Posts by scholar

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Bruce X

The New Living Translation shows the meaning of Zech 1:12 very clearly for those who have difficulties to understand this verse:
"Upon hearing this, the angel of the LORD prayed this prayer: “O LORD of Heaven’s Armies, for seventy years now you have been angry with Jerusalem and the towns of Judah. How long until you again show mercy to them?”"
The angel asked this two decades after they left Babylon why they are still not being shown mercy. So for the last 70 years until now (20 years after exile) they have not been shown mercy. If they were really 70 years in exile then this would mean 90 years no mercy. This is another hint why they can't have been 70 years in exile
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The NWT renders this verse more correctly; "So the angel of Jehovah answered and said:"O Jehovah of armies , how long will you yourself not show mercy to Jerusalem and to the cities of Judah, whom you have denounced these seventy years". (emphasis added) Thus the text into English shows that the seventy years was a past event and not a present event awaiting an end. The text and its context along with Zech 7:5 clearly shows a reminder of a past event of the exilic 70 years as agreed by many scholars and commentators.
scholar JW
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349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

coming from a cult-addled buffoon, you can imagine how much your opinion matters to me

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When a person resorts to insults then one knows that such a person has lost the argument.

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

my understanding of the subject has long exceeded that of your cult-addled mind (and Protestant commentators generally). Just go away.

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Your understanding is bogus, pitiful and is a result of no research. In short, you do not know what you are talking about. You go away and play with your pathetic coloured charts.

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

That passage includes an expression of frustration about a period that had not yet ended, and very obviously doesn’t refer to a period that ended decades earlier. You’re really not very good at this.

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Nope. This verse is a historic reflection on the 70-year Exile already completed or fulfilled in 537 BCE. The wording reflects a past tense and the Study note in the NIV Study Bible associates this 70-year period with the 70 years of Jeremiah, Daniel and Ezra. I humbly recommend that you do more research on this subject. Please!

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

My statements are backed by facts and agreement from the entire body of experts in all relevant fields. You continue to spout drivel. The fact that you think you’re still right says everything it needs to.

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Your past history of posts on the subject of Chronology proves that you do not read widely nor do you consult with others merely reflecting or copying the false views of other naughty poztates.

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

Wrong. Zechariah doesn't refer to 70 years of exile at all, nor to Babylon's 70 years. Zechariah (7:1-7) refers to annual fasts in the 5th and 7th months, which by the 9th month of Darius' 4th year (518 BCE) had been held for 70 years. This places the first year of those fasts in 587 BCE when Jerusalem was destroyed.

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Wrong. Zechariah made two references to Jeremiah's 70 years- the period of Exile. The first reference is Zech 1:12 by means of an oracle on the 24th day,11th month in King Darius 2nd year- 519 BCE. The second reference is in Zech 7:5 by means of an oracle on the 4th day, of the 9th month in King Darius' 4th year-518 BCE.

These two references point back to the now completed or fulfilled Exilic period of 70 years wherein the Jews were engaped in improper fasting now being chastised by the prophet's oracle. Thus, Zechariah's two references to the 'seventy years' proves that the 70 years began in 607 BCE and ended in 537 BCE

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The Jews arrived in Jerusalem in 538 BCE rather than 537 so you're wrong there anyway, but that was only after Babylon was called to account in 539 BCE when the 70 years actually ended (Jeremiah 25:12). 539+70=609, which is the year that Babylon destroyed Assyria's final capital at Harran (compare Ezekiel 27:2, 23; Isaiah 23:13-15).

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False. The Jewish Exiles returened home in 537 BCE and not 538 BCE as this latter year is impossible as the time frame is too short to accommodate the many events that began in the first year of Cyrus. which marked the end of the 70 years fulfilling Jeremiah's prophecy at Jer 25:12.Your date 609 BCE for the beginning of the 70 years rather than 607 BCE is too fuzzy and is historically unreliable. Even Carl Jonsson considered 605 BCE rather than 609 BCE as equally possible so you have a big problem here.

You can go now with scholar's permission.

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

😂

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

The Chaldeans, following standard Mesopotamian practice, deported the Jews after they had conquered Jerusalem in 597 BC. The deportations were large, but certainly didn't involve the entire nation. Somewhere around 10,000 people were forced to relocate to the city of Babylon, the capital of the Chaldean empire. In 586 BC, Judah itself ceased to be an independent kingdom, and the earlier deportees found themselves without a homeland, without a state, and without a nation. This period, which actually begins in 597 but is traditionally dated at 586, is called the Exile in Jewish history; it ends with an accident in 538 when the Persians overthrow the Chaldeans.

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Trying to imply that Jewish scholars support a 70 year exile is such an obvious lie. 🤦‍♂️ Jewish Virtual Library:

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You need to check your comprehension for the above-cited reference refers to the Exile representing the Babylonian Exile which of course is that same 70 year period.

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(Note that Jewish tradition places the destruction in 586 BCE, however, 587 BCE is the correct year. See 586 or 587?)

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Most scholars favour 586 most notable was Edwin Thiele so yoy have a big problem here with 587 so methinks 607 is a better candidate as it is based on the 70 year Jewish Exile.

scholar JW

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349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Jeffro

Red herring. It is uncontested that there was an exile (the most significant one in early 597bce followed by the one at the time of Jerusalem’s destruction in 587bce).

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Hardly a red herring. The subject of the Jewish Exile is uncontested by scholars especiallt Jewish scholars but remains unknown amongst WT critics and Carl Jonsson who makes no or little mention of this most vital historical period of 70 Years.

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That is not at all the prevailing view, including among Jewish scholars. It is a theological assertion only, and one that is not supported by what the Bible actually says.

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Indeed it is for there is no other exilic period in jewish history than that pertaining to the Babylonian Exile of 70 years period./ Just do some further reading and rersearch.

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irrelevant ad hominem.

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This is just reflects your pitiful ignorance- hiding from the facts .

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Liar. Neither Jonsson nor anyone else says there ‘was no exile’. All relevant sources acknowledge the main exile in early 597bce and the later deportation in 587bce.

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Prove me wrong. Show me where in his book where he discusses the subject of the Jewish Exile for it is not even discussed as a heading in his Subject Index where it should occur.

scholar JW

349

Who really is the Faithful and Discreet Slave?

by Godlyman in

if anyone were to come up to you claiming that they are the faithful and discreet slave, how would you go about proving them to be false, based upon scripture?.

estephan.

scholar

Beth Sarim

The Bible never mentions a 70 year exile.''

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Just read the OT and any decent reference work to prove that there was indeed a Jewish exile of 70 years duration during which period the Jews were deported and lived in Babylon.

scholar JW