Seeker4

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Posts by Seeker4

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  12

  Where Are Those Purged in the Great Bethel Shakeup of 1981?

  by Seeker4 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  over the last couple of days i've been re-reading parts of crisis of conscience, and wondering where some of these folks are.

  i know that ray and cynthia franz are in georgia and having some health issues, and that ed dunlap passed away.

  randy is in ca and often here with us.

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  Seeker4

  Over the last couple of days I've been re-reading parts of Crisis of Conscience, and wondering where some of these folks are.
  
  I know that Ray and Cynthia Franz are in Georgia and having some health issues, and that Ed Dunlap passed away. Randy is in CA and often here with us.
  
  But do we know what happened to some of the others?
  
  Peter Gregerson, Rene and Elsie Vazquez, Chris Sanchez, Nestor Kuilan or Diane Beers?
  
  Were there others that also left at that time?
  
  S4
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  8

  Tom Cabeen on EWTN's Journey Home tonight. I enjoyed it.

  by Seeker4 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  watched tom tonight, and thought he made some excellent points.

  i called, and actually got through, but the producer didn't put me on.

  i wanted to ask tom if his leaving bethel in 1980 had any connection with the whole ray franz/ed dunlap incident,which was happening then.. as tom knows, i'm one of those ex-jws who became an atheist, so i took quite a different path than he did in leaving the jws, and i certainly don't agree with his conclusions.

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  Seeker4

  As far as I know, Steve is still an elder in Burlington. We've known each other since we were teenagers.
  
  I taught two Pioneer schools in Burlington back in the 1980s, and Steve and I hung out some. Steve talked with me a little about the events surrounding the great purge at Bethel when Ray left. It was a long time ago and I don't remember a lot of the details, but I think that was part of the reason he left.
  
  I think he was questioned by one of the "Inquisitions" at the time - with Fred Rusk if I remember correctly. I first met Fred in 1981 when we traveled with him to an international convention in Lima, Peru. We hit it off with Fred and Marge, and they came up and stayed with us in Vermont a few times. Fred also talked with me a few times about how things went down with Ray Franz at Bethel, and spoke wistfully of the fact that essentially all of the brothers he'd taught Gilead School with were no longer Witnesses except Ulysses Glass.
  
  Fred also made quite a point on one of his visits to my house of showing me the evidence for the 607 date. I wasn't sure why, at the time. I also know that on our trip to Peru he met with all the missionaries and went over several points that were things Ray and Ed Dunlap had questioned to make sure the missionaries were toeing the WTS party line.
  
  Also on that trip to Peru was Arthur Worsley - who was a lot of fun actually. One night we were all out to dinner with a very well connected couple from California, I think. The brother may have been an ex-DO, and Fred indicated he'd run into some problems with the WTS, though I'm not sure what, but enough to disillusion him it seems. The former DO told quite a story about his involvement with helping a Witness get out of Communist China and resettle in the US. I think this Chinese Witness had his story in the mags at one time.
  
  Can't remember all the details - just reminiscing. I've often wondered if that CA former DO eventually left the WTS.
  
  S4
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  127

  The End of Circuit Overseers

  by scotsman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  is indeed apparently nigh as another poster predicted along with the end of the weekly bs.

  not sure when this should take place but i'm reliably informed by a family member that one of the uk's overseers was talking about it fairly recently.

  reduced to weekend visits by an outside but local elder instead.. i have no further info..

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  Seeker4

  Good comment Carlos. I agree that a lot of the DOs were worse than the COs, though there were some nasty little COs.
  
  The WTS arrangement produces an unusual number of little spiritual bullies. i knew quite a few.
  
  I also had some COs that I deeply respected. That was the worry every three years - or the relief - we're you going to get rid of some insufferable little prick, or get a new one??!!
  
  S4
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  21

  Living your lifes dream....Have you? Are you? Will you?......

  by oompa in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i subscribed to cruising world magazine for over 20 years.

  many people or couples wrote their stories about either their life aboard a sailing yacht, or their time they put mainland life on hold for a year or more and lived their dream of cruising on an sailing yacht.

  this became my dream, and i have sailed extensively since age 13. i also loved photography, and that goes real well with sailing exploration, and life aboard among the islands.. my first jw wife liked that dream too, my second jw wife does not!

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  Seeker4

  One of my goals for this year was to fish more - connect with my environment like that. I live next to the Connecticut River here in New England, and I wanted to do more stuff on the river.
  
  So this weekend I combined a few goals. A friend I've been cultivating called and asked if I wanted to go with him when he took his boat out for the first time on the river this year. Two of my life goals working together - perfect.
  
