regard, then no innocent people would be getting killed.

But they are getting killed. Which means either God can't save all the innocent people, or he's refusing to do it. Making him either ineffectual, or kind of a jerk.

Though, as I have stated, I believe the most probable situation is simply that no deity exists at all.

11

Book That Helped Me - My Recommended Reading List

by doubtfull1799 in

these are the books that led to my awakening:.

the art of thinking clearly - rolf dobelli.

how to defend the christian faith: advice from an evolutionist - john w.loftus.

Saethydd

Thanks, I'm going to look at as many of these as I can. It might not have any information new to you, but I have found Lloyd Evan's "Reluctant Apostate" to be very informative book, especially as a resource for helping anyone who doesn't know much about JWs to understand the position people like us are in right now.

14

My story

by victory in

my name is collins.

i am from nigeria.

i was born in the year 1997. i was raised by witness parents.

Saethydd

Wow, I can very much relate to this, I got baptized around 10 too, though I didn't get reproved until several years later. (They formed a judiciary committee for a 10/11-year-old? Wow! That is crazy.) I too am in an institution for higher education, disfellowshipped, and being compelled to go to meetings even though I hate them. I hope things work out well for both of us.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

For me, it basically comes down to probability.

Is it more probable that there is a God out there who cares enough about humanity to specially create us, but not to shield us from harm in our infancy? (Both as a species and as individuals) Or is it more likely that we are the rare result of the natural forces of the Universe?

Is it likely that the supernatural events recorded in the Bible, which have no confirmed modern events to parallel them, actually happened? Or is it more likely that they are simply another set of exaggerated stories that might be based very loosely on real events?

My belief in the supernatural, and by extension God is set at neutral and leans towards skeptical disbelief until such a time as I am given clear and objective evidence to the contrary. The fact that the state of Universe and humanity doesn't reflect what I would logically expect from a loving, all-knowing, and all-powerful creator merely reinforces that position, it is not the entire basis for it.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

Yes the Bible acknowledges death, predators, and natural disasters, but it does so by invoking victim blaming (sin), and basically saying it is our fault. This, however is inconsistent with a God that claims to be the embodiment of love. Because compassion and forgiveness are pretty important attributes of love, and they are not readily visible in the world around us.

Additonally, if the Bible truly came as a result of being inspired by a benevolent and all knowing being, then it would inevitably be scientifically, and prophetically accurate. So either God didn't inspire the Bible to the degree that it can be used as a guide to determine his will, or God is not all-knowing and is therefore a liar.

14

How can I succeed in life not being a jw again?

by victory in

jw
friends

when i was a jw, i was taught that i can never succeed in life if i leave the sect.

now that i am no longer a member of the fold, how can i succeed in this only life i have and achieve my dreams?.

Saethydd

You seem to have recognized that a successful life is possible away from the WTBS, and that's a good first step. I firmly believe that the best way to better yourself is through education, formal or informal, just commit yourself to it.

Now depending on your goals, formal education will have obvious advantages. If you want to something in an established company or do something that requires a license. (Doctor, engineer, teacher, etc.) then a formal education is probably necessary. If, however, you want to start something yourself or help to build something new with someone else, the skills are all that really matter.

But that only covers one aspect of success, if you want to find fulfillment then you should build friendships, practice altruism in your community, pursue your hobbies, travel, experience as much as you can.

8

Voting

by Gary 61 in

do jehovah witnesses vote in politics?

general elections and so on!.

Saethydd

In short, no you can't vote and remain a Witness. While they don't technically disfellowship (excommunicate) someone for that, they say that by such action one has "disassociated themselves." Which basically amounts to the same thing, perpetual shunning. (Interestingly, this is also how they handle someone who voluntarily receives a blood transfusion.)

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

God will remains a mystery because we are in a kind of test.
In this time we need free will. Free will needs total privacy. That's why nobody can read our thoughts.
Now in heaven nobody has free will because they saw God directly. At the time you see God there's a transformation and you can't be a human anymore.
There's no free will if you can see God. Like if you have to choose between a marble palace or a piece of chalk.
Jews say that the existence of God in this universe it's like the subtle flavor of wine left in a glass. That's enough for the game of life.
God can be reached through philosophy or/and intuition.
God is not a scientific experiment.
Search your intuition and you will know.
Try to develop your intuition doing some art.

Do you have an objective basis for any of this, or are pulling all of this out of your own... head?

Especially the part about what happens in heaven. Have you been there? Have you spoken to somebody from heaven? Have you read about from a reliable source? What makes your views on heaven any more insightful than a random person on the street?

The problem with basing something on pure intuition is that it can not be verified or examined outside your own head. It cannot possibly be objective, therefore it cannot be rational.

I can also make a logical argument about the following part of your statement.

Now in heaven nobody has free will because they saw God directly. At the time you see God there's a transformation and you can't be a human anymore.
There's no free will if you can see God. Like if you have to choose between a marble palace or a piece of chalk.

This makes no sense at all, even in your own illustration. There may be a reason to choose chalk over marble, for example, if you desire a writing tool, chalk would be the superior choice.

Additionally, why would you ever want to worship a being that will strip you of your free will?

22

Went to the assembly..some.personal thoughts on it.

by integ in

jw
friends

i've been as honest as i can on this forum throughout my time bouncing in and out..and been jumped on for saying anything positive about the "truth" or my experiences at the hall, but it's been a few years now since i have been attending meetings.

i go to the memorial for family reasons and went to the assembly today for the same reason...but one observation i have to make is most of us have all dealt with years of hearing how gawd awful "the world" is and how the only happiness is going to meetings and out in service.

now that is total bs.

Saethydd

You might enjoy an occasional session of quiet reflective meditation because that, at least, wouldn't have all the BS you have to ignore.

23

Looking for my little sister.

by DeadmanWalking in

i have a little sister havnt seen or heard from in 20 years she was da for attending a church she was 17 at the time she moved out and lived with a family not jw's in fact they are very a posed to jw's the past 20 years i've tried to make contact she won't respond all i know is she's got kids 2 or 3 of them she lives outside charlotte nc and works for a insurance company as an underwriter.

i think her husband is a police officer ?

being back in her life having a niece or nephew to watch grow up would be nice.

Saethydd

Have you already tried finding her on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter? I was able to get back in touch with my non-JW cousin through Facebook. I just sent him a message explaining how sorry I was for the years I had spent not talking to him, then I told him how much I missed him and wanted him back in my life. Maybe that could help here too.