Posts by oldskool

5

The world is about to come to its end and what does the Watchtower do?

by Crazyguy in

they buy a hotel!

yep in 1975 when the world was about to come to its end the borg buys the brooklyn hotel for 2 million dollars.

this information has come out now do to the fact they have put up this property for sale.

oldskool

From what I understand, the mindset within the organization has always been that WTS owned property would make it through Armageddon. A somewhat pointless belief, given that an omnipotent Jehovah could keep any structure he wanted to remain for his people.

Nevertheless, The feeling that what the JWs 'own' would make it through no doubt was always the internal fallback for why it was ok to keep purchasing and building. A move they greatly benefit them now, given how common it is for the worlds billionaires and millionaires to safeguard their money in an ever growing NYC real estate boom.

24

The Watchtower's method to show that it was appointed in 1919 CE

by Doug Mason in

please note that when you tell me of the corrections i need to make that this is a simplfied, minimalist presentation dealing with the society's appointment in 1919.. it is available as a powerpoint show: http://www.jwstudies.com/appointed_in_1919.ppsx .

and as a pdf: http://www.jwstudies.com/appointed_in_1919.pdf.

doug.

oldskool

Impressive book Doug, I will have to spend some time with it.

Personally, I have always felt the bigger story regarding the 1914/19 teachings, including the 1935 'miracle', was the rhetorical power behind the story.

Most JWs I knew understood very little about these teachings. While lots of attention is paid in writings about JWs regarding the specific workings of how the Watchtower arrives at a point, the basic concept of what is actually going on in the mind of somebody that hears the teachings doesn't get as much attention.

I think most JWs hear:

- Smart sounding bible stuff i don't have time to understand

- Must be right

- I'll figure that out later, boy the WTS is really smart!

The most 'learned" JWs I have known never really got beyond repeating this stuff verbatim, usually without much comprehension because how could there be any, its all nonsense.

Which leads me back to my other question, and maybe it's in your book. What is the last prophecy the WTS fulfills, according to current belief? I'm really curious to figure this one out.

48

JW Video Armageddon to occur before 2040

by Listener in

sorry i thought it was a new morning worship video but it is 6 months old and has already been discussed on here.. it is presented by gb helper k flodin and about this generation.

the delusion and hypocrisy runs deep.. he reminds the cult members not to speculate because they aren't supposed to know the day or the hour.

then he proceeds to speculate that armageddon will occur before 2040.. https://tv.jw.org/#en/video/vodprogramsevents/pub-jwbmw_201511_3_video.

oldskool

Fascinating video. To have been away from JW news for about a decade, and to step back into this week and see this video is stunning.

The entire JW faith, from all I have seen, tells me that the JW faith is more about continuously experiencing anticipation than any formal set of beliefs, practices, or traditions.

Most of the general dogmas are a means to an end, used to validate their superiority over other faiths. They really could be anything. If nobody celebrated birthdays they would have been making the case for 100 years that it is an essential christian practice.

The amazing thing is how blatant all of this talk about the future is really about the present. It's a formalized fantasy that distracts from ordinary life. It's all about the experience. That the future they dream about never actually comes to be is besides the point. We got through today by dreaming about tomorrow. Mission accomplished.

33

Field Service Privilege Can Be Taken Away Due to Hairstyle and Tight Pants???

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

millie2105 hours agohere is something i just found out this week.former belief - field service is a publishers inalienable right new belief - field service privilege can be taken away if person styles hair or wears clothing in a way that is deemed metrosexual.i was pretty much dumbfounded.. this was posted on another thread, so i decided to start a new topic about this.

i think this is amazing!

i wish this was in place when i was a kid.

oldskool

My take on the letter is that continued dabbling with "gender blurring" fashion trends can eventually result in a form of private reproof.

They are saying "if your appearance doesn't match what's between your legs we don't want you going door to door". Gender blurring, to use the letter's terminology, has emerged in fashion on and off for many years, but at least from my perspective it is bigger now than it ever has been. No big surprise it's being singled out. It's also a hot button political issue, they don't want representatives to appear to be on the "wrong" side of it.

I think what gets to me regarding fashion is how mixed the WTS is on fashion in general. You get the sense that they truly want conservative dress, but are hesitant to demand it, probably for fear their membership will appear like a regimented cult.

Another issue is that JW faith provides few avenues for personal expression, and too much push against personal fashion may actually constitute something the r&f won't tolerate, at least in western countries. So the Watchtower rides this middle ground, always strongly requesting conservative dress but not demanding it.

To put it another way, what is holding the WTS back from instituting a dress code? Why don't they just pull the trigger?

