Posts by john.prestor

35

Female JW parking "attendants"

by neat blue dog in

i was shocked recently to see on social media a couple pictures of jw sisters at a convention working as parking "attendants".

i put that title in quotation marks because they still don't get the official attendant badge like the male parking attendants do, only the reflective vest.

has anybody else heard of this .

Female JW parking "attendants"

by neat blue dog in

i was shocked recently to see on social media a couple pictures of jw sisters at a convention working as parking "attendants".

i put that title in quotation marks because they still don't get the official attendant badge like the male parking attendants do, only the reflective vest.

has anybody else heard of this .

In a leaked video uploaded to YouTube by Lloyd Evans ("John Cedars") the organization instructs attendants that they can use women to help individuals in and out of their vehicles, I believe, but that these female helpers can't tell anyone what to do.... I wish I was kidding.

34

Dutch House of Representatives formally requests the government to start an investigation re. JW child abuse

by Anders Andersen in

today the dutch house of representatives unanimously voted to petition the government to start an investigation into jw child abuse issues.. the request from the house of reps. came after jw nl refused to listen to repeated and serious requests from the government to start an independent investigation themselves.. now it's up to the government to either accept the request by the house of reps. and start an investigation, or refuse to do so and explain to the house why.

it appears the minister of justice is not unwilling to start an investigation though.... collection of dutch news items here.

john.prestor

The Australian Royal Commission. Have you read their findings and/or watched their proceedings? The latter can be found on YouTube.

34

Dutch House of Representatives formally requests the government to start an investigation re. JW child abuse

by Anders Andersen in

today the dutch house of representatives unanimously voted to petition the government to start an investigation into jw child abuse issues.. the request from the house of reps. came after jw nl refused to listen to repeated and serious requests from the government to start an independent investigation themselves.. now it's up to the government to either accept the request by the house of reps. and start an investigation, or refuse to do so and explain to the house why.

it appears the minister of justice is not unwilling to start an investigation though.... collection of dutch news items here.

john.prestor

No, Doubter, you evidently don't. Your remark about "imperfect" organizations suggests that you're a Jehovah's Witness who sees your organization as fallible when you want it to be fallible, and infallible when you want it to be infallible; that is, you engage in double-think.

Answer the question: why should the government not investigate an organization that, in other places in the world, on the basis of corporate policy, has turned a blind eye to the abuse of children? Your position is frankly astonishing and the definition of callous. If you yourself were abused by an Elder, you would think differently.

34

Dutch House of Representatives formally requests the government to start an investigation re. JW child abuse

by Anders Andersen in

today the dutch house of representatives unanimously voted to petition the government to start an investigation into jw child abuse issues.. the request from the house of reps. came after jw nl refused to listen to repeated and serious requests from the government to start an independent investigation themselves.. now it's up to the government to either accept the request by the house of reps. and start an investigation, or refuse to do so and explain to the house why.

it appears the minister of justice is not unwilling to start an investigation though.... collection of dutch news items here.

john.prestor

Doubter, why on earth would you be implicitly be opposed to such an investigation? Comparable investigations in other countries have turned up many, many cases of child abuse that went unreported.

53

Fred Franz Former Training in Ancient Greek

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

has anyone been able to verify that fred franz received the minimal training in ancient greek that he claimed gave him the expertise to translate the bible?

you would think that would be fairly easy to verify or disprove in this day and age.

what college did he attend?

john.prestor

I haven't been able to find much information on Fred Franz in any scholarly source.

32

Jehovah's Witnesses: shame and domination

by john.prestor in

i want to suggest something that i've been ruminating on for a while now.

that involves the possibility that when jehovah's witnesses look for "sheep-like ones" what they're actually looking for is this: those who will allow themselves to be dominated (get rid of things that god "hates," accept the movement's beliefs without protest, not check into the movement's history) and those who are willing to be shamed (letting jehovah's witnesses into their homes when doing so is looked down upon in secular society, talking with them on the street when everyone else avoids them).. i say this because from what i observed at the kingdom halls i attended in the course of gathering data for my research i saw:.

-frequent shaming: jehovah's witnesses must do more to be acceptable to god, they are "good for nothing slaves," they are spared through armageddon by jehovah's "undeserved kindness," etc.

john.prestor

8Exactly. The likeliness of some kind of grassroots movement forming is extremely slim because anyone who might try to engineer such a thing is weeded out before even joining. I know of only one attempt at this led by James Penton, which was immediately crushed with his disfellowshipping; and to my knowledge he barely gained a following. Maybe somebody else can add to my knowledge on this, I think it happened in the 80s.

