Already started a new thread on just that very topic, Tally. Feel free to add what you want.
Posts by Seeker
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51I am stunned!!...CharitablePlanning
by sf ini feel like i did when i first read ray's book crisis of conscience"; like i was punched deep in the gut and can't catch my breath.. i took someones suggestion here to call the: .
charitable planning office.
watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania.
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84
Bonsai Kitty
by suzi mayhem inok.. i know i've been a bit of a buster in the past, but this is for real.
there is a site out there, and apparently a demand, for modified housepets.
in a nutshell, what these ahem... [people] do is take a kitten, sedate it, insert the poor thing into a glass bottle with air holes drilled into it, and run tubes into it to feed it, and tubes into it to take care of everything else.
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Seeker
I sorry Seeker, but even if it's a joke it's STILL NOT FUNNY
to me.That's fine, for that is the essence of humor. Some people like one kind of humor, others like another kind. No problem.
The IDEA of taking a kitten and jamming it into a mason
bottle and sealing its butt with glue and inserting it with tubes
so as to keep it alive in such a tortured state is NOT FUNNY.
It is horrific!I agree 100%. That isn't what is funny about that site, though.
A really bad joke and nasty idea.
And if the point of the site was to do that to kittens, you'd be right.
Would you laugh at a web site that depicted Blacks being lynched and elaborated on the best way to hang a nigger? Let's say they didn't actually hang any. Would this be funny?
Nope, but that's entirely different for people actually do those things in real life. Nobody has ever made a Bonsai Kitty, which is why it is funny to make a site 'catering' to the 'tremendous demand' for them. They pulled a fast one and people fell for it, even though they way they described things made it very obvious that this wasn't real.
How about if we joke about how to burn a Jew in a home oven w/o actually buring one of course?
Once again, apples and oranges. The Holocaust did happen and there is nothing funny about it. A very key difference.
All jokes of that sort are utterly disgusting and NOT FUNNY!
I completely agree. The Bonsai Kitty site was funny for other reasons, however, that have nothing to do with your examples. It wasn't the sight of those kittens that pretended to show them in jars that was funny. That's now why I laugh at the joke. I love animals very much and have never, do not now, nor ever would cause harm or suffering to any of them. However, the Bonsai Kitty site is funny to me, and it is not funny for the concept of harming animals (even though none were), but has everyting to do with the tone of the site.
Shall we hit cats with mallets? No? Then why is Tom & Jerry funny?
Shall we drop anvils on coyotes? No? Better not watch Road Runner cartoons.
Humor deals with many subjects that would be awful if they were actually carried out in real life. If a particular type of humor doesn't appeal to you, ignore it and move on.
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6
Do JWs think they have a 'religion'?
by Seeker in(rather than continue to allow an existing thread to be hijacked by a different topic, i'm starting this new topic.
it continues an argument between myself and tallyman.
the question is, do jws refer to themselves as having a 'religion' or do they still follow the old rutherford notion of all religions being a 'snare and a racket'.
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Seeker
Remember, I'm talking current understanding. I know in the past they never used the word 'religion' to refer to their beliefs. But that was changed some years ago when they began to make a distinction between 'true religion' and all those 'false' ones.
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Do JWs think they have a 'religion'?
by Seeker in(rather than continue to allow an existing thread to be hijacked by a different topic, i'm starting this new topic.
it continues an argument between myself and tallyman.
the question is, do jws refer to themselves as having a 'religion' or do they still follow the old rutherford notion of all religions being a 'snare and a racket'.
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Seeker
(Rather than continue to allow an existing thread to be hijacked by a different topic, I'm starting this new topic. It continues an argument between myself and Tallyman. The question is, Do JWs refer to themselves as having a 'religion' or do they still follow the old Rutherford notion of all religions being a 'snare and a racket'. I say Rutherford's idea is old light and that JWs have long since referred to themselves as having the 'true religion' as opposed to all those false religions. Tally says that is not true, and that all I have to do is go to a Kingdom Hall and ask a JW if he has a religion and I will see I am wrong. Feel free to quote current literature that backs either side, if you wish.)
Tally,
You are right, I missed your context, and I apologize for that.
As for going down to the Hall, I have no need to do it. I was a JW not that long ago and know very well about how JWs view their religion. If you disagree, show some recent quotes that prove your claim.
I admit they used to refuse to call themselves a religion, and we had situations like the one Somebody referred to from her childhood. But this is old stuff, not current, and hasn't been current for some years now. I'm sure you can dig up some old-timers who still think that way, and still make "back calls", and refer to the "Kingdom Ministry". But none of that is relevant, for it's changed whether they want to change along with it.
It's so silly to get this pendantic over my use of the word "religion." Talk about hijacking a thread over nothing. I'll bring this out to a new topic so we will stop messing with the original thread that has nothing to do with this.
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51
I am stunned!!...CharitablePlanning
by sf ini feel like i did when i first read ray's book crisis of conscience"; like i was punched deep in the gut and can't catch my breath.. i took someones suggestion here to call the: .
charitable planning office.
watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania.
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Seeker
Of course I'm neutral on this issue. I began by asking a question so I could gain empathy. Your attack on me caused me to change my tone.
The Watchtower Kult Does NOT do ANYTHING "right"!
And you call me dogmatic? That is an absurd statement. Of course they do some things right. Your thinking is black-and-white. The WTS is corrupt, but not every last thing within it is bad. Think rationally.
As for whether or not it's a "religion," that's too easy. Of course they call it a religion. "How can a person tell the true religion?", their articles ask. "What sets the right religion apart?" other articles talk about. "What religion are you?" "I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses" they answer.
Rutherford's time has come and gone, and that old distinction made about the world "religion" is long over.
