Posts by tor1500

23

What was the point of the bunker video

by Crazyguy in

they get caught by the bad guys at the end anyway, don't get what thier point is to the video?

of course i haven't seen it all they way either.

.

tor1500

Hi,

I kept looking at this subject, wanting to say something...but nothing came to mind that nobody didn't think of...It's a scare tactic. Plus it will drive up baptisms. There will be more baptisms because of this video. Young, & old. They need more #'s.. so why not scare folks to death...Many will get their children baptized before they even know what the word dedication means. This video will make folks make a mad dash to the water.

Then....when this scare tactic blows over, there will be a WT, saying...We should show a waiting attitude...by not having our young ones baptized too young, they'll back step & say, Jesus didn't get baptized until his 30's. As servants of Jehovah, we must be ready for GB, but we don't know when but we know it'll be soon, but live like it's soon but not now. I think that's how they'll spin it.

The org. is hoping the GT comes before the child abuse cases come to life. Maybe the GT will expose the child abuse cases...ummmm that's a thought.

Also, the video is supposed to encourage us to read & study the bible more so we can be like the brother in the video, who knew scriptures from the top of his head...just in case we don't have a bible or internet connection. Hey, did anyone notice in one of the WT's the bunker scene & one of the friends had a tablet...umm..so they'll be internet connection during the GT ? Interesting. I wanted to comment on that so badly, & I put up my hand but I guess divine intervention stopped me from saying it. I wanted to say, how wonderful Jehovah is...he is allowing internet connection for the friends, isn't he awesome? Wonder how the friends would take it...

I find you can make a point & plant a seed in the friends heads, if you say....Isn't it Loving how Jehovah...blah blah blah...but you must be very very clever...

The bunker video is supposed to be encouraging....NOT.

Tor

17

Change(s?) to revised nwt

by Saltheart Foamfollower in

i don't think this has been picked up anywhere yet.

the revised nwt released in 2013 is already out of date.

the second half of psalm 51:4 now reads "therefore, you are righteous when you speak, you are right in your judgment" in the online version where the printed version reads "so that you might prove righteous when you speak, and be right in your judgment".. fairly unimportant in itself, but i wonder what else has been changed without telling anyone..

tor1500

Hi All,

Those scriptures are not the only one(s)...check NWT before the revised: John 8. verses 1-11 have been omitted, John 8 begins with verse 12. The scripture is about a Jesus and an adultress & a crowd wants Jesus to do something about it but he doesn't, he basically says who here has not sinned cross this line...when he looks up...everybody is gone. I found this scripture could have been used if one was re-proved or df'd. Maybe that's why they took it out.

Old NWT: John 8:1-11But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. 2 At daybreak, however, he again presented himself at the temple, and all the people began coming to him, and he sat down and began to teach them. 3 Now the scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman caught at adultery, and, after standing her in their midst, 4 they said to him: “Teacher, this woman has been caught in the act of committing adultery. 5 In the Law Moses prescribed for us to stone such sort of women. What, really, do you say?” 6 Of course, they were saying this to put him to the test, in order to have something with which to accuse him. But Jesus bent down and began to write with his finger in the ground. 7 When they persisted in asking him, he straightened up and said to them: “Let the one of YOU that is sinless be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 And bending over again he kept on writing in the ground. 9 But those who heard this began going out, one by one, starting with the older men, and he was left alone, and the woman that was in their midst. 10 Straightening up, Jesus said to her: “Woman, where are they? Did no one condemn you?” 11 She said: “No one, sir.” Jesus said: “Neither do I condemn you. Go your way; from now on practice sin no more.”

2013: NWT: 8 12 Then Jesus spoke again to them, saying: “I am the light of the world.+ Whoever follows me will by no means walk in darkness, but will possess the light+ of life.”

Check it out 4 yourselves.

