Posts by Saethydd

22

I need help understanding my moms decision!

by Holzy86 in

first of all i'm not a jahovas witness, my mother is.

i've asked my mother for some help over the weekend for my sons birthday, i understand jw do not celebrate birthdays.. every year i take my son out for a treat day, this year he has asked me if he can bring friends too so i said i only have enough room for one but he has asked for two, so i said i will ask nanny if she will help out to take my other son in her car with my netphew and older sister, but as soon as i mentioned it was for a birthday treat she refused to help me.. i just need to know if jahovahs witnesses will refuse to help family out when asking for help, i feel i've asked and made sure all the people she will be giving a lift to that it is not there birthday.

his birthday has just happened to have fallen on the weekend when we would have been taking him because he is at school monday to friday.

Saethydd

Blah blah blah! Yeah I am stupid so what? Who cares if I'm thick and can't spell?
FYI i did go to the JW meetings and I even went knocking on doors I even listened to why JWS do not celebrate birthdays Christmas etc i was just a kid I was allowed to stop going at 14 because my mom loves me enough not to force religion rubbish on me. I was asking for a lift and all I wanted to know if all JWS would refuse it's all I was asking. Some people are a bit more lenient. I did ask my mom and we got it sorted she's helping me
I actually thought this was a JW forum for actual JW.
I'm not the one telling people how to live there life's or what to do I think you'll find there the annoying religious type who go knocking on doors preaching about a person who does not EXIST!
Please keep on telling me how jehovah hates me and all I do because you know what I don't care I will still sleep like a baby.

Ah, perhaps this has been something of a misunderstanding. The majority of the people on this forum are former Jehovah's Witnesses, many of whom are being shunned by their friends and family, or feel trapped into staying in the religion to avoid being shunned in such a manner.

When they say something like "Jehovah hates you." They merely mean according to the JW doctrines everyone who is not an active JW is "evil" and will thus be destroyed by God. They such things sarcastically because they think the notion ridiculous, not because they actually believe that God hates you.

I hope that helped clear up any confusion.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

So God went through the process of becoming a human when Adam & Eve sinned just so that he could subsequently die to remove the GUILT of Adamic sin but not the CONSEQUENCES of Adamic sin?

Yeah, that's doesn't sound right to me either. It would be like if someone was pardoned for their crimes by a ruler but still had to stay in prison. What's the point of the pardon?

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

Your response is fascinating. Hence the question(open to all, of course): Are beliefs merely a function of the intellect? For if they are, then those are understandably subject to changes. Else, they are impervious to external, transitory factors.

I would say it's wise to have beliefs that are subject to change. Beliefs should change as new information and evidence emerge, else one is simply deluding themselves.

43

It seems that many witnesses simply dont care about facts?

by stuckinarut2 in

i often wonder if the current crop of witnesses, especially the youth and younger ones simply don't care about facts?.

i mean for some, even with knowledge of the past scandals, misleading teachings, mistruths, etc etc, they simply don't care.

"it is the truth after all".. they are so intertwined in the operations and activities of the society, that they cant see anything outside of it.

Saethydd

Also, many of them refuse to accept such information as facts. They prefer... alternative facts, to coin a phrase.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

I was just relaxed. No drugs, alcohol, nothing. Normal conditions, inside my house, no depression, etc..

I'm a little late on this, but are you certain you didn't simply enter the hypnagogic state?

It's not uncommon for people to believe that they see ghosts and spirits and such in this state and be convinced that they were real. However, because you're relaxed your brainwaves have moved from Beta to Alpha which can trigger this state as one approaches light sleep.

20

Feeling the Guilt

by Saethydd in

i'm currently disfellowshipped and living at home with my parents, but because they are both still devout jws i have to keep going to the meetings and crap because i don't want to risk getting thrown out until i finish college or find a job that will let me support myself and go to college.. yesterday, my mother rode with me to the meeting and told me how much my best friend and my oldest sister are missing me, and it just tears me apart because during the meeting i was practically counting the minutes till it was over.

it didn't help matters that i had to sit with my family because the library was closed off, thus forcing me to follow along with the meeting on my tablet instead of reading something useful or interesting like i normally do.. when i got home i just cried out in frustration because it feels like no matter what i do, i am making the wrong choice.

either i have to keep pretending to support an organization that has caused so much pain to so many people, or i have to abandon my family and friends to it so i can save myself.

