Posts by Xanthippe

49

"You owe Jehovah humility and HONESTY" - an email from a JW

hey forum goers.

i'd like your opinions on constructing an email reply to this shocker below.

bit of background about the sender: she is a middle-aged, cheery uberdub whose siblings left when a schism occured in her congregation in canada way back when.

Xanthippe

Wake me, wishing you all the best for your son's operation. Take care, both of you.

20

So, I got a contact letter from a local Jehovah's Witness...

by SecondRateMind in

jw
friends

...which was kind of her.

i find i like most christians, even mormons, and jw's.. she sent me a leaflet, which asks: where can we find the answers to life's big questions?

science?

Xanthippe

I like the big questions too 2RM. I'm still trying to find personal meaning in life. I don't think there's a universal meaning, but I am prepared and happy to be wrong.

Plato was the first philosopher I read while still a JW. It fascinated me that 500ish years BC people were asking what makes a just man, a good person.

That's also my favourite quote from Lewis Caroll.

Do please stick around and continue your fascinating thoughts.

19

i know we often talk of the mind control and how jw's believe what they are taught because they are controlled as to the information they receive, but i think the mind control goes frighteningly beyond simply keeping information away from them.. the jw mind is in lockdown.

it simply cannot accept facts, evidence, reasoning or whatever that goes against what they believe.

they cannot assimilate and consider an argument, it is not that they are being awkward, or willfully blind, their minds are so shut down they are incapable of taking in what is being presented.. i am aware of how, in common with other cults and high control groups the j.w org achieves this state among its members, but how on earth do we open such a solidly closed mind ?.

Xanthippe

The tendency to describe unloviing actions by elders as imperfection is totally cult mind control. The organization introduced the phrase and concept of God working through imperfect men so that when they get the predictions wrong the cult survives.

The JWs who continue to believe in 'imperfections' after decades of abuse by untrained clergy are just terrified of the domino effect of the thought that if people are acting in an unjust, unchristian way perhaps it means they are not appointed by Holy Spirit after all. If that's true then perhaps this isn't the true religion and if that's the case my whole life has been a waste of time, I'm going to die, no paradise is coming, I don't even have a pension ......

Only when the pain of being in the organization controlled by leaders that don't care whether you live or die becomes more unbearable than the pain of no panda paradise can facts begin to be absorbed. It's human to opt for the least amount of pain.

19

J.W's Brain LOCKDOWN

by Phizzy in

i know we often talk of the mind control and how jw's believe what they are taught because they are controlled as to the information they receive, but i think the mind control goes frighteningly beyond simply keeping information away from them.. the jw mind is in lockdown.

it simply cannot accept facts, evidence, reasoning or whatever that goes against what they believe.

they cannot assimilate and consider an argument, it is not that they are being awkward, or willfully blind, their minds are so shut down they are incapable of taking in what is being presented.. i am aware of how, in common with other cults and high control groups the j.w org achieves this state among its members, but how on earth do we open such a solidly closed mind ?.

Xanthippe

I think we need to focus on emotions in this situation. People often say they were hurt by the unjust treatment they received in JCs or at the hand of elders when they were going through tough personal issues.

Trying to convince people the JW teachings are wrong doesn't seem to get anywhere when the mind control has caused brain lockdown. Trying to focus on the sadness, injustice, hurt feelings might get better results. Questions like, do you think that was a Christian/ loving thing to do or say to you?

23

Are You Proud of Your Country?

by snugglebunny in

jw
friends

some people are of the opinion that it doesn't make any sense to be proud of one's nationality because we had nothing to do with where we were born.

the decision wasn't ours.

they opine that it's ludicrous to be proud of our countries' prior achievements if we had no part in those achievements because we weren't even around then.

Xanthippe

It's true that not until the Parliamentary Reform Act of 1867 did skilled working men with an income of at least ten pounds a year get the right to vote. Before that it was only professional men and the nobility that could vote. You still had to be a man though.

The Ballot Act in the 1870's meant that it was a secret ballot and nobody had the right to pressure tenant farmers to vote for a particular candidate who was often their landlord. They couldn't therefore be thrown off their land for not voting for him which was the kind of corruption that happened before. This meant farmers could now vote freely. It was a gradual process and yet still not all men could vote, but of those who could, they did have to be men. They couldn't be skilled seamstresses or women farmers.

23

Are You Proud of Your Country?

by snugglebunny in

jw
friends

some people are of the opinion that it doesn't make any sense to be proud of one's nationality because we had nothing to do with where we were born.

the decision wasn't ours.

they opine that it's ludicrous to be proud of our countries' prior achievements if we had no part in those achievements because we weren't even around then.