Tor

11

Today's Text - Shun Your Disfellowshipped Family Members & Friends!

by Divergent in

jw
friends

yet another sickening reminder for jw's to use emotional blackmail!.

wednesday, june 22. stop keeping company with anyone called a brother who is sexually immoral.—1 cor.

5:11.. a heartrending experience for aaron’s family is recorded at leviticus 10:1-11. they must have been devastated when fire from heaven consumed aaron’s sons nadab and abihu at the tabernacle.

tor1500

Hi OneEyed Joe,

Great comment...would you be able to let us know what WT has the information you posted.

I have a bunch of notes...for my own sanity....if you care to share the WT article..

I thank you,

Tor

8

When a man stops believing in God he doesn’t then believe in nothing, he believes anything - G KChesterton

by slimboyfat in

i have been reading rodney stark's new book triumph of faith, where he makes his argument afresh that religion is alive and well.

in fact he says it's doing better than ever, and we are in the middle of a revival of faith.

above is a particular quote he likes to use when refusing secularisation.

tor1500

Hi All,

I find if there was no God, man would have to believe in something....example: Tooth Fairy, Fairy God Mother, Santa Claus, Leprechauns, & the like...None of these things can anyone see.

I think there is something in us that needs to have something to believe in....it's in our Nature.

Religion, I think the purpose of it has gone way beyond what the purpose was to be....I think, what the original purpose was supposed to be was to watch out for your fellow man, rich or poor, if you have it share it. If you see someone in need, help them, care for the sick or elderly....give up your seat on the bus/train, give someone your umbrella if it's raining...if you see someone at the store, & they are short a few pennies or dollars, help them, help someone across the street & so on....Treat folks the way you want to be treated...

But guess What ???? That's too simple...folks much rather say the Lord's prayer backwards, standing on one foot, yep, that's easier....or tell you what to do, but won't do it themselves...

Tor

27

Proof that Daniel was written 400 years after the events it describes and how much it gets wrong

by purrpurr in

i've been studying the bible anew and have just realised that the writer of daniel gets the kings of babylon completely wrong and confused.

he says that nebuchadnezzar was succeeded by his son belshazzar .

then along comes good old cyrus the great who liberates the jews.. yet this is wrong!

tor1500

@ David Jay,

Love your break down of the Book of Daniel...so, you are Jewish ? So, can I ask you, since the WT, say it was 607BC, what do you say ? Since they took it from the book of Daniel.

What say ye ?

Tor

17

Successful Leaver

by 2True in

i was raised in the cult, a 'golden boy' in jw about 15 years ago.

regular pioneer, went to pioneer school and then mts.

my dad is a gilead graduate and is still a serving elder.

tor1500

HI All,

I'm wondering is there some place that can be contacted in Jerusalem to see if they have any information on their destruction ?

I'm also wondering if some JW's went to Jerusalem & found out it wasn't 607 BC. Who better would have records of their history but Jerusalem it's self.

I've heard many have done research of the fall of Jerusalem & found out it wasn't 607,,,& that caused many of them to leave the org. I know of one that did. They want nothing to do with the org. As a matter of fact I know of another who left the org. because of their research...

So, if there was proof from Jerusalem, wonder would the org. accept it. I'm going to say something stupid...They would look at it the proof from Jerusalem & say something like....they don't know their own history, that's how arrogant they are...

I don't have the $$$, but I would love to go myself to find out when Jerusalem ...DID FALL.

Tor

17

Successful Leaver

by 2True in

i was raised in the cult, a 'golden boy' in jw about 15 years ago.

regular pioneer, went to pioneer school and then mts.

my dad is a gilead graduate and is still a serving elder.

tor1500

Hi 2 True,

I'm a newbie....but know ttatt...

It was a very difficult decision for me and I remember discovering one evening that ancient Jerusalem had not been destroyed in 607 BCE. My world came tumbling down around me as this one 'prophecy' was pivotal to pretty much every other doctrine. I'm a baby boomer....My Mom still has my old encyclopedia set. I looked up when Jerusalem was destroyed, & it said...586 or 587. I forget. Anyway, I was just wondering where you found your information ? Why is it that most books do not say 607 ? Has any one ever checked with Jerusalem themselves ? Is there any place a person can contact in Jerusalem to find out ? I know they keep records.

