Posts by tor1500

25

Watchtower No.3 2017 - The Four Horesmen

by pale.emperor in

this is the first time i've read through a watchtower magazine in about a year.

although i've been our only 8 months it really git me how crazy i must have sounded when i was a jw talking to non jws.. while other bible based religions talk about the 4 horsemen and back up their theories with other scriptures or historical evidence, the watchtower have taken so such steps.

1914 is thrown in there as if it's universally agreed that jesus started ruling since then.. even when i was a jw i never really understood why, if the pale horse represents jesus, why is he first?

tor1500

Hi,

&&& forgot to add that Jesus is the sword...the sword usually comes out of his mouth....that's what most of the scriptures say about Jesus...

Tor

25

Watchtower No.3 2017 - The Four Horesmen

by pale.emperor in

this is the first time i've read through a watchtower magazine in about a year.

although i've been our only 8 months it really git me how crazy i must have sounded when i was a jw talking to non jws.. while other bible based religions talk about the 4 horsemen and back up their theories with other scriptures or historical evidence, the watchtower have taken so such steps.

1914 is thrown in there as if it's universally agreed that jesus started ruling since then.. even when i was a jw i never really understood why, if the pale horse represents jesus, why is he first?

tor1500

Hi,

The 4 horsemen are to bring in the great wrath...if read properly, not through the eyes of any org. or religion. The first horsemen is not Jesus...the way this horsemen is described he was on a white horse...doesn't mean white is right...or peace...also, the lamb opened up the seals...how can he ride out & then come back to open up the other seals and call out...& still keep riding...what's the purpose of calling out the first horseman ?

&&& This would be a great comment...the 1st horsemen has a bow without an arrow....what good is a conquerer without an arrow...what happens does Jesus get off the horse and hit his enemies...and if that happens that means he has to continuously get off his horse...no....the org. got this all wrong...but if any of us is alive in a few years this too will be a new light of understanding...but maybe not...because this will show how they misrepresented Jesus....nah, that wouldn't go down right...it would be like admitting 1914 is wrong....but you never know...

Wonder if anyone will notice the illustration doesn't match the scripture....maybe a lurker will...

This is clear that you can tell the rank and file anything...but I think many already know that this illustration isn't true but why upset the apple cart...they belong, they are accepted and protected....this is where they get their worth and self esteem even though they need others to give them self esteem, but if others have to give you self esteem, how is that SELF esteem.

Tor

78

The handling of child abuse allegations

by Landy in

there's a lot of criticism surrounding the jw's handling of chiild abuse within their ranks with a lot of it being well deserved.

but i'm interested to know how people on here think child abuse allegations should be handled.

there's a few scenarios below, the first couple are easy then it gets a bit more complex.

tor1500

Hi,

There is only one scenario....call the police...then the elders or, call the police and the elders at the same time and they take it from there.

This site has had many topics regarding child abuse...everybody has this or that suggestion.....why isn't the easiest thing to do is call the police...We all know why the elders/org. don't want to involve the police....to keep the org. name clean....not to mention how much they point fingers at other religions....

Why is this so hard to figure out...could be that, our society doesn't look at having sex with a child or touching a child is that bad, after all, how many males can't wait until a female is at least 18. Having sex or touching a child has been around a long time....males have been doing it forever, females too, and now it's starting to get the attention it needs...If more females were exposed more than men, then we would see a difference in the law. There are sick folks who prey on little children...but let's not forget some of these young folks today, my oh my...they are so mature looking....and some of the females today are running men down...so there are so many situations...

Still'''in, you ask what makes police so adequately qualified....they are the police, at least the incident has been reported...and the congregation is put on alert .....even if it is a he said she said.....find out...but I guess keep the org. clean at any cost....

Tor

52

My families shunning has gone to a whole new level

by pale.emperor in

8 months df'd.

loving a life of freedom.

however, my family are all shunning me.

tor1500

@PE,

I'm so sorry to hear that Mom has blocked you...At times I really don't know how to comment on situations like this one...part of me says well, why would you want to stay in touch with someone who only has conditional love, is it worth it...then I remember, we are talking about a person's parent...so it's not so easy to be so cavalier about it. I have a great relationship with my Mom, I'm a witness and she's not....I don't try to change her nor her me. We both believe in God and that we are blessed and we are...then I think, well, sometimes a parent parents the way they were taught, so maybe this conditional love is generational.