24

The Watchtower's method to show that it was appointed in 1919 CE

by Doug Mason in

please note that when you tell me of the corrections i need to make that this is a simplfied, minimalist presentation dealing with the society's appointment in 1919.. it is available as a powerpoint show: http://www.jwstudies.com/appointed_in_1919.ppsx .

and as a pdf: http://www.jwstudies.com/appointed_in_1919.pdf.

doug.

oldskool

Jonadab class is an older JW reference, I use it to refer to the change around 1935 that discerned the difference between the other sheep i.e. great crowd/multitude and the anointed.

The olympic efforts of reasoning required to arrive at 1914 using the bible is strains credulity enough. The leap to 1919 is the icing on the cake in terms of how self serving these beliefs actually are.

To get back to Mr. Mason's original point, I would argue the precise method used by the Watchtower Society to show that it was appointed in 1919 CE looks something like this:

A great question just came to me. What is the last year according to current JW teaching that the WTS/anointed fulfilled bible prophecy? I'm sure it is whatever is in the Daniel or revelation book. My assumption is that once the Knorr through Franz era kicked in the organization stopped fulfilling direct passages of scripture. The mythology was "set" so to speak, with no need to update that part of the story. At this point their books assume the continuation of the current postwar geopolitical world order with no major shake ups, giving the necessity for predictive concepts beyond generalities inessential.

I'm speaking directly regarding the WTS fulfilling prophecy. Not government entities or other world events.

33

Field Service Privilege Can Be Taken Away Due to Hairstyle and Tight Pants???

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

millie2105 hours agohere is something i just found out this week.former belief - field service is a publishers inalienable right new belief - field service privilege can be taken away if person styles hair or wears clothing in a way that is deemed metrosexual.i was pretty much dumbfounded.. this was posted on another thread, so i decided to start a new topic about this.

i think this is amazing!

i wish this was in place when i was a kid.

oldskool

Maybe this is more like marking in that one regard (non judicial)

An ambiguous concept that nobody ever understood.

The letter reads like guidelines for private reproof. Nothing new.

33

Has anyone been outed by jw health care workers?

by purrpurr in

jw
friends

carrying on from audespare thread.

i was wondering how common it is for a sinner/apostate to be outed by a babbling jw care worker?

say you went to your dr because you were pregnant and unmarried or wanting counseling for having to live a double life as a pretend jw... and a jw secretary at the drs office saw this on your file and went tattling to the elders?.

oldskool

I would say they can certainly do it. However, it is a strong case for a lawsuit. Probably could get a descent settlement out of the healthcare provider that employed the snitch.

33

Field Service Privilege Can Be Taken Away Due to Hairstyle and Tight Pants???

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

millie2105 hours agohere is something i just found out this week.former belief - field service is a publishers inalienable right new belief - field service privilege can be taken away if person styles hair or wears clothing in a way that is deemed metrosexual.i was pretty much dumbfounded.. this was posted on another thread, so i decided to start a new topic about this.

i think this is amazing!

i wish this was in place when i was a kid.

oldskool

If the written directive expressly states that clothing styles worn in non-Witnessing activities can be the basis for refusing brothers and sisters in otherwise good standing from engaging in field service when they ARE dressed appropriately, then yes, this is new.

Rather than being new wouldn't this simply be defining what was already at the discretion of the local Elders already? Reproof is reproof, they always could do it for any trivial violation found inside WT literature. The mentioned letter may have some defined terms, but it could have been done in the past anyway, correct?

Clothing was always something to be regulated. A good deal of this was informal, members checking each other through gossip, which eventually could lead to reproof action.

33

Field Service Privilege Can Be Taken Away Due to Hairstyle and Tight Pants???

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

millie2105 hours agohere is something i just found out this week.former belief - field service is a publishers inalienable right new belief - field service privilege can be taken away if person styles hair or wears clothing in a way that is deemed metrosexual.i was pretty much dumbfounded.. this was posted on another thread, so i decided to start a new topic about this.

i think this is amazing!

i wish this was in place when i was a kid.

oldskool

They called the Service Desk and much to their surprise were told -
Leave. Her. Alone.

Not sure where this occurred, guessing US. My first thought is WTS protecting against a lawsuit for inhibiting freedom of speech. Not a high risk threat, but the WTS knows the legal territory well.

The US is a country where the right to obnoxiously protest funerals was upheld as constitutional. Those that get in the way loose money in court.

Again, I don't see anything unusual in this. I don't think the WTS and local Elders in particular have ever shown a great ability to handle the particulars of internal judicial affairs with much consistency. Outside of org HQ there has always been some real sloppy work going on by the r&f amateurs they put in charge.

25

"They trampled on my humility."

by Zoos in

it's rare that i bump into someone from the old hall.

but it happened yesterday with one of the nicest brothers i remember.. he came into my place of work not knowing i worked there.

my company is now on his delivery route.

oldskool

Have there been any special "initiative", i.e. letter to Elders, articles, training, ect., that instructs Elders to essentially "root out" those that faded?