Posts by john.prestor

15

'Spiritual food' and the global south

by john.prestor in

i'm watching john cedars rebuttal of the annual meeting, and right at the start stephen lett starts going on and on about spiritual food, how nutritious it is, how filling it is, it comes across as weird but it doesn't help admittedly that the guy looks like bozo the clown forgot his act.

but the thought just came to me as i'm eating dinner.. not everybody gets dinner.

not everybody gets three meals a day.

john.prestor

Xanthippe, couldn't agree more, hard work only gets you anywhere if you're in the right context... People work their asses off on plantations, in factories and fast food restaurants and fhe homes of the rich where they work as servants, and still live in abject or relative poverty. And coming from men who sit around a state park all day, talking about quote-unquote spiritual realities (questions which boil down to how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, I mean how does Gog and Magog factor into any practical everyday reality lived by any Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide) makes that kind of pull yourself up by your bootstraps line sound all the more hollow and feeble.

It's not like the Governing Body doesn't work at all: they meet with the entire body and whatever committees they sit on, they edit or approve documents, they visit and audit branches, they give speeches, but in doing all of that they enjoy a pretty cushy lifestyle with frequent visible and invisible perks, international travel, good liquor, green handshakes, that kind of thing. At times I get the sense that this work really just gives them an opportunity to see the world and enjoy it in moderate style.

35

Should I do this?

by CivilServant79 in

hi there this is my first post as i’m not sure what to do.

my family (both sides) are well known in our circuit and very dedicated to the truth.

but we’re relatively normal people and i love them all so much.

john.prestor

I get it, he's your uncle and you want to trust the guy. And I'm not saying you shouldn't trust him. But if he's an elder and the elders want to meet up he's acting on their behalf unless you know otherwise. I wouldn't do it, but I get why you might.

If you choose to I would do what some other posters suggested: don't be direct with your criticisms, come across as weak, confused, that kind of thing, or even just play the I'm busy I'm depressed card. Do you know about the 'loyalty question'? One of the other posters mentioned it. If he asks you, Do you believe that Jehovah is using the faithful slave to lead this organization, or something like that, he's giving you enough rope to hang yourself by seeing if you'll out yourself as an apostate. Don't answer honestly.

The other thing to keep in mind is that with the two witness rule I think if you tell your uncle you don't believe in God, and then you tell somebody else that and both come forward a Judicial committee has the two witnesses they need to disfellowship you. Can any posters confirm that?

42

Ignorance of Watchtower doctrine among young JW's

by nicolaou in

i've been having a conversation with a young jw on twitter and have, once again, come up against beliefs that do not match up with official watchtower doctrine.

if you like you can read the full thread here (you'll need to click on some comments to open it all up).. anyway the upshot is that this jw, and many like her, believe that only truly wicked people will be killed at armageddon - not innocent babies and children or anyone who "didn't know better" perhaps because they didn't get a witness.

it's as though they cannot accept the obvious injustice of jehovah's morality.. this jw teenager believes that all these non-jw's who survive armageddon will get their chance to prove their loyalty during the 1000 year reign of christ - again, not a watchtower teaching.. i don't really have a question to ask, this is just an observation.

john.prestor

Just keep in mind that this is only one person so it's not clear if what they said comes back to their age or something else entirely. I think most young Witnesses who lose interest just leave, they lose two-thirds of kids based on the most recent Pew survey, so I'm guessing going off that the ones that remain are actually pretty zealous.

Could younger people care less about doctrine? Definitely. Could this person just lie because they know 'You'll all die at Armageddon sounds pretty fucked up? Definitely

8

Therapist can help

by Leopold theseconed in

hey everyone my nice new friends.

i had my first visit with a therapist today.

i was totally open with everything.

john.prestor

I see a therapist too, it really helps to sit down with somebody once a week and just talk about what I'm going through or what I've gone through. I'm glad you took that step, a lot of people won't, they think there's something shameful about it or that they don't need the therapist to begin with. You're strong. Stay strong.

13

Could/should JW Lawyer be punished for deceiving the Judge?

by The Fall Guy in

in an attempt to disparage a faded jw and to obtain their personal details, he deceptively partially quoted a statement from the jw.borg web site to the new york judge when he wrote, .

"disfellowshipping does not cause family relationships to be permanently lost: "the religious ties he had with his family change, but blood ties remain.

the marriage relationship and normal family affections and dealings continue.

john.prestor

Yes, if the man knows he's lying and lies anyway about something like that he should be punished. And if this man is a Jehovah's Witness, particularly an older, senior member (I'm sure they don't let Joe Publisher represent them in court), he knows he's lying.