I've heard of families being broken up for various reasons, money, drugs, alcohol, etc...some of these situations can really break up a family if taken to the extreme, and yet, sometimes a family can break up for the least little reasons...So witnesses are saying...if you don't worship like me then I won't talk to you anymore...ummmm, is that love?

I know of a similar situation...a friend of mine had to take guardianship for her nephew because her sister decided to be a witness and the son didn't so she basically disowned him....yet she goes to the meetings religiously...& doesn't even care about her own flesh and blood....

When you come to think of it...something has to be deeply wrong with a person who can turn their back on a child or love one...in this instance just because they won't worship the same as they do...

But here's a sobering thought...as time goes on and the mother needs help in her elderly years....let's see who will be there for her..no doubt it will be the one child or grandchildren she blocked...yep, life is funny that way...I know a female, her Mom gave her away at birth to another family member, kept the other children when the mom got sick who was the one that came to the mom's rescue...you got it...The child she gave away...the child she gave away stayed and took care of her mom until she died...did the other KEPT children help...NO...

I'm wondering can a person have a pretty balanced upbringing and be a witness...so far, I don't think so.

Tor

20

Has anyone reached out to Mrs Remini by email .

by poopie in

jw
friends

just curious .

tor1500

Hi LonghairGal,

Again, you hit the nail on the head....you are right...when JW's come out of the shadows then and only then will the society be exposed. There are famous witnesses but they believe it's the truth...they are in the background...still living the good life ....some are active and some are inactive...but they would never talk against the truth...

I can't remember his name....he plays on the series Empire, ah I remember Terrance Howard, I think he was a witness or raised a witness and he said if he wasn't in Hollywood the only religion he would be in is the Truth because it is the truth....The Jacksons, The Williams Sisters, Larry Graham, & I think a female from the view if she still is on the air, the view changes hosts, so who knows,this is just to name a few. Oh lets not forget Prince..when he was alive did he say one word about how they took his money......they would never step up and say anything against the org. because as far as they are concerned, They are not worthy....so even if they were mistreated by the org... They would never step up to say anything...

Tor

45

New light in this weeks WT?

by Indian Larry in

anybody have any ideas where they are going with the "new light" they have been pushing last week and this week?

for instance in this weeks study article one section reads:.

in years gone by, we believed that jehovah became displeased with his people because they did not have a zealous share in the preaching work during world war i. we concluded that for this reason, jehovah allowed babylon the great to take them captive for a short time.

tor1500

Hi,

That's what I took away from this week's WT...if the FDS or a FDS wasn't appointed until 1919, who was feeding the friends the food? I was sitting next to someone....it was so hard not to say this...then I did say....this is a new understanding...so nice for them to explain, I didn't know what the other understanding was? They just smiled, because they were born in..

This whole thing is PR for them, they are changing their image and TELLING THE TRUTH. See we are transparent, we are telling you how the org. has progressed....& the friends will eat it up, why? Because what other religion admits they were wrong....I hear it all the time....as many say, it really doesn't matter whether the society is wrong it's that they swallow their pride and say they were wrong...HOW HUMBLE...but what the friends don't know is what they aren't saying...pedophiles, cover-ups, real estate, what goes on behind closed doors, what goes on at Bethel, who had a mistress & so on...nope, won't tell that...just feed them some truth...see we are transparent we don't hide anything....Yeah, sure you don't...

When I read the entire article, that point was the only point I got out of this week's WT study...who was feeding you'all..

They keep re-writing stuff because they don't know what the heck either...the FDS is this..the wheat is with the tares...they were picked already, no, not yet, Jesus said he was or is coming...what the heck? They are just as confused as the friends..except they have good writing skills.

