Posts by tor1500

30

Why is the approval of family so important?

by jwfacts in

one of the reasons people remain pimo is fear of losing family.

those that are disfellowshipped and shunned regularly comment about how devastated that they have lost the approval of their parents.. when i respond to emails from people saying how difficult it is being estranged or looked down on by their parents, i would like to say that over time they will come to terms with it, except i not sure that people ever do.

i cannot shake that feeling either.

tor1500

Hi.

Great replies. I like the one where they say if your family members don't want to talk to you. It's their lost. If a mom or dad can shun their own children because they don't want to be witnesses or that they get df'd for just being human. You have to ask yourself do they really love them?

Just because you are a parent does not mean they are like Donna Reed or any of those tv moms and dads.

I do get it though. My husband is a middle child and still he craves attention, so I give to him.

Many lack self esteem and replaced it with crowd esteem. So some people crave approval 24/7. I have a friend and her mom did the best she could. It was a big family. But she could never do enough. FYI: there was a father but he was away a lot to make money to feed the family. Until this day my friend still seeks approval and her mother has since died. So sometimes she'll call me and say. "You'll be so proud of me....". I'm not her mom and I have made some not too wise choices so I'm not the one she should tell. But I realize it's really about not ever being able to please her mom. But in defense of her mom all the kids went to college. They are kind of messed up but in a large family that can happen.

We all want to have a sense of belonging. Some more than others. At the end of the day. We all want someplace to rest our hearts.

Tor

6

Ironic song title June 2017 broadcast. Has someone in the GB got a sense of humour?

by stuckinarut2 in

just watching that train-wreck of a song in the june 2017 broadcast.

(btw, yet another one filmed in australia i see).

"i can get back up!

tor1500

Hi All,

Thar song is something they took from A Gospel Song by Kirk Franklin called "we fall down but we get up". The JW's are slowly imitating other religions. In a wt a while ago. They wrote, "what would Jesus do". Now when other christians started to say that the Jw's would have their negative comments. Now who is using the phrase.

Stay tuned there will be more songs that mirror gospels songs. But only folks like me who have been to places of worship would be able to recognize it.

The org. is trying to show how warm and fuzzy they are. Lurkers if you are thinking about having a study. Do your research and pay attention. The public literature is much better than the congregations literature. All our literature is about dos and don'ts. But the public is geared towards trying to make life better.

If this religion is to survive they are going to have to change their game. They have to attract the young folks and that's not happening. That's why they are merging congregations. Many say well it's because the young ones moved away. Could be but i think they move away because they don't want to be a JW.

There is very little growth and everybody knows it.

So again keep on the lookout for more mainstream Christian stuff. We can only hope this social media generation can make a change in the org.

Tor

24

Do WT Publications Make Us Feel Unworthy, Unlovable and Helpless?

by jp1692 in

it is my contention that the wtbts, (as do all high-control, authoritarian cults), deliberately cultivates dysfunctional beliefs among its members.

in particular, the most destructive of these beliefs are those that undermine one's feelings of self-worth.

for a research project i am doing, i am looking for direct quotes from wt publications that seem to be specifically designed to manipulate the readers into feeling: unworthy, unlovable, inadequate and/or helpless.

tor1500

@Stillin,

I do the same thing. I see those videos and say what a scam to get our money and loyalty. The WT has some good points but they are not the only points.

To me religion/spirituality is like this. You don't close your mind to other ideas of doctrine because that is all it is. Mans idea of what God wants. They call it interpretation. We humans wear and use different brands of makeup, clothing etc to make us or something complete.

It is good to listen to other voices. Keep what you need and toss what you don't out.

I love your last sentence. Now you feel stupid but not guilty. Great mindset. You can't undo the past but you can do something about now and the future.

Many witnesses think they are in the right place. Some of us know, nope this is not it. Sometimes you have to let the lowly feel lowly because dome folks don't feel good unless they feel bad.

