Shane

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Posts by Shane

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  34

  Anointed Christians throughout 2,000 years

  by ozziepost in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this is the view as found in the latest magazine:.

  "for almost 2,000 years, that peace has been enjoyed by faithful anointed members of the body of christ.

  " (the watchtower september 1, 2001, page 14, paragraph 3).

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  Shane

  Gopher says >>>If I may, what exactly do you mean by "faithful" ones? Are you refering to ones who have done some service to God and have shown they were faithful? Or are we speaking of ones who put "actual FAITH" in the Son of God and have "believed IN him?" Ones who have "accepted" and "received the Son of God" and thus were given 'authority' to be 'sons of God' (which is available to anyone wishing) BECAUSE of his name? <<<
  Well in all honesty I mean any human that is or has been faithful to the creator, in prayer and all the many facets of striving to please him in an imperfect way, that really only God in his infinite wisdom can fully understand and know their limitations. I do not put much trust in the idea of a faithful and discreet slave class anymore, it makes me sick to heart. The very thought of it reminds me of the hierarchy of what has become known as Jehovah's Witness's who make many statements that do not come true, and they are not a loving spokesman for God when it comes to dealing with other humans that are just like them" imperfect, and will be imperfect till God makes us perfect not until then,a God directed and inspired body of men as they say they are. So in answer to your question, faithful ones too are anyone whose heart is on bent knees sort to speak in the sight of God, and only he knows who fits that description, NO one else is able to speak for the creator or judge the heart of man.
  This is my convection on the matter. ~Shane
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  27

  Deepening Saddness

  by Amazing in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i look back on the 1970s with a sense of loss and nostalgia.

  i was a young man, just married, and so much in love with my beautiful wife.

  i had just started my engineering career, and was debt free.

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  Shane

  I met my wife of 22 years in a Jehovah's Witness Kingdom Hall, As I look back,I believe we would have had less strife if we would NOT have had the family book" for her to harp on me with.
  All it did was give them ammunition to use against their men, all those requirements; Hell you can't just be a good husband and father, you have to be "Willie Watchtower too. ~ Shane
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  86

  More Bethelite Table Crumbs Please!

  by MadApostate in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in a controversial post in a separate thread, janh makes an extremely good observation that a certain former gb member will likely carry many, many wts "top secrets" to his grave, for whatever reasons he does not wish to divulge such.. then, on this db, former bethelites constantly exchange posts where their word choice is "cloaked" so that many of us who were not insiders are left guessing at meaning, people, etc.

  obviously, even individual members of this fraternity have unique experiences and insights.

  if such info is not disseminated, it is lost if that person dies naturally or in an accident.. would you folks please post more elaborately so that the rest of us can benefit from your knowledge and experience.. the statement that motivated this post made a silent reference to the author of the happiness book.

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  Shane

  WHAT EVER COMES OUT THROUGH THOSE GATES, WE STAND A BETTER CHANCE FOR SURVIVAL IF WE WORK TOGETHER DO YOU UNDERSTAND !!!
• 
  80

  Food at Proper Time:Insider's Insight from Barbara

  by Maximus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  barbara anderson's attention was called to the thread about the differences in policy of great britain and the us regarding child abuse; as you know she has championed a change in that policy.

  another post caught her eye, and she expressed the desire to share some thoughts with you.

  i'm delighted to share her first post, which i know you will find riveting.

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  Shane

  Maximus "What ever comes out through those gates, we stand a better chance if we work together'"
  Keep up the good work their Bud.
  I hate it when the Witness's say referring to them self's: Gods organization, come on give me a break any religion can claim that statement upon them self ~ Shane
• 
  3

  Any of this sound familar:

  by Shane in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  2000 by steven hassan - published by freedom of mind press, somerville ma .

  destructive mind control can be understood in terms of four basic components, which form the.

  acronym bite: .