Believe what you want, Tally, but you'll lose your potential audience if you stick to outdated ideas. I'm not interested, and this is now going way off-topic in this thread. If you wish to debate this further, start a new thread.
As for tangling with me, you are always welcome to do so. It was your tactics I objected to. I asked a simple question and you came down on me as if I were a dub, and threw out a whole lot of irrelevant data. It did not address my question, and it treated me as if I were ignorant of WTS atrocities. Since you know better, I felt that particular type of response was rude. So tangle with me all you want, but if you do objectionable things I will object.
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51
I am stunned!!...CharitablePlanning
by sf ini feel like i did when i first read ray's book crisis of conscience"; like i was punched deep in the gut and can't catch my breath.. i took someones suggestion here to call the: .
charitable planning office.
watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania.
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Seeker
Scally,
Thank you for your response, for now I understand your reaction, and how it is a personal one for you based on your experiences. I can understand that.
Tally,
You're wrong. JWs do view it as a religion. Your ideas were true decades ago, not any more except among JWs who didn't keep up.
I'm not an apologist for JWs, and you know it very well. To treat me as you have in this thread is shocking and appalling. You know better and should be ashamed of using You Know tactics on me. I deserve better.
I stand for truth and accuracy in all things. If the WTS does something wrong, I expose it. If they do something right, I applaud it. If they do something like this, the CDA, that is neither awful nor wonderful, I'm neutral. To see people reacting: "OHMIGOD, THEY ACCEPT VOLUNTARY DONATIONS!!!!" seemed a bit extreme to me, but now that Scally explained her personal background, I can understand why she would feel this way. All I wanted was an explanation, and what you did, Tally, was uncalled for.
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51
I am stunned!!...CharitablePlanning
by sf ini feel like i did when i first read ray's book crisis of conscience"; like i was punched deep in the gut and can't catch my breath.. i took someones suggestion here to call the: .
charitable planning office.
watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania.
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Seeker
Tally,
You completely ignored the point of my post. I'm not talking about the way WE view this religion, but the way the average JW thinks about their religion. And yes, it is a religion to them, and Rutherford's "Snare and a racket" concept has been out of date for many years.
For all the atrocities this religion is responsible for, the average JW remains totally ignorant of such things. They like their religion and want to support it. The law allows for donations to be made to such organizations. There are steps that should be taken. This brochure explains how to do it.
Now if they required each JW to get this brochure, and to study it in the bookstudy, and to have each bookstudy conductor to witness each publisher signing away their money, I could understand the rage. But they don't. Some witnesses (and ex-witnesses, evidently) have never even heard of this arrangement and this brochure. You have to ask for it to see it. It's not as if it's being pushed in people's faces.
Be outraged about the WTS as much as you want, and I share your feelings for my own life has been irrevocably altered by my experiences and I'm not happy about it. But I still don't understand why this particular brochure is causing such rage in people.
This is genuinely puzzling to me, and I would appreciate a serious response, not name-calling and ridicule.
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51
I am stunned!!...CharitablePlanning
by sf ini feel like i did when i first read ray's book crisis of conscience"; like i was punched deep in the gut and can't catch my breath.. i took someones suggestion here to call the: .
charitable planning office.
watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania.
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Seeker
Hi Scally,
I'm very familiar with this CDA business, and it's fairly common knowledge. What I'm not sure about is why it struck you this hard? Yes, we all know what we think of the WTS, but JWs think of it as their religion, and people in all religions like to donate money to their favorite cause. It provides tax benefits to them, and helps the religion. All religions have this, and this booklet is a way of explaining the legal steps involved to do things by the book.
Why is this shocking? We all know JWs will want to send money to the WTS -- it's their financial foundation, after all. So why is this news? Would you expect the WTS to tell the publishers, 'No, don't send us anything'?
Just genuinely curious.
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84
Bonsai Kitty
by suzi mayhem inok.. i know i've been a bit of a buster in the past, but this is for real.
there is a site out there, and apparently a demand, for modified housepets.
in a nutshell, what these ahem... [people] do is take a kitten, sedate it, insert the poor thing into a glass bottle with air holes drilled into it, and run tubes into it to feed it, and tubes into it to take care of everything else.
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Seeker
[quote]If we as the good and loving humans we like to think we are can
find humor in the torture of living things, then we need to acknowledge that evil resides in everyone of us. If we can distance
ourselves from that sort of pain in order to laugh, then the Jewish Holocaust is in us as a real possibility. SCARY, isn't it! [\quote]Only if it were true, which it isn't. No one in this thread is finding humor in the torture of living things. After all, no living things were tortured to make that web site. It is a joke, not reality. Think of it as a Hollywood movie where you see an animal suffering on the screen and then at the end of the movie you see the tag line that 'No animals were harmed in the filming of this movie' and you realize it was all trickery to only make it appear the animal suffered.
If cats were really harmed, I'd be as outraged as the rest of you. But because not one cat was harmed in real life, I fail to see what the fuss is about. And to bring the holocaust into it is to cheapen what those victims went through. That was no joke and living creature were harmed, but this is a joke and no living creatures were harmed. A very key difference.
Much humor depends on things that, were they to be real, would be horrible. It is precisely the lack of reality that allows us to enjoy the surprise of the humor. To take an inocuous example, it is very funny to see Oliver Hardy get run over by a piano when Stan Laurel lets go. If that happened in real life, we'd be very concerned. But because it wasn't real, we laugh heartily in a feeling of release.
See the difference?
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"interfering with a religion"?!
by fodeja inonline scientology critic jailed in canada.
computer engineer keith henson has been arrested in canada,.
where he had planned to file for status as a political refugee after.
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Seeker
What the judge did was bizarre, that's for sure.
For those interested in the defendent's side of the story, he has a web site here:
Source: http://216.240.45.86/