  We head out last evening, drop the boat in the river, and head up stream a few miles. It was awesome. Huge sky with these massive white clouds floating over, Canada geese, ducks, red winged black birds, beaver and even a bald eagle hanging around us. Quite a spectacular setting. Catching half a dozen perch - and tossing them back.
  
  Then the motor quit - and it got even more fun. Got to throw in a good workout as I paddled that damn big 19' out board back across the river and upstream to another boat landing with a canoe paddle while standing in the middle of the boat! I felt like Laird Hamilton paddling his long board around the Hawaiian islands! My buddy got a ride back to his truck and trailer, we got the crippled boat out, and I finished the evening with a couple of cold Long Trail ales while watching some awesome mixed martial art fights on Verses. Urijah Faber maintained his title, and I went to bed a happy man.
  
  That's taking your soul on a journey it can enjoy!
  
  S4
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  42

  some quirks of the DC talks...

  by metaspy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  here is a run down of some special things i noticed at the district convention.. i probably took better notes now than when i used to go as a jw.. however, my notes now are mostly "stupid" things that they say on stage.

  saturday.

  symposium: directed by god's spirit in our ministry - speaking the word of god with boldness.

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  Seeker4

  Thanks Metaspy.
  
  Glad to hear the info on the drama in a little more detail. I have a son in law still in and want to give him a heads-up about the new anti-ed drama.
  
  S4
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  51

  7th Anniversary on JWD

  by blondie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i just realized that 5-28 was my 7th anniversary on jwd.

  my participation has changed over time and most of what i do is the review each week.

  people have come and gone, lots of new names, and some old-timers like me.

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  Seeker4

  Congratulations!
  
  I just looked - my 7th anniversary here was Feb. 13. Wow - time flies. We're also very close to the same age.
  
  Raise a glass to the JWD old timers tonight!
  
  S4
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  35

  Notes from Losch's talk during "zone visit" to Hawaii (from my mother)

  by Lady Zombie in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my mother forwarded me this e-mail yesterday.

  i've copied and pasted it exactly as i got it.. -------------------------------.

  notes from bro.

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  Seeker4

  I love that - Matt 24:14 has been fulfilled - then he lists over half the world's population that has no idea in hell who JWs are!
  
  This is the same old same old - except for this newer assertion that the good news has been preached throughout all the Earth. What utter nonsense that is. There are MORE people every day who've never heard anything about the Good News than there were the day before.
  
  And 3,000,000 hours a spent every day preaching? Doing what?? I was a Pioneer. I know most of that time is spent driving around knocking on doors where no one is home. Perhaps one out of every 100 hours spent in the "ministry" is actually spent talking to someone about the Kingdom. Most people see JWs as magazine and book pushers, pamphlet hander-outers. Almost no one knows anything about the idea of the good news of the kingdom from JWs!!
  
  S4
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  7

  WTS donations and their legal costs

  by heyfea in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you think the wt pays their lawyers with the donations which are supposed to be strictly for the world preaching work?

  i bet they do.

  they are stealing from the dubs.

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  Seeker4

  They have lawyers on staff at Bethel. They may also be paying attorneys outside of Bethel.
  
  I guess it would depend on whether or not one considered paying for legal council as part of the WW Witnessing work. My guess is that they do. Now whether the rank and file would be comfortable with that set up if the WTS came clean with them about it is another thing.
  
  The WTS is so NOT a transparent organization.
  
  S4
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  33

  Judge Rutherford's Air Conditioning at Bethel

  by VM44 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i recall reading long ago (so long ago i don't recall where) that someone asked judge rutherford why his office at bethel, brooklyn had an air conditioning unit while the workers in the printing factory below had to work in the heat.. rutherford's answer was that the air conditioning unit was a gift!.

  does anyone also recall reading this?.

  wouldn't rutherford feel a little guilty about enjoying cool air while the people downstairs were working all day under hot and humid conditions?.

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  Seeker4

  Not sure about the disfellowshipping - someone here knows, I'm sure.
  
  He ended up suing the WTS, I think - and WON!
  
  S4
• 
  33

  Judge Rutherford's Air Conditioning at Bethel

  by VM44 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i recall reading long ago (so long ago i don't recall where) that someone asked judge rutherford why his office at bethel, brooklyn had an air conditioning unit while the workers in the printing factory below had to work in the heat.. rutherford's answer was that the air conditioning unit was a gift!.

  does anyone also recall reading this?.

  wouldn't rutherford feel a little guilty about enjoying cool air while the people downstairs were working all day under hot and humid conditions?.

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  Seeker4

  Rutherford the Bully.
  
  I knew Arthur Worsley. an interesting guy.
  
  S4