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• 

  Shane

  © 2000 by Steven Hassan - published by Freedom of Mind Press, Somerville MA
  Destructive mind control can be understood in terms of four basic components, which form the
  acronym BITE:
  I. Behavior Control
  II. Information Control
  III. Thought Control
  IV. Emotional Control

  I. Behavior Control

  1. Regulation of individual’s physical reality
  a. Where, how and with whom the member lives and associates with
  b. What clothes, colors, hairstyles the person wears
  c. What food the person eats, drinks, adopts, and rejects
  d. How much sleep the person is able to have
  e. Financial dependence
  f. Little or no time spent on leisure, entertainment, vacations
  2. Major time commitment required for indoctrination sessions and group rituals
  3. Need to ask permission for major decisions
  4. Need to report thoughts, feelings and activities to superiors
  5. Rewards and punishments (behavior modification techniques- positive and negative).
  5. Individualism discouraged; group think prevails
  6. Rigid rules and regulations
  7. Need for obedience and dependency
  II. Information Control

  1. Use of deception
  a. Deliberately holding back information
  b. Distorting information to make it acceptable
  c. Outright lying
  2. Access to non-cult sources of information minimized or discouraged
  a. Books, articles, newspapers, magazines, TV, radio
  b. Critical information
  c. Former members
  d. Keep members so busy they don’t have time to think
  3. Compartmentalization of information; Outsider vs. Insider doctrines
  a. Information is not freely accessible
  b. Information varies at different levels and missions within pyramid
  c. Leadership decides who "needs to know" what
  4. Spying on other members is encouraged
  a. Pairing up with "buddy" system to monitor and control
  b. Reporting deviant thoughts, feelings, and actions to leadership
  5. Extensive use of cult generated information and propaganda
  a. Newsletters, magazines, journals, audio tapes, videotapes, etc.
  b. Misquotations, statements taken out of context from non-cult sources
  6. Unethical use of confession
  a. Information about "sins" used to abolish identity boundaries
  b. Past "sins" used to manipulate and control; no forgiveness or absolution
  III. Thought Control

  1. Need to internalize the group’s doctrine as "Truth"
  a. Map = Reality
  b. Black and White thinking
  c. Good vs. evil
  d. Us vs. them (inside vs. outside)
  2. Adopt "loaded" language (characterized by "thought-terminating clichés"). Words are the tools
  we use to think with. These "special" words constrict rather than expand understanding. They
  function to reduce complexities of experience into trite, platitudinous "buzz words".
  3. Only "good" and "proper" thoughts are encouraged.
  4. Thought-stopping techniques (to shut down "reality testing" by stopping "negative" thoughts
  and allowing only "good" thoughts); rejection of rational analysis, critical thinking, constructive
  criticism.
  a. Denial, rationalization, justification, wishful thinking
  b. Chanting
  c. Meditating
  d. Praying
  e. Speaking in "tongues"
  f. Singing or humming
  5. No critical questions about leader, doctrine, or policy seen as legitimate
  6. No alternative belief systems viewed as legitimate, good, or useful
  IV. Emotional Control

  1. Manipulate and narrow the range of a person’s feelings.
  2. Make the person feel like if there are ever any problems it is always their fault, never the
  leader’s or the group’s.
  3. Excessive use of guilt
  a. Identity guilt
  1. Who you are (not living up to your potential)
  2. Your family
  3. Your past
  4. Your affiliations
  5. Your thoughts, feelings, actions
  b. Social guilt
  c. Historical guilt
  4. Excessive use of fear
  a. Fear of thinking independently
  b. Fear of the "outside" world
  c. Fear of enemies
  d. Fear of losing one’s "salvation"
  e. Fear of leaving the group or being shunned by group
  f. Fear of disapproval
  5. Extremes of emotional highs and lows.
  6. Ritual and often public confession of "sins".
  7. Phobia indoctrination : programming of irrational fears of ever leaving the group or even
  questioning the leader’s authority. The person under mind control cannot visualize a positive,
  fulfilled future without being in the group.
  a. No happiness or fulfillment "outside"of the group
  b. Terrible consequences will take place if you leave: "hell"; "demon possession"; "incurable
  diseases"; "accidents"; "suicide"; "insanity"; "10,000 reincarnations"; etc.
  c. Shunning of leave takers. Fear of being rejected by friends, peers, and family.
  d. Never a legitimate reason to leave. From the group’s perspective, people who leave are:
  "weak"; "undisciplined"; "unspiritual"; "worldly"; "brainwashed by family, counselors"; seduced by
  money, sex, rock and roll.
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  69

  "AHA! AHA! OUR EYE HAS SEEN IT!"

  by You Know in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the question has always been, primarily: is jehovah really god?

  secondarily, the question has been: are jehovahs witnesses really jehovahs witnesses?

  or, perhaps worded differently: is the watchtower really the voice of christs appointed faithful and discreet slave of prophecy?