Tor

40

The popularity fad of home-schooling!

by stuckinarut2 in

i know this has been discussed over the years on this forum, but i just had to post this again!.

it seems that the popular fad amongst the "spiritual" ones in the local circuits is to home school their children instead of sending them to school.. now to clarify, we are in a very nice area of semi rural australia .

one with very community minded, and strong family values.

tor1500

Hi,

Wow, great comments....in my area some Home School for monetary reasons...this couple can barely scape by so I think the cost of sending him to school would really leave them with nothing....both of the parents are very nice and one was home schooled but as many of you say...they just don't fit...

As someone said most JW's have a persecution gene...so how could a child stand up for his faith in Jehovah against his peers ? It's that one of the foundations of being a witness "Be SEEN"...

To me it makes the child imbalanced....only seeing one side of life their parents view....

We also must remember, JW's are the other side of the mirror....whatever everyone else do they do they opposite....that's why they are going batty trying to fix their doctrines to new lights...because when this religion was started they said everything the opposite of other religions...& it sounded good at the time because most folks were illiterate....but not now...folks can read and that's why we going to get new lights...as one commenter says...regarding their interpretation of the scriptures...they bit off more than they could chew...

If everyone in the world would home school their children, you can bet the JW's would either put them back in school(remember they would do the opposite of what the world does)...or try to find a space shuttle to school their kids...so they really would be no part of this world...

I've found out the best way to deal with the org. if you can't go right now for whatever reasons....who are any of us to judge why a person that is aware is still there...but I have found that I let a lot of stuff I see and hear about witnesses just roll off ...because they are just people...they are no different from anybody else...they think they are but we all know.....they are not....they talk about putting on the suit of armor/fruitage of the spirit but most of them just drape it over their shoulders and come into the hall...once the meeting is over ....it's off...if they happen to run into a friend whether it be a witness or not...they drape it on again for the world to see...once the person is out of sight....off it comes..

I have realized that witnesses are people first (with all our messed up ways) then they are TRYING to be a witness..

So I take whatever they say with a grain of salt...they come to you and say oh, we are home schooling...all I say that's so nice...gives you more time with your children (inside, of course you can spend more time...you ain't working...that's my inside voice)...Then I ask, how's that working out ? They of course say oh, it's so much better...My reply, I can imagine...what I think or say don't matter to these (can't think of a name for them at the moment)....witnesses are contrary...and always do the opposite to stand out and look like they doing something...

I just let them talk .....because that's what they are good at.

Tor

20

Has anyone reached out to Mrs Remini by email .

by poopie in

jw
friends

just curious .

tor1500

@LonghairGal,

Exactly...until a witness is willing to share their story then as you say The Witnesses will be around for a long long time. We hear about pedophiles in other places and the things the WT does...and many are not even in the religion anymore, but will not step out and tell their stories...there are so many reporters looking for a story...that's why they report things we don't even want to know....

As you say many are afraid to come out and say so all witnesses do is go on sites and complain...(me included). My way of talking to some of the friends is simply by saying all God wants us to do is help one another and love one another...So no matter how much literature we get and how much we read ....in the end....the message is be our brothers keepers...they have to agree..that way I don't point to any scriptures but just give them the bottom line....

LonghairGal, you hit the nail on the head....until JW's come forward and not be afraid of man, the org. will continue....what's so funny in this case JW's are more afraid of man than the authorities...something is wrong with this picture...

Tor

37

April 2017 Study Watchtower encourages you to defy The Society !

by BluesBrother in

at least, that is how i see it... the article "the judge of all the earth always does what is right".

paragraph 6 & 7 .

6 consider the experience of willi diehl.

tor1500

Hi,

What I take out of this Watchtower which most won't see it is that how he was treated, because of marrying...how the society treated him...now the average JW will read that and not be moved but the ones that never thought the society would treat people like that, oh yes they heard about it but always thought that was apostate talk the society would never do that....there are those that will read it as it wasn't the society that took away his privi's but the friends...but if they really look at the situation they'll see it was the society that took away his privi's ...& that they did that simply because he wanted to get married...not a sin, but what God encourages folks to do instead of living together...