Xanthippe

I'm proud women got the right to vote here in1918, yes I know some women over 30. At the end of the film Suffragette after the credits it lists the countries that gave women the vote after 1918 including the US (1920). It's a very long list. I remember that in Switzerland where my mother-in-law is from, some cantons didn't give women the vote until the 1970s!

I love this country, the scenery is so varied, mountains, lakes, rivers, coastline. It's down to being manicured by people, it's not at all natural any more. I just wish we had more ancient forests left in England.

A hundred years ago people were living in back to back terraces in the cities with one toilet between twenty-five houses. Now people think they're hard done by if they don't have at least two bathrooms. London was a filthy, smog filled disease filled rat trap and now it's one of the biggest tourist cities in the world. After seeing the slums of Delhi and the shanty towns of Jaipur I know how rich this country is although people here don't believe it.

I love it here, I even love the weather. I saw a Facebook site where Americans were saying they wished they were in the UK for the English Spring, I was amazed. Ex-pats also wishing they could return for the Spring weather.

13

A.N.Z.A.C. Day 25th APRIL

by zeb in

jw
friends

the 25th april is the day australia and new zealand remember their war dead.. on the 25th april 1915 troops from many nations including australian and new zealanders landed on the shores of turkey.

the anzac forces at a place called gallipoli or galliboli by the turkish people.. the concept was to land move inland attack constantinople and there by force turkey out of the war (1914-1918) and bring it too a swift end.

the whole operation was a monumental stuff up with the anzacs being landed in the wrong place up against steep cliffs.

Xanthippe

Interesting thanks Zeb. As usual the generals back home safe in their ivory towers stuff up and people die on the battlefield

15

Rejoice cos God's tent is.... Disintegrated by a cat 5 truth storm

by Normalfulla in

just had to share... a former friend of my wife's, has just left our house, unbeknown to us, her and her husband have been inactive for about a year and a half, they have pre teen boys too.

she reached out to my wife as she had heard that we were apostates etc and needed someone to talk to.. .

after her father dying she was in a bad place mentally and emotionally and reached out to her cong for support, apon receiving 0 she turned to the bible for comfort only in her raw emotional state to realize that jehovah was a murderous unfair god and then her wheels of rational reasoning started turning.. she questioned things and was outspoken about things and attracted elder attention... long story short she wanted to connect with a friendly ear and she splurged she's never going back, the bible is all bulls**t and it's a cult, despite not knowing most of ttatt we all shared experiences and watched her eyes boggle at (stuckinarut... the first euphoric high) the un scandal, beth sarim, ray franz, 607, arc.

Xanthippe

What an intelligent woman to work that out by herself from the Bible! How brave to talk to others about it in her congregation in the hearing of elders and then to seek you and your wife out. She deserves her freedom, she earnt it!

65

Withdrawing community support in the congs

by purrpurr in

jw
friends

i've noticed in the past 10 years that the social support that used to be available in the congs, a shoulder to cry on, elders to help with family/marriage issues these seem to have been purposely withdrawn.

counsel is even heard from the platform that the elders are not there to help people with their problems.. so first in the 80s-90s they take away the congregation get to getters and social events and now they seem to be going one step further in taking away the emotional support for people too.. this will take away an aspect that i'm sure was keeping alot of people in the borg, the community support.

if that's not there and its just about meetings and ministry how many will start to get their emotional support elsewhere?.

Xanthippe

Elders in some congregations specifically tell married couples in trouble that they are not counselors nor therapists. Their focus is helping the "sheep" spiritually not emotionally. - Whynot

Interesting Whynot, they're telling people they're not therapists now? They don't help the people spiritually though, you're not allowed to even ask questions about teachings without being labelled an apostate. So if they don't help people spiritually, emotionally or practically like a clergyman would, what is their function!

33

Do you miss that initial "high" ??

by stuckinarut2 in

do you remember the first time you found out "the truth about the truth"?.

yes, it was confronting, shocking and life altering.

yes it was hard to deal with.. but, along with that, many have said that they experienced a sense of thrill, euphoria, or joy when realising the facts about the religion that held us captive mentally and physically for so long.. it was liberating to learn some of the controversial teachings etc.

Xanthippe

But stop and try to answer this question- Did you feel a huge sense of "justification" for any anger or doubts or actions?

Yes OTWO I did feel vindicated that my doubts, particularly the times when people treated me as if I was crazy when I was actually making a lot of sense because I thought about the teachings and questioned what I was taught instead of being indoctrinated by the cult. It has taught me to trust myself, eight million people can be wrong!