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• 

  Shane

  © 2000 by Steven Hassan - published by Freedom of Mind Press, Somerville MA

  Destructive mind control can be understood in terms of four basic components, which form the acronym BITE:

  I. Behavior Control
  II. Information Control
  III. Thought Control
  IV. Emotional Control

  I. Behavior Control

  1. Regulation of individual’s physical reality
  a. Where, how and with whom the member lives and associates with
  b. What clothes, colors, hairstyles the person wears
  c. What food the person eats, drinks, adopts, and rejects
  d. How much sleep the person is able to have
  e. Financial dependence
  f. Little or no time spent on leisure, entertainment, vacations

  2. Major time commitment required for indoctrination sessions and group rituals

  3. Need to ask permission for major decisions

  4. Need to report thoughts, feelings and activities to superiors

  5. Rewards and punishments (behavior modification techniques- positive and negative).

  5. Individualism discouraged; group think prevails

  6. Rigid rules and regulations

  7. Need for obedience and dependency

  II. Information Control

  1. Use of deception
  a. Deliberately holding back information
  b. Distorting information to make it acceptable
  c. Outright lying

  2. Access to non-cult sources of information minimized or discouraged

  a. Books, articles, newspapers, magazines, TV, radio
  b. Critical information
  c. Former members
  d. Keep members so busy they don’t have time to think

  3. Compartmentalization of information; Outsider vs. Insider doctrines

  a. Information is not freely accessible
  b. Information varies at different levels and missions within pyramid
  c. Leadership decides who "needs to know" what

  4. Spying on other members is encouraged

  a. Pairing up with "buddy" system to monitor and control
  b. Reporting deviant thoughts, feelings, and actions to leadership

  5. Extensive use of cult generated information and propaganda

  a. Newsletters, magazines, journals, audio tapes, videotapes, etc.
  b. Misquotations, statements taken out of context from non-cult sources

  6. Unethical use of confession

  a. Information about "sins" used to abolish identity boundaries
  b. Past "sins" used to manipulate and control; no forgiveness or absolution

  III. Thought Control

  1. Need to internalize the group’s doctrine as "Truth"

  a. Map = Reality
  b. Black and White thinking
  c. Good vs. evil
  d. Us vs. them (inside vs. outside)

  2. Adopt "loaded" language (characterized by "thought-terminating clichés"). Words are the tools we use to think with. These "special" words constrict rather than expand understanding. They function to reduce complexities of experience into trite, platitudinous "buzz words".

  3. Only "good" and "proper" thoughts are encouraged.

  4. Thought-stopping techniques (to shut down "reality testing" by stopping "negative" thoughts and allowing only "good" thoughts); rejection of rational analysis, critical thinking, constructive criticism.

  a. Denial, rationalization, justification, wishful thinking
  b. Chanting
  c. Meditating
  d. Praying
  e. Speaking in "tongues"
  f. Singing or humming

  5. No critical questions about leader, doctrine, or policy seen as legitimate

  6. No alternative belief systems viewed as legitimate, good, or useful

  IV. Emotional Control

  1. Manipulate and narrow the range of a person’s feelings.

  2. Make the person feel like if there are ever any problems it is always their fault, never the leader’s or the group’s.

  3. Excessive use of guilt

  a. Identity guilt

  1. Who you are (not living up to your potential)
  2. Your family
  3. Your past
  4. Your affiliations
  5. Your thoughts, feelings, actions

  b. Social guilt
  c. Historical guilt

  4. Excessive use of fear

  a. Fear of thinking independently
  b. Fear of the "outside" world
  c. Fear of enemies
  d. Fear of losing one’s "salvation"
  e. Fear of leaving the group or being shunned by group
  f. Fear of disapproval

  5. Extremes of emotional highs and lows.

  6. Ritual and often public confession of "sins".

  7. Phobia indoctrination : programming of irrational fears of ever leaving the group or even questioning the leader’s authority. The person under mind control cannot visualize a positive, fulfilled future without being in the group.

