Posts by ironsnake656

10

Random and unsafe conditions

by ironsnake656 in

one of the things that helped me in my awakening and fading process from jwland was something that i call "random failures".

let me explain it.

it happened like 4 years ago.

One of the things that helped me in my awakening and fading process from JWland was something that I call "random failures". Let me explain it. It happened like 4 years ago. I was preparing the information for the TMS and I noticed something in the May/June calendar illustration hanged in the wall of my bedroom. The illustration depicted people building houses. The problem is that they are wearing safety helmets Where do they get the helmets? Do they built manufacturing facilities to produce safety helmets and construction tools (hammers, nails, electric saws to cut wood, etc??

Even worse, the purpose of wearing safety helmets is to protect your body against any accident. The accidents occur due to fact of unsafe conditions presented in the environment. Some of such unsafe conditions are presented by random failures. Random failures are defined as "physical failures brought on by excessive stress on the device. Random failures can occur at any time during the device life and are generally well understood by the time a device achieves user-approved status. The occurrence of these failures does not follow a pattern, but instead occur randomly in time. Stress factors are the result of a variety of causes, such as abnormal process conditions, the presence of an adverse microenvironment (e.g., corrosion produced by chemical impurities or metallurgy), or normal device wear and tear. Low frequency atmospheric events (e.g. snow in Houston, Texas, USA) can also be considered random events" (Process Safety Progress, 2006).

So, in the Paradise, will exist or happen accidents caused by random failures? Will Jehovah control EVERY, I mean EVERY random event to not harm any Armageddon survivor (even the event to avoid corrosion produced by natural chemical reactions to not get a rusty nail/hammer and cause a fatal accident)? Will he control the pressure and force exerted in a piece of wood by a person who is working in the roof?

What do you think???

80

Favorite Quotations from Movies

by compound complex in

"the way you walked was thorny, through no fault of your own, but as the rain enters the soil, the river enters the sea, so tears run to a predestined end.

now you will have peace for eternity.

" -- maleva, the wolf man.

ironsnake656

V for Vendetta: "Beneath this mask there is more than flesh, Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bulletproof".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WZ0XSf23rs

31

10 Graphs that show that the Watchtower is in trouble in Mexico

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

mexico is by far the country where the witnesses have had the most success in the entire world.

almost any statistic except the total amount of witnesses shows that mexico is where the witnesses have had the wildest success in the world.proportional to population, the witnesses in mexico are double, or nearly triple, what they are in the us or brazil.but there is "trouble in paradise".

if mexico falls, pretty much the whole watchtower falls.which is why it is so important to have jwfacts translated to spanish.i made an analysis and things are looking bad in mexico... if trends continue, mexico will become just like the 1st-world countries.here is the first graph:maximum publisher % increase:.

ironsnake656

Crazyguy, as sheperdless asked and answered, one of the big reasons why growth in Mexico is declining is membership ageing and few converts, plus limited access to internet and poor reading habits to get more converts as the Org is using the internet as a tool to proselyte. In Mexico, the people who visit JW website is the same JW, not interested ones.

Where is more growth is in other Protestant/Christian churches like Baptists, Pentecostals, Presbyterians, LDS, even growth in Saint Death Church and Islam.

31

10 Graphs that show that the Watchtower is in trouble in Mexico

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

mexico is by far the country where the witnesses have had the most success in the entire world.

almost any statistic except the total amount of witnesses shows that mexico is where the witnesses have had the wildest success in the world.proportional to population, the witnesses in mexico are double, or nearly triple, what they are in the us or brazil.but there is "trouble in paradise".

if mexico falls, pretty much the whole watchtower falls.which is why it is so important to have jwfacts translated to spanish.i made an analysis and things are looking bad in mexico... if trends continue, mexico will become just like the 1st-world countries.here is the first graph:maximum publisher % increase:.

ironsnake656

Interesting information ILoveTTATT2. The graphics represent statistically what is happening in the last years regarding growing in numbers. I think grow of JWs in Mexico had their peak like 10 years ago.

Regarding the comments of the English congregations in Mexico, let me know to you what really happened. The hype of English field in Mexico started in 2006. Although few English congregations existed before that year, some CO sponsored to start meeting groups other than Spanish language, and some suggested to start English groups.