Saethydd

May I ask how old you are, and the basic reason for disfellowshipping? (no real details needed)

I'm currently 21, and I was disfellowshipped for doing something with my girlfriend that I considered wrong at the time, so I convinced myself that I needed to go to the elders about it. I'm glad I did, though, because getting disfellowshipped ended up being the catalyst I needed to finally face the doubts I had accumulated over the years and mentally escape from the religion before I spent decades of my life on it.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Saethydd

I know the question wasn't directed at me, but I do in fact wish that I could have a belief in a personal deity that cares about me and will allow me to continue my conscious existence after I die.

But like cofty I see so many things that I can't just disregard in order to hold on to that belief, no matter how much I would like for it to be true.

33

What are some things JWs re-name to make themselves different than Christians?

by NikL in

jw
friends

jws re-name things so they seem like they are different than other religions.

(of course we know they are different but that's another story).

i was just thinking about those things where they are like most everyone else in christendom but the re-name it to seem different.. for example god forbid they have a church, it's a "kingdom hall".. they don't have pastors and deacons they have "elders" and "ministerial servants".. they don't have tithing but they will have family heads fill out a paper saying how much they can contribute on a monthly basis (not sure if there is a name for that...unless it's tithing.

Saethydd

Mass = Lord's Evening Meal

Bishop = Circuit Overseer

Cardinal = Branch Overseer

Waste of time = Field service

Cross = Stake

Oh, an interesting tidbit, according to my college history instructor, during the time Jesus supposedly lived, the Romans executed their prisoners by having them carry one piece of the cross to another piece which was already planted in the ground. Meaning that while Jesus may have carried a "stake" he would have been executed on a cross. Making this both a pointless distinction and technically inaccurate.

20

Feeling the Guilt

by Saethydd in

i'm currently disfellowshipped and living at home with my parents, but because they are both still devout jws i have to keep going to the meetings and crap because i don't want to risk getting thrown out until i finish college or find a job that will let me support myself and go to college.. yesterday, my mother rode with me to the meeting and told me how much my best friend and my oldest sister are missing me, and it just tears me apart because during the meeting i was practically counting the minutes till it was over.

it didn't help matters that i had to sit with my family because the library was closed off, thus forcing me to follow along with the meeting on my tablet instead of reading something useful or interesting like i normally do.. when i got home i just cried out in frustration because it feels like no matter what i do, i am making the wrong choice.

either i have to keep pretending to support an organization that has caused so much pain to so many people, or i have to abandon my family and friends to it so i can save myself.

Saethydd

Thanks, I appreciate having some support through all of this, and I'm just sorry that the average JW will probably never know what kind of people you really are. Instead, they will forever think of you as "wicked apostates" that want to mislead them.

I was already applying some of the practical advice given here, but all the same, I appreciate that you took the effort to relay it. Additionally, it helps me to feel a little more at ease with the plans I already have in place.

45

River flowing from the garden of Eden

by joey jojo in

hey there.. if this point has been covered before please forgive me.. i have had the principles of noahs flood used by jw's to encourage me to attend meetings recently and this has got me musing about the flood....again.. genesis states that a river flowed from eden and branched out into four rivers, two of which being the tigris and the euphrates.. heres the baffling part; if it had never rained before, how is it that rivers existed before the flood?!!?.

a brief google search tells us that the euphrates begins its journey as snow melt and rain ( as most rivers do) in mountains in turkey.. ecc chapter 1 mentions the water cycle and describes the rivers flowing into the sea but the sea not becoming full.

how did it work pre-flood?

Saethydd

Commendable effort my friend, but unfortunately I've never had bringing something like this up about the Flood be met with anything more than a dismissive hand wave and a "Jehovah could have handled that." So questions and observations like this never went anywhere:

How did animals like koalas, penguins, kangaroos, etc get from their respective environments to Noah's Ark? (God got them there)
It would be mathematically impossible to fit all of the animals, and food and water needed for every animal onto to the Ark described in the Bible, even if they were dived by the poorly defined "kinds." (Miracle)
Even if all the ice on Earth were melted there wouldn't be enough to reach the top of Mt. Everest. (The Flood caused some tectonic plates magic that lifted the land up higher out of the water, despite the total lack of geological evidence for this theory.)
Even if the amount of water needed to cover Mt. Everest were spirited into existence, the kinetic energy caused by its falling over a span of forty days would release so much heat that the entire planet would boil and the Ark would burn. (God rigged the physics.)
All of those herbivore animals that traveled over 12,000 miles to reach Noah now have to walk back with no food because all the plant life has been ravaged by a flood. (God cared for them)
All of the now carnivores (because apparently before the flood there weren't any, despite the clear fossil records of animals with other animals in their mouths and stomachs) can't eat anything either without wiping out an entire species. (God can control His creation.)

When the person you're telling this kind of stuff to can just invoke magic at any time, you may as well be debating a brick wall.