If you really keep up with the literature, you will see slight changes....there was a time JW's didn't smile, now look at the publ. One WT talked about a sister a pioneer I think & she was in another country at the airport on her way home...she spent all her money but the plane was canceled until the next day, what could she do, with no money where could she stay (Now I won't mention that happens a lot and many folks just sleep in the airport until the next day, also because their plane was cancelled and many are young so they have no money to stay somewhere overnight....most likely just enough money for the trip, no extra) anyway back to the story. A classmate of the sister saw her at the airport and asked what she was doing there...blah blah blah...so she told him her story and his family took her in for the night so she wouldn't have to stay overnight at the airport...so what's this story...So called worldly people are not bad....first of all, they were strangers..maybe not the classmate but his family was...but she trusted them and went to their home..& they say watch your association.

Another one is praying for others... we know how the JW's feel about that....well, one of the midweek meetings, a question was asked does Jehovah want us to pray for others...sure enough YES..and they backed it up with scripture...

I'm not sure where the society is headed...but the old regime is dying...the young folks are coming...just listen to their comments...they get to the point..they don't flower up their comments...even their demonstrations are different in the school. I remember one sister developed her part to say they were going to a get together and they will be playing bible games...so she was helping the householder with some scriptures...it was so original...the brother gave her counsel. But after I said you did well and I loved your setting...she loved it too and so did the friends...but it was out of the box...she said she didn't want to do a demo with same ole Debbie Downer situation. The sister said, all the demos she had seen is folks depressed and feeling bad and all we do is try to encourage them..she said not everybody is depressed or broken hearted that comes in the truth....I said I agree, because her and I have a similar personality...happy and positive...we are human...But I said, look around what do you see...she said a bunch of depressed folks who pretend they are happy, I said, bingo...Most folks that come into the truth are depressed in some way, had something terrible happen to them...or born in ....when you talk to many of the friends they will tell you this story of how they came to the truth & it's never happy...They never tell a story of someone coming to the truth who is well adjusted to society, it's mostly societies misfits who need to belong...and I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but what the society is saying...only the depressed and broken hearted (add crazy too) are attracted to the truth.

I think that all this ARC stuff is going to finally show....& they are trying to show a different religion...a warmer nicer religion and show the world see we make mistakes but we correct them...people are not going to think that at all.. they are going to take away from it what we did...THE SOCIETY WAS THE BAD GUY...

I can't wait to be at the hall for this wt....my congregation, when something like this happens, there aren't a lot of comments...their necks go stiff...I watch their body language....it's really something to see...They will read it but they ain't swallowing it....

Stay tuned ....I think we may see more of this...there will be die hards that won't think a thing of it....but others who are there just for the social part and not for the doctrine, they'll see it and say, yep that's the way they do things...but I'm having fun....& I belong somewhere & I'm needed and I fit...so who cares if they flip flop or try to run you life...I'm ok.

Tor

53

Skinned and Thrown About.....

by Tech49 in

this is a little long, but stick with me.. if you recall, when the building work was in full swing at the new lakefront villa (warwick), wt was having workers come and they would put them up for a year, or more, while they were providing "volunteer services".

with that, and the impending need for hundreds and hundreds of new khs in the usa territory, the congregations were abuzz with the need for "continued construction volunteers".

recently, as many of you know, wt headquarters has sent pretty much everyone home, and is no longer needing workers at the new warwick site, as the building is mostly complete, with the dedication coming up later this year.

tor1500

@ToesUP,

Exactly, JW's are about being seen...I was told that regarding field service...as long as you go out and be seen. But you are so correct...it's all about appearances...seen given out literature, seen at the hall, if you're not noticed at the hall, then go to the bathroom to be seen...

No most JW's are not who they are in the hall...they send their representatives to the hall. The real person is when you just drop by the house..but again they can put on then....I say be a fly on the wall and you would really see who they really are....

I've seen the nicest brothers in the hall and when they leave they are yelling at the wife to hurry up...

But when you come to think of it we all send our representatives out ....most of us never show the real them, because most folks feel the real them would not be accepted....

I feel sorry for those that this has happened to...but would these same couples if heard these stories, would they have had any empathy for them ? I don't think so, they would have soft soaped it and said....Jehovah will make a way.

Tor