  a. No happiness or fulfillment "outside"of the group
  b. Terrible consequences will take place if you leave: "hell"; "demon possession"; "incurable diseases"; "accidents"; "suicide"; "insanity"; "10,000 reincarnations"; etc.
  c. Shunning of leave takers. Fear of being rejected by friends, peers, and family.
  d. Never a legitimate reason to leave. From the group’s perspective, people who leave are: "weak"; "undisciplined"; "unspiritual"; "worldly"; "brainwashed by family, counselors"; seduced by money, sex, rock and roll.
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  46

  URGENT , Got meeting tonight(Beards)

  by StifflersErSlayersBrother in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  anyone got any good information as to why dubs dont like beards?

  in 18 years, i have yet to understand why.

  if its brought up tonight by anyone, what should i say?

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  Shane

  Oh God I got to laugh at this one, I sent a legal formatted letter to GB asking why they had such an out look on wearing beards? I asked them why the big frown on it when my Attorney my Surgeon who saved my life wears one, and lest three Judges on US Supreme court wears a beard? So......
  They sent back a letter to me saying its OK to have a well groomed beard, and to go from door to door and be on the ministry school, and to represent the congregation in prayer. I about shit when I read it.
  Now I don't give a dam I look like Abraham Lincoln, and enjoy ever day like its my last have fun people. ~ Shane
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  39

  Did Ray Franz write COC out of anger?

  by Brutus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i asked my gf who is a jw but not an active one if she has ever read coc and she tells me she has and that his book was mostly lies about the organization and that's the reason he left was because he was tempted by a hooker and ended up sleeping with her.

  he told the elders what he did because he was looking for help and he ended up getting df.

  later he found out he ended up contract hiv.

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  Shane

  Trust me Haas, if you marry this lady you will be one miserable son of a female canine.
  It seems to me she has mental issues that you are not addressing its just a gut feeling but I have been around the May pole a few times.
  And latter you will find your self chewing your arm off just to avoid waking her up. ~ Shane
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  25

  What is Gods name anyway?

  by Shane in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was raised a jehovah's witness all my life, though i don''t go any more, not till i fall on my head and not afraid to ask questions does this particular question come up.. what is gods name?.

  people act as though everyone in the world speaks english, what about the third of the worlds population in china could it be that is his real name at this late date?

  why do we assume that it has to be "jehovah" when it could just as easily be how they call it in china, or india, or arabia, or south america anywhere that there is a large population?.

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  Shane

  I was raised a Jehovah's witness all my life, though I don''t go any more, not till I fall on my head and NOT afraid to ask questions does this particular question come up.
  What is Gods name?
  People act as though everyone in the world speaks English, what about the third of the worlds population in China could it be that is his real name at this late date? Why do we assume that it has to be "JEHOVAH" When it could just as easily be how they call it in China, or India, or Arabia, or south America anywhere that there is a large population?
  Its always Bugged me, sorry but it has, correct me if I am wrong but no one knows how to pronounce his name from Hebrew am I right, so why do we call him by all these versions of his name?
  The bible seems to indicate to me anyway that God takes pride in his name, to the point of saying that all those calling on that NAME of God will be saved, so what is his name? I know I know, the Witness's say it don't matter how you pronounce his name, but it just don't jive with me for some reason. A big powerful God will either destroy you or save you, and we don't even know his name other than he is supposed to be the God of the Hebrews, now should not reason dictate that an all wise God would have the know how to enable humans to know his name as he speaks it heaven? He did it earlier apparently.
  I wonder if three is anyone who can say Jesus' name in Hebrew correctly? (I think there is a lot of bull shit concerning this issue to me.) One mans opinion ~ Shane
• 
  69

  "AHA! AHA! OUR EYE HAS SEEN IT!"

  by You Know in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the question has always been, primarily: is jehovah really god?

  secondarily, the question has been: are jehovahs witnesses really jehovahs witnesses?

  or, perhaps worded differently: is the watchtower really the voice of christs appointed faithful and discreet slave of prophecy?

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  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Shane

  Apostate, Witness's use that word like Salem used the word witch.
  One more scare tactic, like some use the word HELL. How pathetic, If you have an open mind then your an Apostate, so what!!!
  All of you here in this web site pat your self's on the back for having the fortitude to use your own mind, and not drink tainted Cool Aid.
  Your fellow human being, ~ Shane