Just curious....

Thanks,

Tor

18

The best way for a witness to wake up, is to simply read the societies own older publications!

by stuckinarut2 in

once again the society is on a push to scare witnesses away from doing any research, or "stumbling" upon any "apostate" material (from workmates, neighbors, or online).

however, the most enlightening, mind blowing and eye opening things are found simple by reading the early publications themselves!.

read how ct russel, (the supposed channel god was using) had the most far fetched and laughable ideas, such as obtaining pivotal dates by measuring the pyramids of egypt!...

tor1500

Hi,

When I came into the org. I never thought it was God's only mouthpiece. What I was thinking is how do these folks believe that this is God's mouthpiece.

I'm no scholar & maybe there is a God & maybe not...but when you close your eyes, wouldn't you like to believe you did the right things, you led a good life & treated people well.

No matter what, they bible is about how we treat our fellow man...and most of us were taught that at home or we should have.

The TRUTH IS NOT IN AN ORG. BUT IN YOU...

Don't be angry with God, be angry with MAN...

Tor

240

Introduction - Any Believers?

by Believer in

i’ve been reading it for a few of years off and on, but have been a little too ... maybe ... timid to join.

i left the watchtower organization almost 20 years ago but never abandoned my faith and belief in god.

i knew the gb/organization didn’t represent god, so when i lost my faith in them, i managed to keep my faith in an all wise benevolent creator.

tor1500

Hi Believer,

I'm not an xJW as of yet. I'm so happy to see you on this forum. You mirror my thoughts. I still believe in God/Jesus. I know ttatt. How I manage to keep my faith is I see all that God had created, and how he has been in my life all along even if I didn't know it...I'm a newbie...The TRUTH IS MAN MADE like all forms of worship.

I agree with you. Most folks on here are so angry at the org., that they are angry at God. Let's be real. or better yet, let me say this. Don't know who on here is black, white, or any other color. But if you do your research, Slavery was upheld by the masters using the bible to keep slaves under their master...at the time blacks couldn't read so what did they know. So what am I saying...The bible in the wrong hands can be dangerous. When leave our relationship to God with people/man, well, all you going to get is man's interpretation. Are most people here angry with the org./God or themselves for letting someone take care of how they should worship. How many on here thought they belonged to God's org. & really was that the bait that made them stay in, did they feel above others that were not witnesses, did they shun folks, did they think too much of themselves and now they have discovered that the org., wasn't telling them the truth.

When I started studying, I would read the bible then listen to them...saw many things did not line up with the bible. For instance Michael being Jesus, where in Hebrews it's says, "To what angel did God say you are my son" I think that's how it reads....as I continued to study I saw many things they were wrong about, but I pressed on. Man can even direct his own step. No matter where you go to worship, it won't be the truth...The Truth is in the Bible, whether you like it or not. Most folks don't like it because they see themselves & don't want to admit it.

To all that read this forum...DON'T PUT YOUR FAITH IN MAN. He'll lead you astray every single time.

I choose to believe, I'm not saying my faith won't be tested & won't get weak from time to time, but my belief in God is 4ever.

Folks that believe in evolution, let's, let them have it...but just think, how did evolution play a part in our feelings our emotions...nope can't get emotions from a big bang...ok let's say we come from monkeys...so why haven't we met anyone who just became a human (someone walking around naked & saying...Hey, I just evolved from being a Monkey, what's this human thing about (LOL....why are monkey's still monkey's...

Folks have free will to believe what they want...I choose to believe in God/Jesus no matter what the org. says, changes, etc. They are only men...

I think many on this site are bitter...& maybe they have a right to be bitter...some folks here have had some bad things done to them thru the org., but let's be honest is was man, not God...it was man using the bible to do what they want. Not what God said.

