Posts by jp1692

12

How did you overcome feelings of lost time in the Org?

by Skepsis in

jw
friends

i'm a very positive person who always try to focus on the good side of things.. however, my fading is becoming increasingly painful and i'm starting being shunned by some i thought were friends.

i'm missing some meetings so the rumour is spreading to neighbouring congregations where i'm known that i'm not as spiritual as i used to be.

elders want to have a shepherding meeting with me.

jp1692

@Wake Me, you're not supposed to see any of that. ... LOL!

12

How did you overcome feelings of lost time in the Org?

by Skepsis in

jw
friends

i'm a very positive person who always try to focus on the good side of things.. however, my fading is becoming increasingly painful and i'm starting being shunned by some i thought were friends.

i'm missing some meetings so the rumour is spreading to neighbouring congregations where i'm known that i'm not as spiritual as i used to be.

elders want to have a shepherding meeting with me.

jp1692

@Wake Me Up: I was caught red-handed for thinking for myself.

This is THE most serious crime a cult-member can commit. Far worse than anything else.

@Skepsis: the rumour is spreading ... that I'm not as spiritual as I used to be

Good. That means you're no longer a mindless drone. See my response to WMU for clarification.

@ Skepsis: I'm moving to another country soon and the [elders] see it as a materialistic goal.

What the elders think is irrelevant. It's your life. The elders need to mind their own fucking business. Of course I wouldn't advocate telling them that in those exact words, but only because it could unnecessarily complicate things. Although ...

9

Deborah Layton - Jonestown Survivor

by Tallon in

saw this on the exjw reddit forum - very thought provoking.. "when your own thoughts are forbidden, when your questions are not allowed and our doubts are punished, when contacts with friendships outside of the organisation are censored, we are being abused, for the ends never justify the means.. when our heart aches knowing we have made friendships and secret attachments that will be forever forbidden if we leave, we are in danger.. when we consider staying in a group because we cannot bear the loss, disappointment and sorrow our leaving will cause for ourselves and those we have come to love, we are in a cult .... when family and friends are used as a weapon in order to force us to stay in an organisation, something has gone terribly wrong".. deborah layton.

seductive poison: a jonestown survivor's story of life and death in the people's temple.. .

jp1692

Who Joins a Cult?

“Nobody joins a cult. Nobody intentionally joins a group or organization thinking they’ll be harmed or injured; nobody imagined they’d give their lives for the People’s Temple. We join all kinds of groups all the time – self-help, political – but some become malignant. The people that join [such groups] tend to be idealistic and kind; they’re people you’d want as a friend. They get drawn in and trapped.” - Deborah Layton

36

There is no Holy Spirit.

by hoser in

there is no holy spirit.

i lead a double life.

i post on apostate web sites, swear like a sailor, covertly subvert the watchtower religion and do many other things i'd rather not mention.

jp1692

Hoser: Me staying in is just good business ATM. I keep contacts on both sides of the fence so to speak. Contacts mean contracts

Sounds like the proverbial deal with the devil!

36

There is no Holy Spirit.

by hoser in

there is no holy spirit.

i lead a double life.

i post on apostate web sites, swear like a sailor, covertly subvert the watchtower religion and do many other things i'd rather not mention.

jp1692

Well, Hoser. It sounds like you're making good use of what you yourself call "a double-life."

I'm just suggesting that there is actually something better. That, at least, is how it turned out for me. I also used to rationalize and justify to myself why I would "stay in good standing." My reasons were really, really good ... to me, at the time.

Sorry if that sounds self-righteous. That's the last thing I would want to be. I'm just sharing my experience.

Keep us posted!

36

There is no Holy Spirit.

by hoser in

there is no holy spirit.

i lead a double life.

i post on apostate web sites, swear like a sailor, covertly subvert the watchtower religion and do many other things i'd rather not mention.

jp1692

It's true Hoser, there is no Holy Spirit--at least not anything like what we were taught by the JW religion.

I would like to suggest that you are squandering this knowledge living a "double life" and pretending to believe things which you obviously do not.

How about trying an authentic life?

