konceptual99

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Posts by konceptual99

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  5

  Jwsurvey and Trey Bundy

  by DATA-DOG in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  good evening, or morning, whatever the case may be.. just a couple of points about the jw monthly broadcast, and the "two witness" rule.

  i'm tired, so i'm going to be brief.. 1) i had a nice conversation with trey bundy about the flaws in the wt's "logic" concerning their pet scripture in deuteronomy.

  in short, their rnwt ( the most accurate translation of all time, because the fds were involved...) says that no one person can be convicted on the testimony of one witness.

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  konceptual99

  I just got an internal server error and then the next request was fine
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  22

  ExJW responsible for calling the police at the Warwick protest, NOT Watchtower

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  according to the great apostate, who spent time with police officers at the protest, they informed him that it was not watchtower who called the police in but another exjw who briefly attended the protest and subsequently disapproved of the protesters methods...claiming they were being "violent".. i find this very difficult to understand.

  anyone who saw the bravery of the women who stood up in the kingdom hall and told the story of their abuse and rape could not fail to feel compassion and offer their support.. i know there are posters on this forum who disagree with me.they worry that such protests play into watchtowers "persecution" complex, and naturally i understand their position.. but really, how long do we have to fear their power over their members, and through their members, us.. many jw's simply do not know the extent of the paedophile problem,.they do not know about malawi, the un, the bloodless surgery guinea pig deaths ( thank you orphan crow), the suicides....i simply don't believe that protests don't work....if there are enough of them, and they are organized, and most of all if we are united...we shall make a difference, and that difference may be your loved one.. https://youtu.be/ffhr9onbdrk.

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  konceptual99

  Anyone who saw the bravery of the women who stood up in the Kingdom hall and told the story of their abuse and rape could not fail to feel compassion and offer their support.

  Whilst I do respect the right of anyone to protest in anyway they see fit within the realms of the law, I am of the opinion that generally the sort of KH interruptions that are typically seen are unlikely to do much more than reinforce the negative stereotype of apostates in the minds of those in attendance.

  However, having watched the video containing the above testimonies by the women mentioned I have to agree with you Dog. It was a hard watch and would not have been pleasant to listen to but to make a public statement about something so personal and painful was brave and moving. I cannot imagine there could have been many in the hall, especially the women, who could not have felt some compassion, some sympathy for those poor ladies that have suffered abuse within the congregation.

  There is a point in the video where one of the protesters sits near the front of the hall and there are two sisters in clear view, one of whom is visibly upset. She may have been upset at the interruption or nervous of the person near her but she could very easily have been upset at hearing the testimony, perhaps even having some experience of such abuse herself.

  Clearly it's impossible to know for sure however I've never seen a reaction like that before and that is something that suggests that perhaps when Witnesses are almost forced to hear what some have been through from their own minds then they can be moved.

  The more I think about it, the more I am astounded and over-awed by the bravery and strength of those women in that hall.
  
  
  
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  73

  2 witness rule

  by punkofnice in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm gobsmacked.. the 7 rock star popes in warwick know darned well that the 2 witness rule allows child rapists to get away with their crime.. geoff (whacko jacko) jackson was at the australian royal commission and should have seen first hand what a vile man made law the 2 witness rule is.. my question is, why do they still insist on this pervert protecting rule?.

  i know it's a highly controlling cult but still...........................stuff my old boots, mate!.

  the above is more a rhetorical question.

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  konceptual99

  Oh and please answer dubs' question. I am bored of seeing him ask it over and over again.
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  73

  2 witness rule

  by punkofnice in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm gobsmacked.. the 7 rock star popes in warwick know darned well that the 2 witness rule allows child rapists to get away with their crime.. geoff (whacko jacko) jackson was at the australian royal commission and should have seen first hand what a vile man made law the 2 witness rule is.. my question is, why do they still insist on this pervert protecting rule?.

  i know it's a highly controlling cult but still...........................stuff my old boots, mate!.

  the above is more a rhetorical question.

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  konceptual99

  I couldn't care less if an elder keeps his mouth shut or runs off to the authorities about a brother he knows to be doing cash jobs or some other activity.

  I care greatly when an elder when he knows about a child claiming they are being abused only ends up doing the bare minimum just because some goon on the other end of a phone line at Bethel tells him what is strictly necessary.

  No one is talking about lynching anyone. Stop conflating things Fisherman.
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  34

  "we would never deliberately distort a quotation"

  by ttdtt in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  omg my head exploded!in this months broadcast - splian goes off on how much care the wt in making sure its facts are correct, and how they make sure their quotes are not taking from people who have a bad reputation or have an agenda.

  and that the make sure its always in context!.

  they are such liars!.

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  konceptual99

  To be fair, maybe they realise WT publications had a problem with misquotations in the past and they intend to do better in future.
  Frankly they produce so little serious literature these days that it may be much less of an issue than it once was.