I attended a DA 2007 in Queretaro city, where all English field congregations attended (not all the brothers attended the DA since that city is far from other places, like Tijuana or Cancun), and we were visited by John Barr. Anyways, in that assembly all brothers were encouraged to move in the English field since it had "need of workers". Then a lot of brothers from Spanish congs moved to English congs, the problem was that those who moved were not the best brothers of Spanish congs: undesirable ones, rich, faders, naughty ones, double life, etc. English congs were labeled as debauchees congs by Spanish congs. Also, a lot of problems raised between elders of Spanish congs and English congs, because the way of doing and following the Org procedures (English brothers are more attached to the procedures and more liberal than Spanish ones).

Also, in Juarez there were 4 English congregations by 2010; by today there is just one. In Chihuahua city, there were two English congregations; today there is no English congs. The English field was reduced significantly the past 5 years. A lot of letters from the Mexican branch were read in the English congs to encourage those who is mother language is not English, to move away.

The thing that I see complicated in Mexico, is to help them to know about TTATT, despite the usefulness of internet. Most Mexicans do not like to read or research (it is something cultural), specially things related with religion.

2

Fight of Gods - New video game

by ironsnake656 in

i just found this hilarious video game released in taiwan like street fighter where you choose gods of ancient religions like anubis, atenea, sif, buda, odin, and guess what... jesus christ!!!

hadookens with nails!!!

bad that is not like mortal kombat with fatalities.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=17&v=gzcqkbbcw1q.

ironsnake656

I just found this hilarious video game released in Taiwan like Street Fighter where you choose gods of ancient religions like Anubis, Atenea, Sif, Buda, Odin, and guess what... Jesus Christ!!! Hadookens with nails!!!

Bad that is not like Mortal Kombat with fatalities...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=17&v=gZcQkbbCw1Q

4

Archaeological evidence

by ironsnake656 in

one of the many books that helped me to question about the bible narrative is the one from israel finkelstein, the bible unearthed.

archaeology is one of the fascinating sciences and complicated, since you have to interpret/reinterpret the history based on the artifacts, remains, ruins, relics, paintings, sculptures, etc.

that is found in certain area where a civilization existed.

ironsnake656

One of the many books that helped me to question about the bible narrative is the one from Israel Finkelstein, The Bible Unearthed. Archaeology is one of the fascinating sciences and complicated, since you have to interpret/reinterpret the history based on the artifacts, remains, ruins, relics, paintings, sculptures, etc. that is found in certain area where a civilization existed. In the case of the biblical narrative of Solomon, for example, there is no archaeological evidence of the existence of a golden temple, or architecture that stayed and survived over centuries to realize that a unified and rich kingdom existed as the bible says. Other account that made me doubt, especially when it was studied in the book study, was the account of Daniel. If the account of Daniel was true, it had been kept in Babylonian documents or texts, since Babylonians were known as document keepers. Something could be kept saying that a hand wrote in a wall, that a three men was kept alive inside a fiery furnace, etc. but no, nothing, zero, nada de nada... there is no archaeological evidence of such narratives...

49

Let's talk about Blood again....

by stuckinarut2 in

i know we have all talked about this topic before, but for some new ones on the forum, or to refresh ourselves, i wanted to start this thread.. the society likes to go on about the sacredness of blood, and how it should not be transfused etc.. they liken it to a symbol of life itself.

something that should be respected and therefore not transfused.. but, what is more important: real life, or a symbol of life?.

an illustration came to mind.. if we give a bunch of flowers to a loved one as a symbol of our love for them, are those flowers more important than the love itself?

ironsnake656

I'm agree with wolfman85 about blood was considered sacred in the bible. But I was reading this article of why the obsession of the Israelites of the use of blood:

"Why was such care taken to drain every drop of blood from the sacrificial animals for no other purpose than to dispose of it in various ways on the main altar of the temple. Why this strange, barbaric obsession with blood in such an apparently theologically sophisticated group of people? There were three reasons for the taboos associated with blood and its ritual disposal in ancient Israel.

First, like many people with animist and semi-animist beliefs, the Israelites held that the nephesh, the life of a human being or an animal, lay in its blood. Every living creature had a nephesh. This nephesh was its life-breath, its spirit, that strange life force that pervaded its body and so kept it alive. When a human being or an animal lost its blood, this lifepower would go out from it, and its flesh would die. The Israelite priests described this connection between the nephesh and the blood in four ways:

a. The blood is the life (Deut 12:23);

b. The life of any flesh (any animate creature) is its blood (Lev 17:14b );

c. The life of any flesh is its blood as its life (Lev 17:14a );

d. The life of any flesh is in the blood (Lev 17:11).