So change has to come from the top. But because of bureaucracy and discipline, only the Governing Body can enact change, but only with a majority vote, so change has to be incremental. We all know what happened to Ray Franz for even entertaining radically unorthodox beliefs. Who on the Governing Body is going to risk their enormous prestige and leisurely lifestyle to give women better treatment, for instance, when even suggesting the idea because of how radical it is could get them demoted or even disfellowshipped?

32

Jehovah's Witnesses: shame and domination

by john.prestor in

i want to suggest something that i've been ruminating on for a while now.

that involves the possibility that when jehovah's witnesses look for "sheep-like ones" what they're actually looking for is this: those who will allow themselves to be dominated (get rid of things that god "hates," accept the movement's beliefs without protest, not check into the movement's history) and those who are willing to be shamed (letting jehovah's witnesses into their homes when doing so is looked down upon in secular society, talking with them on the street when everyone else avoids them).. i say this because from what i observed at the kingdom halls i attended in the course of gathering data for my research i saw:.

-frequent shaming: jehovah's witnesses must do more to be acceptable to god, they are "good for nothing slaves," they are spared through armageddon by jehovah's "undeserved kindness," etc.

john.prestor

Of course. By that I mean that a Bible study vets candidates by ensuring:

They ask you to view the Governing Body as the legitimate spiritual authority.

They ask women to accept men as their legitimate superiors.

In other words, they only permit individuals to join who present no threat to their existing hierarchy and hierarchs.

32

Jehovah's Witnesses: shame and domination

by john.prestor in

i want to suggest something that i've been ruminating on for a while now.

that involves the possibility that when jehovah's witnesses look for "sheep-like ones" what they're actually looking for is this: those who will allow themselves to be dominated (get rid of things that god "hates," accept the movement's beliefs without protest, not check into the movement's history) and those who are willing to be shamed (letting jehovah's witnesses into their homes when doing so is looked down upon in secular society, talking with them on the street when everyone else avoids them).. i say this because from what i observed at the kingdom halls i attended in the course of gathering data for my research i saw:.

-frequent shaming: jehovah's witnesses must do more to be acceptable to god, they are "good for nothing slaves," they are spared through armageddon by jehovah's "undeserved kindness," etc.

john.prestor

Thanks for supporting me guys. Seriously.

The paper I'm working on now explains that the Jehovahs Witness organization changes so slowly because of bureaucracy, discipline/surveillance, and legitimacy. I'm happy to pass on a draft to anyone who's interested, PM me. Same with the book manuscript.

32

Jehovah's Witnesses: shame and domination

by john.prestor in

i want to suggest something that i've been ruminating on for a while now.

that involves the possibility that when jehovah's witnesses look for "sheep-like ones" what they're actually looking for is this: those who will allow themselves to be dominated (get rid of things that god "hates," accept the movement's beliefs without protest, not check into the movement's history) and those who are willing to be shamed (letting jehovah's witnesses into their homes when doing so is looked down upon in secular society, talking with them on the street when everyone else avoids them).. i say this because from what i observed at the kingdom halls i attended in the course of gathering data for my research i saw:.

-frequent shaming: jehovah's witnesses must do more to be acceptable to god, they are "good for nothing slaves," they are spared through armageddon by jehovah's "undeserved kindness," etc.

john.prestor

Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho: Thank you for your kind words. Thats also a fascinating exchange of emails, and I appreciate you posting those. That certainly reinforce my conclusions at the Bible study is partially about establishing domination and quite frankly comes across as insulting and condescending on the study's part.

Another thought I had is that a Bible study is also about accepting the non-elite role eventually during Watchtower Studies. Your study reads the question, you answer. That's exactly what happens at the Kingdom Hall. You don't like that method, you find it pedantic or tiresome, as I did, you're not fit for the Watchtower Study, a major part of the service.

Whatever I get published as an article I I won't be able to post here, and I'll be honest, it will be expensive to gain access to it online. When you get something published in an academic journal you have to sign over the copyright However, I'm also preparing a book manuscript and if I get that published (that's a longer-term goal and may take a number of years) I may receive free copies of the book. I'll hold some kind of raffle on here and send them out!