Tor

24

Do WT Publications Make Us Feel Unworthy, Unlovable and Helpless?

by jp1692 in

it is my contention that the wtbts, (as do all high-control, authoritarian cults), deliberately cultivates dysfunctional beliefs among its members.

in particular, the most destructive of these beliefs are those that undermine one's feelings of self-worth.

for a research project i am doing, i am looking for direct quotes from wt publications that seem to be specifically designed to manipulate the readers into feeling: unworthy, unlovable, inadequate and/or helpless.

tor1500

Hi jp1692,

It's just an observation. I read many sites of JW's x and present and it seems they have a issue with depression or something or other. Never read where a witness came from a balanced home life with love and support. Not to say any family life is without problems. Just read what Jw's say when they come to these type of sites.

Places like the org. give folks a place to fit and for others it's a better than others personality. My God is better than your God.

You ask if cults attract or create, it could be both. If you have a certain need a you may be attracted to a cult because the congregations are not too big and if you need constant stroking cults are best for that. Yes, they can create a person who may not be mentally ill but not too secure, the org. will take you over that edge. Or you will see through it like I do and don't spend to much time with the friends. I'm pretty well adjusted and they know it but trying undo my well adjusted self so I can need them. I don't think so.

Again just read the different sites most witnesses are just not happy people. They put on they are happy. Not true. I'm in. I see it all. I could say more but don't want to blow my cover. Most commetors here never reply to me. I don't have a Debbie downer story. I'm not a woe is me person. And don't blame the org for my behavior. I shun in my own way. When I see a df person I may smile hold the door for them even sit next to them. Just to acknowledge them.

Some of us come from homes that made us feel unworthy so the org plays on that and puts the icing on it. There are people out there who prey on people's weaknesses.

The society knows their audience and know just who they are appealing to. They know how to make videos to pull at your heart and purse strings. Just like on tv when they show you the poor and starving people and animals they too are pulling at the same strings the org is. Some of us are gullible and some not.

Again, birds of a feather flock together, can you spot the common denominator in witnesses?

But did you ever notice that some folks are both self confident? Maybe those turn out to be elders or elderettes.

Tor

23

JUNE 2017 Watchtower - Lost a loved one? Go out in service!

by pale.emperor in

apparently going to the kingdom hall and getting out in the door to door ministry is the best way to get over the loss of a loved one.

who'dve thunk it?.

stash: /intesoft-inc.appspot.com/post/80e3cef960fd4eee9fd5cd757c438581.html

tor1500

Hi,

That is their answer to whatever ails you. Right now I'm dealing with a born in. They are having a difficult time in their marriage. All they want to do is go out in service then call me for encouragement. In reality they are running from their problems like many of us do. But witnesses make a habit of not dealing but know the scriptures back to front and what literature said about this or that. Witnesses do not apply what they read. They apply to others. That is why the want a Bible study so they can hide behind the student because if you have a student it makes appear you are doing the right thing. Not.

But what they don't get is how that sounds. I won't deny that sometimes the sound of your own voice drives you crazy and your heart is in a choke hold, but if God is the God of peace and comfort then why hit the street. Witnesses don't have the faith to survive. Even they have a song that says. Do you have faith to survive? Nope they don't. They only have head knowledge and run to the hall for meetings because that's all they feel they should do. It's always said never miss your meetings meanwhile the ones who attend the meetings wouldn't give you a drink of water. To them being a Christian is going to the meeting and hours.

Tor

24

Do WT Publications Make Us Feel Unworthy, Unlovable and Helpless?

by jp1692 in

it is my contention that the wtbts, (as do all high-control, authoritarian cults), deliberately cultivates dysfunctional beliefs among its members.

in particular, the most destructive of these beliefs are those that undermine one's feelings of self-worth.

for a research project i am doing, i am looking for direct quotes from wt publications that seem to be specifically designed to manipulate the readers into feeling: unworthy, unlovable, inadequate and/or helpless.

tor1500

Hi,

Most felt that way before they became witnesses. That's who they prey on. So the literature is tailored made for those types of personalities. If you have a happy nature they will try to suck it out of you. One thing about life what can't be cured in our society will be colonized. Remember the lepers, they could not cure them so they colonized them. So that is to say, birds of a feather flock together. Yes, there are many nationalities in the org., but there is also many personalities but they are the same....not feeling worthy.

If you feel worthy, you won't last as a Jw. The literature is written for Debbie downers.

Jws forget to put on their oxygen mask first before they help others. Because all they care about is hours and pleasing man.

Yes. The literature does make one feel less than, but that's man saying it. What does God say?