  True. They are moving the study edition to use the simplified version so goodness knows how much content will be in them that is even close to needing proper scholarly or journalistic research.
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  73

  2 witness rule

  by punkofnice in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm gobsmacked.. the 7 rock star popes in warwick know darned well that the 2 witness rule allows child rapists to get away with their crime.. geoff (whacko jacko) jackson was at the australian royal commission and should have seen first hand what a vile man made law the 2 witness rule is.. my question is, why do they still insist on this pervert protecting rule?.

  i know it's a highly controlling cult but still...........................stuff my old boots, mate!.

  the above is more a rhetorical question.

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  konceptual99

  I am sure there has been something documented where the org does say that should evidence such as forensics come to light then they would accept that but I can't find it. The example I was thinking of is where an allegation is made, no cong action is taken due to there not being two witnesses but the crime is reported and then the authorities find evidence of abuse and then prosecute. This would be the second witness and then cong action could be taken.

  I am sure this has been documented somewhere...
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  41

  Watchtower Loses an Appeal

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  publication court of appeal, fourth appellate district division one state of california osbaldo padron, plaintiff and respondent, v. watchtower bible and tract society of new york, inc., defendant and appellant.findingwatchtower has abused the discovery process.

  it has zealously advocated its position and lost multiple times.

  yet, it cavalierly refuses to acknowledge the consequences of these losses and the validity of the court's orders requiring it to produce documents in response to request number 12. and, in a further act of defiance, watchtower informed the court that it would not comply with the march 25, 2016 order 39 requiring it to produce documents responsive to request number 12. the court, following lopez, supra, 246 cal.app.4th 566, as an incremental step toward terminating sanctions if watchtower persists in its unjustified conduct, imposed monetary sanctions.

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  konceptual99

  It doesn't matter. The existence of such files are verified, the files are soepenable, church privacy is defeated, wt is now losing cases in the Courts.

  I demand you tell us what you have done with the real Fisherman
  
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  73

  2 witness rule

  by punkofnice in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm gobsmacked.. the 7 rock star popes in warwick know darned well that the 2 witness rule allows child rapists to get away with their crime.. geoff (whacko jacko) jackson was at the australian royal commission and should have seen first hand what a vile man made law the 2 witness rule is.. my question is, why do they still insist on this pervert protecting rule?.

  i know it's a highly controlling cult but still...........................stuff my old boots, mate!.

  the above is more a rhetorical question.

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  konceptual99

  Hell yeah punk
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  24

  Reveal News Article: Jehovah’s Witnesses double down on Scripture used to ignore abuse by Trey Bundy

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  https://www.revealnews.org/blog/jehovahs-witnesses-double-down-on-scripture-used-to-ignore-abuse/.

  jehovah’s witnesses double down on scripture used to ignore abuse.

  by trey bundy / november 9, 2017. gary breaux, a senior jehovah's witness official, speaks on the religion’s official internet video channel.

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  konceptual99

  They don't need to scrap the policy. What they choose to do as far as their internal club rules are concerned is up to them. At a high level, the principle of requiring corroborative evidence is a sound one in terms of the execution of justice.

  As jwfacts says, they don't actually have to compromise their interpretation of scripture to accommodate more robust procedures when faced with an allegation of child abuse. They just need to modify the policy and the reality is that they have taken some steps to do this.

  The utterly bizarre situation is that instead of publicising the policy changes, promoting and reinforcing a culture where elders support the victim and get help from the authorities - something that would help their cause as far the secular authorities are concerned - they instead choose to reiterate their dogmatic view of scripture.

  This is why my fear is that whatever the policy changes there will still be a disproportionate risk of these allegations being handled badly since the organisation from the top down simply seems to be reverting to type. Clueless indeed @jwfacts.
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  41

  Watchtower Loses an Appeal

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  publication court of appeal, fourth appellate district division one state of california osbaldo padron, plaintiff and respondent, v. watchtower bible and tract society of new york, inc., defendant and appellant.findingwatchtower has abused the discovery process.

  it has zealously advocated its position and lost multiple times.

  yet, it cavalierly refuses to acknowledge the consequences of these losses and the validity of the court's orders requiring it to produce documents in response to request number 12. and, in a further act of defiance, watchtower informed the court that it would not comply with the march 25, 2016 order 39 requiring it to produce documents responsive to request number 12. the court, following lopez, supra, 246 cal.app.4th 566, as an incremental step toward terminating sanctions if watchtower persists in its unjustified conduct, imposed monetary sanctions.

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  konceptual99

  There goes confidentiality for child molestors if they see those files and now who is next when a Court orders to see anybody's file if wt has a record on anyone. It could be yours.

  I doubt anyone is interested in seeing whatever my local cong has written on me, especially since they've not even had a report for over a year.

  I, on the other hand, as a father would be very interested to know if any of the members of my local congregation is a paedophile.