I think many who were in the org. let someone else do the thinking for them. It's an easy way to worship, let them spoon feed you & you just swallow. It's just like life, no one can live it for you.

I love reading the bible and learning of others faith in time of trouble and they have life lessons.

Like you I don't have blind faith...I can read & when the org. says something that doesn't line up with the bible...I say...they will have to answer for that when they are judged. I know what God has said & I'm sticking to it...

I'm not sure how long I will remain in the org. I'm ok, because I know it's not God's org. As I've said all over this forum, I take what I need & spit out the rest.

We can't be so hard on those who don't believe in God anymore because of the org. One day we hope & pray that they'll come back to God & it doesn't have to be in the org.

Believer I have so much to say...this is the first time I've found someone on this site that still believes and not bitter with God, even though you aren't in the org. any more. You have put a smile on my face...

Tor

18

The best way for a witness to wake up, is to simply read the societies own older publications!

by stuckinarut2 in

once again the society is on a push to scare witnesses away from doing any research, or "stumbling" upon any "apostate" material (from workmates, neighbors, or online).

however, the most enlightening, mind blowing and eye opening things are found simple by reading the early publications themselves!.

read how ct russel, (the supposed channel god was using) had the most far fetched and laughable ideas, such as obtaining pivotal dates by measuring the pyramids of egypt!...

tor1500

Hi All,

I'm a witness. I'm a newbie....but know TTATT. I talk to a long time witness daily...we talk about all the changes in the org. She says there have been so many changes but....OK, EVERYONE, HOLD ON TO YOUR HATS..She says at least the org. is humble enough to admit they have a new understanding, & admit they were wrong, other places of worship wouldn't do that....So there you got it folks...that is what most witnesses think...or should I say the majority. They commend the org. for the "NEW LIGHT". What I really want to say is, other religions don't do it because they don't change their doctrine, like JW's do...if it's a lie, they stick with it...if you disagree, keep it to yourself. Or change churches. You can also voice it to your pastor, he or she may say we can't know everything or something like that. I have heard many preachers say, he you don't believe me just go to your bible & check me.

I'm not saying older publications wouldn't open their eyes, but many were alive when some of the stuff was written. Many were around in 1975...I remember one brother said from the platform that it was supposed to be the end in 1975 & he is still here.

For JW's this is the last gas station before the desert....I think PRIDE is what keeps most in. They can't admit this may not be God's org. & that some of their doctrine, you can poke holes in it. Arrogance is another problem. Even though the org. admits they are wrong, but the individual can't.

I know this is not God's only channel...it's just one of them...I wouldn't be so arrogant, that God looked down & looked at Penn. & said...yep, I choose them. NO..Remember Jehovah is not partial.

I don't care if this not God's org. I am developing my own relationship w/Jehovah & Jesus...

This journey is ours...the org. or any place of worship can only give you pieces, you have to take those pieces to God...& this is where YOU form your only relationship.

I see many here are mad at God, because of the org. Remember it wasn't God that did anything to you, it was a human(s) that spoke for God...Many think God is in our image but it's the other way around...When they say God said this or that...it was actually them.

What I have learned Man will let you down every time...

I think many may know the ttatt, that is why there are so many depressed sick witnesses...I've said it all over this forum...they are not depressed but suppressed. Your body will turn on you if you suppress your thoughts...

Again, I know ttatt. What I find that works is when they say the org. said this or that before but now it's a new light...Then I ask, where did they get the original old light from, was it bible based ? They stutter then say, they don't remember...then I'll say...don't worry I'll find it....crickets (lol)...why crickets, because they know it's not in the bible..

In my comments, I plant little tiny seeds...& when I say them, I hear a low ummm...then at the end of the meeting...they say, Hey sis, I never really thought of it that way...In my head secretly... I say...that's your problem, you checked your brain at the door. You should have left your troubles at the door & brought your brain with you.

Tor