Tor

20

How many here are married to (still In) Jay Dubs? Any tips or advice for keeping the marriage going?

by NikL in

jw
friends

if you are, you know it is not easy to remain intimate with someone who thinks you are basically "walking dead".. any thoughts or tips to share with the board?.

what has been the greatest issue for your marriage?.

need to vent?.

tor1500

Hi.

I a witness not married to one. But from all the sisters I talk to that are married and all the literature the society writes about marriage, they don't take heed to any of it. So happy they are not single and got their mate they lost focus on the marriage.

A couple of tips from my observations: Keep the org. out your bedroom, that is none of their business. Even a single witness they have no say in what goes on in anyone's bedroom. Watch soft intimate videos. That is to spice it up a bit. We all know marriage can become complacent. The everyday humdrum. Both of you pick out the video together and guess what? You both might find out you both got fantasies and realize you both are kind of jacked up so you both got to stay together. You don't want no one else to know how strange you are so now you got a common bond. Just a suggestion.

Another tip is Talk Talk Talk. And not about org. all the time. And don't judge one another like always saying Jehovah don't like this and I'll tell the elders and so on. That's all I got for now. As I mentioned I talk to many of the sisters and many like being married for the image but you can see they are trapped and unhappy. I don't talk to the brothers but I can imagine it's the same.

Tor

48

God of the Old Testament

by unsure in

to those on these forums who are christian and or to those who believe in the god of the old testament; how does one overcome many of the questionable actions god took or allowed to happen in the old testament?.

many if not most of us have heard of criticisms of the god of the old testament.

you can find these criticisms on many websites.. how do you explain to an honest hearted person why god acted the way they did?.

tor1500

Hi,

God was a hard task master back in the OT. Plus his son was with him so he could create all the havoc he wanted here on earth.

But, then his son Jesus came to earth and suddenly we see God calm down. Reminds me of how cold and unsympathetic some are until they have a child... different person now, even more tolerant.

You don't read too much fire and brimstone much in the NT.

Another theory, maybe God is Jesus and while he came to earth he couldn't destroy and have a ministry and preach the good news.

I am making this all up. But it sounds good. Maybe the God that man wrote about is not really who God is. God can explain things but man cannot.

Tor

38

How can angels be sexually attracted to women?

by Island Man in

the nephilim account in genesis is utterly ridiculous when you consider that angels are sex-less beings and would therefore lack sex-drive and romantic attraction.

think of how difficult it is for humans with a sex drive to be sexually attracted to animals.

now take away that sex drive and it becomes literally impossible.

tor1500

Hi,

Just a thought here. When God created man and woman, don't think they were sexual yet, they were busy doing who knows what. But eventually he/God said be fruitful and fill the earth. So I think that is when God put the sexual attraction into Adam and Eve. This he never told to the angels. Maybe we are made like them but we have permission to have sex.

Niw how these certain angels grew male sexual organs, as Flip Wilso said. The devil made me do it. If Satan can be a snake he can produce sexual organs too. And Satan told his angels to be fruitful and multiply too, because he too wants more of his soldiers on earth.

Whats the score?

God: trillions

satan: to be determined

Tor

38

How can angels be sexually attracted to women?

by Island Man in

the nephilim account in genesis is utterly ridiculous when you consider that angels are sex-less beings and would therefore lack sex-drive and romantic attraction.

think of how difficult it is for humans with a sex drive to be sexually attracted to animals.

now take away that sex drive and it becomes literally impossible.

tor1500

Hi All,

I think it's this free will thing God gave us. The angels had free will too. Don't you think the angels looked down at humans having sex and thought hey, I want to have sex too. God gave me free will, well heck, I am going to use it. Humans have all the fun.

Why do you think the 144,000 are not going to be defiled by sex because they are going to be eunuch's so they won't be tempted by the daughters of men. This also dispels the Jw version of who the 144,000 really are. The number is literal and so is the fact the will not have had sex.

I don't know whether this story is true or not or the Bible written by men inspired by God, but there are some good lessons in there on how we can get along on earth with all the differences we all have.

That story about the angels and humans just goes to show sex is as natural as breathing. It's common to all species of life and even spirits.

Maybe the better question is how can women be sexually attracted to angels. Didn't they see their wings. Wow they must have been very clever and most of all great eye candy.

Tor