Posts by Spoletta

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

If you are a democrat or liberal could you ever honestly criticize Obama or Hillary? No. because then you would be here with me, being called alt right and other names simply for being critical of the party

I am more than happy to criticize Obama and Hillary when it's warranted. However, I will not sit quietly by when all the good they have done is totally ignored by the right, and they are smeared with totally, easily debunked lies.

The conservatives have been rehashing the same old tired talking points for years. We all know about Benghazi, the Emails, The Clinton Foundation, the speeches to big money, etc, etc. etc. All they are left with is a screwy claim of surveillance, bolstered by a laughable secret White House rendezvous reminiscent of a Don Knotts' film. Also screaming over Susan Rice requesting information that she is legally entitled to.

The White House considers finding out who leaked the information about Russia more important than investigating possible treason against our country. To me, this is akin to the DEA putting all their resources into finding out who leaked information about the Columbian drug cartel, rather than acting upon that information. Do any of you remember Deep Throat in the Watergate investigation? Should we have ignored the information he provided?

My definition of being liberal is desiring the most good for the most people, even if I personally don't benefit.

31

Why more highly educated people are less into conspiracy theories

by Mickey mouse in

jw
friends

i've seen discussions here about how jehovah's witnesses seem to be prone to believing conspiracy theories... https://digest.bps.org.uk/2017/04/05/why-more-highly-educated-people-are-less-into-conspiracy-theories/.

this last paragraph seems particularly relevant:.

importantly, van prooijen said his findings help make sense of why education can contribute to “a less paranoid society” even when conspiracy theories are not explicitly challenged.

Spoletta

There is no reasoning with someone who embraces a conspiracy theory, because every single piece of evidence is written off as part of the conspiracy.

Exactly! Prime examples of this are the Roswell incident and 9/11. I've seen every aspect of those conspiracy theories debunked by respected authorities, yet some expert with crazy hair and pseudo credentials is believed because he's not a member of the Secret Hidden High Moosenuts League that secretly rules the world through their invisible evil machinations. And how do we know this? They're so cleverly hidden that no trace of their existence can be found except in the writings of Philo Beeswax, which were read by Rimaldi Compoti before they were destroyed in the Hindenburg disaster. Luckily, Compoti whispered them to 9 year old Felix Cobby before he succumbed to his burns. His body disappeared and his name was erased from the passenger list of the ill-fated blimp. Felix thereafter devoted his life to uncovering the unholy alliance between the Moosenuts and the Empire of the Knights of Wingnuts.

I only know this because Compoti came to me in a dream after too many Tacos and Jose Cuervos.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

you're not honestly saying the Trump administration would do away with pro gay rights if it could?

Seriously? I believe Mike Pence, Jeffrey Sessions, and Tom Cotton (of gay therapy conversion fame) would do just that if it was in their power.

These people meet together, where it's a terminal circle-jerk of agreement at often irrelevant issues and outrage at right-wing views or 'the patriarchy'.

Perhaps it depends on what you consider irrelevant issues. I personally consider tax cuts for the rich and protecting the rights of all our citizens to be relevant. And since you brought up patriarchy, you only need look at the composition of Trump's Cabinet to see his commitment to equality for Women.

Take pro-gun republicans.They want their right for gun ownership maintained. They also accept that other people don't like guns, so they'd say that these people who don't like guns shouldn't buy guns - liberal attitude.
Different to anti-gun people, who'd perhaps like to ban the right of other people to own guns - illiberal attitude.

Most people that I know, both conservative and liberal, have no problem with gun ownership. I think hunting and target shooting are legitimate reasons to own guns. I just don't see the point in owning guns that can kill as many people as possible in the least amount of time. Most gun owners are responsible people who take gun ownership seriously. I see no harm to these people by allowing access only to guns that are actually useful, not simply to satisfy some macho urge.

You might say, but what about criminals? Won't they still get these more dangerous weapons? Yes, but when was the last time you saw a robber kill dozens of people in commission of a crime. I'm not worried that a robber will walk into a school or bank or movie theater and indiscriminately shoot as many people as possible.

But wouldn't we be safer if everyone had guns to protect themselves? In a few cases,yes. But I wouldn't want to be in a bar when Billy Bob and Jimmy Ray, and all their friends get pissed off after a few too many drinks. That's all I'm saying.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

So, as soon as you're disappointed, you turn your back on an entire party.

If, as you say, you are basically liberal, I'd like to hear all about what it is that you find in Trump and the Republicans that causes you to want to give them a chance.

So far, I see them rolling back any legislation that affects the ability of large corporations to make more money under the guise of creating new jobs.