By the way, living authentically does not require giving up swearing or divulging any other of your secret pleasures! ... LOL

34

Physically In, Mentally Out

by James Jack in

7 years ago i was this "ultra spiritual elder".

you name it, i was visible all over the region.

i was the coordinator, on the convention committee, rbc, had a talk at every convention and assembly, regular pioneer, etc.

jp1692

JJ: I read whole the post of "Wake me up" ... I'm planning my exit strategy.

Good to know. I'm glad you appreciated my comments there. What is great about a forum like this is that you are allowed to consider a wide range of different viewpoints. Take them all in, noting in particular the elements which we all have in common. Observe what resonates with you.

You are in a stage of leaving which I call the "What the heck do I still believe?" stage. You've discovered things about your religion which you can no longer believe. Once you start tugging on the loose threads the whole tapestry begins to fall apart. It is a confusing and disorienting place to be. Where before you thought you "had all the answers," now you're not even sure if you know the right questions to be asking.

Also, as with any high-control religion, things are very black and white with little or no tolerance for ambiguity and shades of grey. But in the real world, things are rarely--if ever--so clear cut. It takes time to learn how to deal with uncertainty and to accept that things are not only NOT as we want them to be, but they will never be, at least not completely. But there are some things in life we can control. It is up to us to learn to recognize them and to then have the courage to act and act decisively knowing that not all of our decisions will be the right ones or even good one. But that's okay.

We need to reclaim the control that we handed over to the WTBTS and take responsibility for our own life and our own decisions.

As I have discovered, there is a big difference between religion and spirituality. One is easy as it spoon-feeds you answers (someone else's answers, of course). The other is hard because you have to find those answers for yourself.

I look forward to reading more about your fade ....

BTW, I'm glad to hear that you and your son are all good. He must be a remarkable young man to have forgiven you for your mistreatment of him. Learn from him.

34

Physically In, Mentally Out

by James Jack in

7 years ago i was this "ultra spiritual elder".

you name it, i was visible all over the region.

i was the coordinator, on the convention committee, rbc, had a talk at every convention and assembly, regular pioneer, etc.

jp1692

Welcome James Jack.

First thing you need to do is apologize to your son. Next, and this will be hard, accept the now obvious fact the Jehovah's Witnesses are not the "one true religion."

There is in fact no such thing.

Next, go read Wake Me Up's introduction thread:

I'm new

Read all of it!

11

Hotel California

by Normalfulla in

growing up was ok being a jw or so i thought, i guess u accept life as it comes when yr a kid , anyhow i played guitar and my elder dad (who is currently df) would forbid me to learn hotel california or even if it came on the radio he would run and quickly turn it off , .

he explained he had heard a tape recording at work that explained that this song along with stairway to heaven and others had back masking on it and when played backwards would say stuff like "satan has his own congregation " or other stuff like that , now this was not a jw sanctioned audio talk just some other christian production .. none of dad's other peers felt the same and growing up it illustrated to me dad's propensity to be influenced and convinced about something seemingly innocuous to others.. fast forward to a year or so ago and i showed him a section from the eagles documentary where don henley talks about the meaning of hotel california and how much trouble christian evangelists gave the song due to their own interpretation etc , so completely refuted the claims my father had told me were fact as a kid ,from the horses mouth so to speak .

his answer was ,"well of course he'd say that he wants to save face ,he wouldn't admit the truth !".

jp1692

Cult members are, by definition, delusional and paranoid. Indoctrinated mental illnesses are no different than the more organic garden variety, except perhaps that once identified they can be more directly dealt with.

11

Do we attack the Topic or the Person?

by stuckinarut2 in

i was just thinking that most witnesses can not approach a controversial topic without turning it into an attack of the person who raises that topic.. as we all awaken to ttatt (the truth about the truth), they simply can't discuss the actual facts or issues we discover without turning it into an attack of us as "apostates" with all the negative connotations that word entails.... how truly narrow minded and sad!

.

they would rather attack the person than the topic..

jp1692

This a classic example of the ad hominem fallacy.

And of course in JW-land anyone that disagrees is labeled an "apostate" so the argument is automatically--and conveniently--over without any critical thinking required. This is Cult 101.