15

'Spiritual food' and the global south

by john.prestor in

i'm watching john cedars rebuttal of the annual meeting, and right at the start stephen lett starts going on and on about spiritual food, how nutritious it is, how filling it is, it comes across as weird but it doesn't help admittedly that the guy looks like bozo the clown forgot his act.

but the thought just came to me as i'm eating dinner.. not everybody gets dinner.

not everybody gets three meals a day.

john.prestor

A necktie? Damn how generous, what's next, a free hug?

Yeah, all of that comes across as cold and callous, what, the first thing you tell the refugees is you won't feed them, what a dick move in and of itself. I'm sure they love needing to pass some kind of sincerity test before you'll talk to them.

15

'Spiritual food' and the global south

by john.prestor in

i'm watching john cedars rebuttal of the annual meeting, and right at the start stephen lett starts going on and on about spiritual food, how nutritious it is, how filling it is, it comes across as weird but it doesn't help admittedly that the guy looks like bozo the clown forgot his act.

but the thought just came to me as i'm eating dinner.. not everybody gets dinner.

not everybody gets three meals a day.

john.prestor

I'm watching John Cedars rebuttal of the Annual Meeting, and right at the start Stephen Lett starts going on and on about spiritual food, how nutritious it is, how filling it is, it comes across as weird but it doesn't help admittedly that the guy looks like Bozo the Clown forgot his act. But the thought just came to me as I'm eating dinner.

Not everybody gets dinner. Not everybody gets three meals a day. Not everybody can buy good food. Not everybody can buy food, whether any food or enough food. And while I get that he's making these remarks to people in Warwick I think, or is it New York City... wherever it is the people the organization invites aren't struggling to survive in a refugee camp... but these videos go up on www.jw.org, and people watch them internationally. A lot of these people will watch it from the global South, places where Jehovah's Witnesses continue to grow, the Caribbean, southeast Asia, Latin America, places like that where people struggle to buy enough food to stay alive because they make so little everyday. Many don't even have clean drinking water, and they often live in shacks or shanty towns.

It's in really poor taste to go on and on about how delicious your magazine is when some of the people listening to your speech won't even eat that night.

11

Yearbook 2014 NWT is The Finest Translation of the Bible Available to Mankind. 😇

by Fabian in

the is on page 4 of the 2014 yearbook.. a letter from the governing body.

how delighted we are to write you at the beginning of this momentous year!

by late 2014, a whole century will have passed since our beloved king jesus christ began ruling in the midst of his enemies.—ps.

john.prestor

I don't have any issue calling it a translation, it's fine for the most part if a little wooden and kind of awkward. It's just their change things here and there to fit their own doctrines which turns me off to it, Jesus saying This means my body kind of thing when the Greek says This is my body, because that sounds too Catholic. It's dishonest. Worst thing in the world? Not even close. Problematic? Yeah, a little.

19

Electronic Frontier Foundation v Watch Tower Society

by Corney in

[disclaimer: the headline is slightly misleading since the eff itself doesn't participate in the case, so read more below].

it's not a secret that during the last two years watchtower obtained nearly 40 dmca subpoenas requiring google, facebook, instagram, twitter, soundcloud, scribd, reddit and other isps to provide personal information of users that allegedly infringed the society's copyright.. since subpoena proceeding is ex parte, almost all the requests were granted.. but one of the affected users contacted, on advice of youtube's legal team, the electronic frontier foundation (eff), and the foundation found a law firm ready to represent him pro bono, namely garvey schubert barer:.

youtube's legal department emailed the user on or about july 10, 2018, five days before the subpoena's return date, stating that it would comply with the subpoena unless it received a file-stamped motion to quash "or other type of formal objection before july 20, 2018.

john.prestor

Olig, did you just open a can of worms. Be ready to laugh and let your jaw drop repeatedly.

51

Did Jesus exist? Probably not

by The 12 Apostates in

jw
friends

threads about this have been made before, but none have been made for a few years.

i was very much on the fence with this one, i never really cared.

but i became curious recently, having had a few interactions with street preachers.

john.prestor

We don't actually know any of that. We know little about the oral tradition of early Christians because the only records we wrote at that time containing such information that the authors claim they received from specific people (two elders named Johm and Aristo/Aristion) both mysteriously vanished, that being the 2nd century 'Exposition on the Sayings of the Lord' by Papias of Hierapolis and Hegesippius' 'History.' Fascinating ain't it? We know Matthew and Luke based their gospels on earlier written sources, that being Mark and something else (Q probably) but we don't know that Mark did, he might have made it all up for all we know. Did he? I doubt it. A story about a guy who gets himself killed when he plots to take down the Romans doesn't really sound that crazy. Happened all the time back then. The fact that we know about some of the earlier or later false Messiahs from Josephus, while a Christian obviously and all but nakedly interpolated the 'Testimonium Flavious,' only shows how little impact Jesus really had when he came charging into Capernaum that long ago afternoon.