Both the Israelites and Canaanites agreed that vitality and blood belonged together in some way. Yet they differed radically in their consequent use of the blood taken from animals. Whereas the Canaanites quite commonly ate meat with blood in it, because they held that the blood in it was spiritually energizing and life-giving, the Israelites refused to eat meat with blood in it. This taboo against the consumption of blood was based on their refusal to assimilate the spirit of the animal and imbibe any life-power from it (Deut 12:23). The Lord, the God of Israel, had in fact forbidden the consumption of blood by his people. They were allowed to eat meat with the blood drained out of it, but the consumption of blood was strictly proscribed at the pain of excommunication by God himself (Lev 17:10; cf. 7:27). Under no circumstances could the Israelites eat meat with blood in it (Gen 9:4; Lev 7:26; 17:12, 14; Deut 12:16, 23-25; 15:23). It was impossible for the Israelites to gain supernatural life-power from animals by the consumption of their blood.

The second reason for exclusive use of blood in the sacrificial ritual was to prevent its misuse in other popular non-Israelite rituals. Some of the Canaanites slaughtered animals and poured out the blood on the graves of their ancestors as food for their spirits. In return they secured protection, vitality and good luck from their ancestors (cf. Ps 16:3, 4). First-born male animals were also sacrificed in such a way that their blood was given to the earth and the underground deities residing in it. In this way the Canaanites gained good crops for themselves and fertility for their animals (cf. Lev 17:5, 6). Blood was even offered up to demons to appease them (Ps 106:34-39; cf. Deut 32:17) and as nourishment to ghosts to conjure them up for the purpose of divination by augury or necromancy (Lev 19:26; cf. Isa 57:5-10; 65:3-7). In each of these cases blood was used ritually to secure something supernatural, such as vitality, protection, blessing, power, or knowledge. All these ritual practices were eliminated by two divine commands. On the one hand, the Lord instructed the Israelites to bring their burnt offerings and peace offerings to the central sanctuary and to offer them to him only there at his altar (Deut 12:20-25). Anybody who offered a sacrifice anywhere else was treated as a murderer and excommunicated from the people of Israel (Lev 17:1-9; cf. Lev 7:27; Deut 12:26, 27). On the other hand, the Lord also decreed that all the blood from the sacrificed animals should be poured out there on his altar (Lev 17:6; Deut 12:27). It could not under any circumstance be used anywhere else and for any other purpose.

The third and most important reason for the taboo on the consumption of blood lay in the Lord‟s mandate for its use in the rite of atonement. The Lord had forbidden any other human use for the blood of animals so that it could be used only by him for the benefit of his people. Leviticus 17:11 has this singular decree: the life (nephesh) of the flesh is in the blood; and I myself have given it to you for making atonement for your lives (nephashoth) upon the altar; for it is the blood that atones by means of the life (nephesh).

Thus the taboo on the consumption of blood resulted form the divine institution of the rite of atonement as part of daily sacrificial ritual at the tabernacle and, later, at the temple. The Hebrew idiom in Leviticus 17:11 is most arresting. In the ritual texts of the Pentateuch the priests are often said to „give‟, or „place‟, the blood on the horns of the altar (eg. Exod 29:12; Lev 8:15; 9:9; 16:8 etc). Elsewhere the Lord uses the same form of the verb nathan in the first person as here to make a formal endowment of some portion from the offerings to the priests as their due and stipend (Lev 6:10; 9:34; Num 18:8, 11, 12, 19, 21, 24, 26). But in Leviticus 17:11 the Lord does not use this idiom to grant the blood of animals to the Israelites as food for them. Instead, he institutes the ritual use of blood as the means by which both they and he made atonement for their lives. He grants them atonement through the blood placed on the altar by them. This word in Leviticus 17:11 founded the rite of atonement as a sacramental enactment. That word did not merely announce what he would accomplish for them in that rite; it actually empowered the rite, so that he worked atonement for his people through their faithful performance of it. That atonement was granted by means of the blood which was placed on the altar. So, by divine decree, the blood of sacrificed animals could no longer be used directly by the Israelites to boost their vitality but was reserved exclusively for the enactment of atonement."

Kleinig, J. (1999). The Blood for Sprinkling Atoning Blood in Leviticus and Hebrews. Lutheran Theological Journal, 33, 3, 124-135.

