Spiral

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Posts by Spiral

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  28

  How many here believe the WTS really has has 8.5 million followers / 8.5. million members

  by Hotpepper in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i think it's closer to 5 million with all the selling of kingdom hells and branch bethel's all over the world.

  it's even hard to get a hard copy of the lastest craptower or afake mag now in new york city..

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  Spiral

  I think it's all about context. I know of DF'd and inactive ones, that if asked by a census taker, would reply they are JWs. I know of active publishers that actually never go out in service. Do any of these people really believe in everything the bOrg teaches? Probably not. But they would still describe themselves as JWs in certain contexts.

  So, even the numbers that the bOrg collects only really reflect those that would pass certain criteria. Some level of belief, some level of attendance, turning in some hours (accuracy varies). But these people still consider themselves JWs.

  As to whether the organization cares about accuracy, I actually doubt that. They are so far down the honesty rabbit hole they probably just do their own thing. If they try to create the impression that the bOrg are growing (somewhere, not everywhere) then the believers will still give money. If they were to disclose (if true) that the bOrg is shrinking, the generous ones might quit giving. That's just human nature. Humans love numbers and they love numbers that get bigger. Ask any marketing manager or financial planner.

  I don't think it matters. On a true, mental level, I doubt there is anywhere close to 8.5 million. I am also sure the numbers reported by the Mormons and the Catholic Church are inaccurate as well.
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  22

  Middle class elders and pioneering children

  by Steel in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i was looking at my hall the other day some of the upper elders who are retired now have had some pretty good jobs and lives of relative comfort.

  i am not exactly sure what the education levels were but they were white collar.

  most likely started in a world where you didn’t need a lot of education to get a head.

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  Spiral

  Yes.

  I've seen it.
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  9

  My interview on BBC threw JWs in shock

  by Alex Bogdanov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had an interview on bbc one.

  before i write about it and the jws, just a quick reminder.

  since my book was published two years ago, jws avoid me even though i am not disfellowshipped.

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  Spiral

  Congratulations, Alex, that is great. I hope to be able to see your interview sometime. Glad your life in the UK is good.

  As for the JWs, I can imagine some were in shock. Some people never learn, do they?
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  72

  Not invited to congregation “get togethers”. They finally said it

  by solomon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  we don’t get many invitations to congregational social gatherings.

  we don’t attend midweek meetings and miss about 1/3 of sunday meetings.

  we go in service at least once a month.

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  Spiral

  I really think they are trying to keep the faithfully brainwashed away from anyone who doesn't seem totally "in". This is what I've seen in the last year or two.

  But as a "born-in"(almost) I've also observed a bigger pattern over the years. Policy on the matter of underperforming publishers has flip-flopped back and forth, sometimes policy is to invite the "weak" (ugh) ones to everything to encourage them, then next you hear "weak" ones are off the radar. Off with their heads! We don't want them!

  If anyone back in NY has any sense whatsoever, they realize that given it is 45 years past 1975, inevitably most inactive publishers are actually people who've figured out that it's just a scam. They just don't make a clean break because of family. They obviously haven't figured out what to do about it.
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  13

  Another stay in talk

  by road to nowhere in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we got a local talk.

  keep away from outside influences, and marginal witnesses(me?).

  keep up prayer, study, all that.

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  Spiral

  Well, speaking as a "marginal witness" (at best, at least in the eyes of our relatives who live on the other side of the country) it looks like they are really tightening the screws. I wonder if this talk is going to be given all over. After all, many "marginal" ones are actually PIMO or POMO. If the JWs start talking to them, it would be like a disease that is catching fire. Perhaps it already is.

  Meanwhile, this:

  "Road to nowhere: Don't worry about a lack of suitable marriage partners."

  Don't worry? DON'T WORRY? Nice to say coming from a bunch of old married men. I truly do not understand how the rank and file JW (especially 30-40 somethings who've never been married) can listen to this and not bolt for the door. There's obviously a "lack" (ugh) in the bOrg but it's okay for you just to suffer, because the GB has no solution.

  
  

  
  
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  17

  Do You Use “ALEXA”?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i got the amazon echo dot and it’s pretty good.

  do you use it for anything?.

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  Spiral

  I use mine daily, including making video calls, turning on my Mom's (although, most days she can tell it to play her music on her own), and use it for music and bluetooth. She can also read books to my Mom. So, I find mine really handy. As mentioned above, as my phone already spies on me, I don't worry too much that Alexa will find anything else out.
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  65

  Would You Ever Go Back To The Witnesses??

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  every once in a while you hear people say they actually “miss” their old witness friends and or family.

  some would have even stayed in the organization if they became a bit more liberal and open minded.

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  Spiral

  On the rare occasions I've had to go in the last 15 years (family, funeral, stuff like that) I wanted to stab my eye out within ten minutes of walking through that door. An odd physical experience that is, like your brain is screaming but you have to act nice.

  So, no way, never, nope, not happening.
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  16

  Were the JWs ever anywhere near a bona fide religion?

  by punkofnice in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the religion/corporation has changed constantly since the start.

  they appear more whacko than ever.. but, were the jws ever anywhere near a bona fide religion at any time?.

  disclaimer: i think all religions are a scam.

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  Spiral

  Religion: A set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

  Or: The belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or Gods.

  So, by these definitions found online, the JWs are a religion. They believe in a superhuman (notice, not necessarily righteous) controlling power, and they certainly are into maintaining a "moral code governing the conduct of human affairs."

  Speaking for myself, I know that growing up I didn't think "our" religion was exciting. It was missing so much that other religions had: contemplative practices, beautiful churches or synagogues where impressive observances could be seen, wonderful holidays and worship days, schools and summer camps. Culture, art, and rich history could be seen, in my case, from afar.

  Being a JW was like being in a bargain-basement religion, totally on the cheap. I was sad about this.
  
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  34

  Circus Assembly Jaw Dropper

  by Slidin Fast in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the co got on his hind legs for the public talk and repeated twice "tolerance promotes division".

  then backed it up by saying that if one group march for some right, another group will march for the opposite.. so jws are intolerant and proud of it.

  f@@@k me sideways.. may explain that the baptism tally was 0..

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  Spiral

  This is probably underpinned by one of their new(er?) expressions, "listen, obey, and be blessed". [Notice thinking about anything is not a part of this equation.]

  So everyone has to be the same. In that world, everyone would be lock stepped into the same life pattern.

  Easier to control the rank and file that way.

  Having said that, I'd also say that this particular CO isn't the sharpest tool in the JW box. A lot of people listening to this might question that statement, even JWs.
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  34

  Circus Assembly Jaw Dropper

  by Slidin Fast in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the co got on his hind legs for the public talk and repeated twice "tolerance promotes division".

  then backed it up by saying that if one group march for some right, another group will march for the opposite.. so jws are intolerant and proud of it.

  f@@@k me sideways.. may explain that the baptism tally was 0..

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  Spiral

  Wow. I'm guessing that also means say goodbye to love and forgiveness and all that other Christian stuff. Perhaps disfellowshippings in his circuit will also lovingly increase.