if god is the creator, who created god or how did he evolve?.
The simple answer is if there is a God who is a creator then he exists out with the boundaries of the physical universe and with that time...we humans cannot grasp the concept of outwith time...the bible says that God is the "King of Eternity" and thus He will live forever...thus put that concept backwards and he has always lived or been in existence...something we cannot grasp because we are limited to the concept of time.
You can't understand a God in terms of human boundaries...
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
I just want to echo these sentiments as they are exactly mine...I too have no agenda...I'm genuinely interested in how a person comes to the conclusion that evolution is guided simply because I do not come to that conclusion but I always try and understand the other side.
I thought KateWild might have been up for explaining how she has arrived at that conclusion but apparently not...very strange then to create the thread if you are not going to discuss it but I'm happy to leave it and her and wish her well.
I'm sure I can get the info I seek from elsewhere.
Sorry Kate I've been out and not had a chance to respond earlier. This is your thread and if you believe you have answered and explained everything to a sufficient level then it would be churlish to continue to make request ofyou for more information.
The only thing I will repeat is that I did not engage with you on this thread with some kind of predetermined atheist agenda. I have no interest in proving you right or wrong. I really am interested in your opinion and thinking process. I certainly have no billy big bollocks desire to assert my opinion above yours.
I will not be phoning you to discuss it, not because I am not genuine, but firstly the discussion was happening here and, secondly, I am a married man trying to fade therefore making surreptitious phone calls to ladies my wife does not know is not high on my agenda of risks to take. You might have phone conversations with others, like cantleave, but that's under very different circumstances for you both.
Please don't mistake any of this for some kind of lack of genuine interest. I've read everything you have shared over the years on this site and know how tough things have been as well as seen how you have powered through so much. I do find you obtuse sometimes but you have my utmost respect for what you have achieved to escape the clutches of the WTS and I am glad we remain online buddies.
All the best - k99
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
Myself and other posters have been trying to get this explanation from you, not as some kind of game, not to try and trick you but simply to try and understand.
Exactly what I have been trying to do..no hidden game, no agenda, not trying to prove anyone wrong or have an argument...I'm simply interested in how a person arrives at that conclusion...sorry if that is boring but nothing else to it.
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
I have explained my conclusion.
No you most certainly have not explained how you arrive at your conclusion.
You're not asking anything new.
Perhaps answering our first questions might then make us ask other follow up questions that are different?
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
But I feel your questions are off topic
?
The topic title is "I conclude evolution is guided"...you state one point of view...others state they come up with a different conclusion based on your topic in the OP...which you agree they can easily come to.
All I ask is what makes you "conclude" that evolution is guided...its ok if you don't want to respond...I was just interested in how you arrived at that conclusion...or arrived as to why it is more probable...no big deal...I can see we won't get answer from you on this so happy to leave it.
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
Evidence can be subjective sometimes when it's not 100 % conclusive. That's where free thinking comes into play.
Right but again I ask WHAT evidence points you to the conclusion that evolution is guided barring your OP?
I'm finding you are being evasive about this...provide references please that relate to your point of view as to why you conclude what you conclude...it just can't be your OP?
I am interested in the building blocks of the conclusion that evolution was guided.
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
It's in my OP and you disagree.
Forget whether I agree or disagree...you conclude that evolution was guided based on just your OP or is there other criteria you feel adds testimony to your opinion?
I'm looking to see how you come to your conclusion...as konceptual99 also asks what is it about this point that makes you arrive at your conclusion when you happily admit others can easily come to a different conclusion...there must be other factors that add up that then make you conclude that evolution was guided.
I am interested in what they are for the simple reason I have yet to find such evidence to make me conclude that evolution was guided and I want to know if there are any.
Honest, genuine questions...I'm not arguing or looking for a war!
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
but if you don't think my conclusion is valid, that's okay. It's only my conclusion so far.
Sorry Kate, all I am interested in is how you come to your conclusion...that evolution was guided...
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
Okay so you conclude that autocatalytic set evolved without guidance. Fair enough. I view this as guidance. The very premise of what catalysts do and their purpose leads me to this conclusion. But your conclusion is just as valid.
But I only conclude that when I add it to other areas in the evidence for evolution...I read and digest as much evidence there is for evolution in the many fields...do the same for creationists (well not really evidence but much like your OP) and then comes to a general, educated conclusion...
What other areas do you feel add testimony to your OP? Because you can't really conclude it was guided based on this one point alone...
your qualifications are way above mine so i'd love to hear more about the specifics of what you have researched and how that supports the existence of a deity.
k99, i am not really convinced that you're interested in my conclusions.
in nature amino acids formed to then form dna.
Good point, this is exactly what Bhom's conclusion is too. I think both perspectives are valid, but neither are absolute yet. In time science will have conclusive evidence, until then we can only draw conclusions from what we have.
Kate xx
Right but couple the conclusion Bhom comes to and add other factors...like:
You can't isolate this one point, which i still don't see how you come to the conclusion you arrive at, and say it means there is a diety WHEN you factor in all other evidences for a god or evolution...because evolution wins hands down every time when you base it on facts...the facts lean heavily towards there was no divine intervention from anything to get to where we are...