As you notice, blood in ancient times was used in liturgical rites for purification and atonement, because it was considered the life giver. Today, thanks for the medical advances and knowledge of human body, people can live despite great blood loss, and people can die even if there is no blood loss (poisoning, electrocution, bacteria/viruses, etc.)

38

Question...

by ironsnake656 in

when you were an active member in the jwland, did you expect to receive any kind of help from a brother/sister, but they did not help you?

when i was in the jwland, i expected and was my belief that any brother/sister will help you in time of need, distress or trouble, because we were part of a "lovely organization".

but countless of times when i needed and asked for help, nobody from the org helped me.

ironsnake656

I'm doing better now, LongHairGal. The story does not end here. Because I was really pissed off, I mean, PISSED OFF, I confronted the general manager brother in the congregation when he visited us after the incident happened. I told him that despite we were spiritual brothers, I expected his help since he knew about my situation. He answered that he knew nothing about the matter (which made me angry), and that he will try to seek something for me in the future. This brother was disfellowshipped after a year because he had a secret affair, and his two of his sons disassociated, and was fired from that company...

The point is that they wasted my time and create false expectations about the job, and they were called my "brothers"...

49

Let's talk about Blood again....

by stuckinarut2 in

i know we have all talked about this topic before, but for some new ones on the forum, or to refresh ourselves, i wanted to start this thread.. the society likes to go on about the sacredness of blood, and how it should not be transfused etc.. they liken it to a symbol of life itself.

something that should be respected and therefore not transfused.. but, what is more important: real life, or a symbol of life?.

an illustration came to mind.. if we give a bunch of flowers to a loved one as a symbol of our love for them, are those flowers more important than the love itself?

ironsnake656

All about "Sacredness of Blood" is BS from the Org to justify the doctrine about blood, in order to prevent it from liability and lawsuits. First, it took about 66 years to the Org to set the doctrine (1879-1945). Then, the prohibition of blood among vaccinations. After that, the "personal and conscience" use of fractions of blood or medical procedures. They have to understand that the account of Acts needs to be interpreted according to the culture and knowledge about blood in those times.

I found interesting the note in the article of Matthew Goff "Monstrous Appetites: Giants, Cannibalism, and Insatiable Eating in Enochic Literature": "It is possible that the prohibition against the consumption of blood developed because this act played a role in divination. Divination and the consumption of blood are banned together in Lev 19:26 (cf. 1 Sam 14:31–35). See Milgrom, Leviticus 17–22, 1490–93; Biale, Blood and Belief, 21–23; Wright, The Origin of Evil Spirits, 148. Consult also P.T. Reis, “Eating the Blood: Saul and the Witch of Endor,” JSOT 73 (1997): 3–23."

38

Question...

by ironsnake656 in

when you were an active member in the jwland, did you expect to receive any kind of help from a brother/sister, but they did not help you?

when i was in the jwland, i expected and was my belief that any brother/sister will help you in time of need, distress or trouble, because we were part of a "lovely organization".

but countless of times when i needed and asked for help, nobody from the org helped me.

ironsnake656

Interesting comments and responses. LongHairGal: I'm referring to both moral/financial help, I can also include physical help. This question was raised because I had an experience.

Five years ago, I was experiencing financial hardship and I was unemployed. I received a call from a brother who wanted to gather a team for an industrial company, because he received a call from the general manager. The general manager was a well know brother who was in our congregation before he moved; I knew very well this brother since I invited him sometimes to my house to have meal with him and his family. The brother who called me invited to an interview and to travel to the city to check everything before moving. Everything went fine: interviews, medical checks, apartment rent, cost of living, etc. Then, the brother told me that the hiring process will take a while, so I returned home to prepare myself and my family for moving. The time passed: one week, two weeks, three weeks... and nothing. So I called back the brother, and he told me that something went wrong with the hiring process and I will not be hired. He forwarded me the email from the general manager where explained why I was not hired: I had two lipomas in my harm and medical department was worried about it. I explained them that those were from genetics and benign body fat tissue. But the decision was made: I will not be hired, since I did not satisfy the requirements for the medical department. Anyways... the general manager brother knew about my financial hardship, he knew me for a long time, and despite his position of power and decision, could not he made a concession regarding my "medical" condition? I was disappointed, (actually this experience was one from others which triggered my fading), since I expected a little help from someone who was considered "my brother".

I know a lot of brothers who did not receive any help from brothers who had the power/means of helping.