They're gutting the EPA, denying global warming, weakening laws that protect our health, while turning healthcare into an expanded access program that has lower premiums but covers very little,Internet providers will be able to share our information with anyone whether we want it or not, the very wealthy will get to keep more of their wealth, Cabinet members will manipulate legislation in such a way as to benefit them and their associates, The President is jetting off to Mar a lago regularly at 3 million dollars a pop to conduct business on the golf course, we can't believe anything he says because he gets his information from cable TV, he's appointing people with no experience to high level positions, It's becoming more and more evident that the coal mining jobs will most likely not come back, he's turning his back on the rest of the world with his slogan of MAGA,and expanding what is already the most powerful military in the world at tremendous cost, while cutting programs that help the needy, and getting rid of the NEA and the National Broadcasting Corporation. I could fill pages.

So far, I don't see anything here that would make liberals stand up and cheer.

This is an improvement over the Democrats?

You say you are pro-choice, pro gay rights, and all for legalization of cannabis, things that the Republicans will get rid of if they can. Tell me which of your liberal beliefs you share with the current administration?

Otherwise, you are a type of liberal I've never encountered before. What shall I call it?

7

What every modern civilized western society needs: "9yo girls 'physically & spiritually' ready to marry" – Malaysian MP

by kpop in

i'm at a loss for words man.

will there be a "woman's march" over this?

will radical 3rd wave feminists come out and demand his resignation?.

Spoletta

Okay, it's even more terrible than before. Sorry I didn't condemn it more strongly. Now can we move on to the next atrocity?

7

What every modern civilized western society needs: "9yo girls 'physically & spiritually' ready to marry" – Malaysian MP

by kpop in

i'm at a loss for words man.

will there be a "woman's march" over this?

will radical 3rd wave feminists come out and demand his resignation?.

Spoletta

Yes, we all know that there are very bad things done under the Sharia laws of Islam. No one on this forum would disagree that this practice is terrible. Can't wait for your next OP to enlighten us further.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

Let them grill here and let's find out the truth, sorry her saying "I dindu nuthin" on MSNBC doesn't satisfy me

The crux of the matter is that you wouldn't believe her if she said it anywhere. If you don't believe anything on the MSM that disagrees with your "anything Democratic is bad" viewpoint, that only leaves you with the alt-right news media. Or you have to cherry pick from more reputable sources, ignoring overwhelming evidence in favor of a few isolated articles. Sad.

I've seen you present very well thought out and logical viewpoints on many other topics in this forum, inclining me to give you a little bit of a break. This, however, verges on blind obsession with finding fault with anyone who isn't like you or believes what you believe.

Trust me, at this point I couldn't care less what you think of me or my viewpoint. I've realized that the majority of fair, inquisitive, open minded people tend to come to the conclusions that I do. And I think you'll find that we're in the majority in this country.

For all their faults, the Democratic party is responsible for all the programs that have made life better for those of little means or opportunity. Some people need help, and I wouldn't begrudge them that help.

I've had times in my life that I didn't have help when I needed it. My response is to help others so that they can avoid that experience. Others might say that since they didn't have help, no one else should either. I find that rather sad.

I've seen enough of avoiding the world because bad things might happen to last me the rest of my life.

My safe place is among people that strive to make everyone's life better, with the knowledge that there are bad people in any group, and isolating myself from any possibility of danger or tragedy makes my life less rich and interesting.

I don't live in a fantasy world of unicorns and rainbows, I live in a real world where judging entire groups by the acts of individuals is not an option.

You can respond with as many charts, graphs, and snide photo comments as you like. I really don't care. I don't need your approval to validate my beliefs.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

Once again, a non answer to any of my points, just a repeat of worn out talking points. Very balanced.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

There was discussion of HOW she could have broken the law, but I don't expect you to not know the difference based on past discussions.

If you can call outright character assassination using flimsy evidence and totally slanted opinions a discussion, then I suppose this a discussion.

All I see is an attempt to regurgitate the talking points of the far right, while sneering at any rational response.

Just because you say that you are merely asking this to be looked into is ridiculous. this has been looked into and been debunked by people who are far more qualified to ascertain the truth of the matter than you and your cohorts.

In essence, you are an example of the very thing the Russians tried to achieve by by their hacking and release of information, while hiring trolls to flood social media with false news and lies aimed at very select portions of our populace.

Please don't insult my intelligence by pretending posts like this are anything but excuses to disseminate your particular brand of venomous slander and innuendo.

You pretend to seek the truth, but dismiss out of hand any argument that doesn't agree with your viewpoint, even those that rightfully point out the flaws in your arguments with reason and logic.

Occasionally criticizing Trump doesn't make you somehow fair and balanced when 99% of your criticism is aimed at the left.

This whole attempt to deflect from the real story of the Russian involvement in our elections is becoming ludicrous. The leaks are disturbing, but concentrating on them to the exclusion of the more important issue at hand is indicative of an attempt to hide something. That the majority of the Republicans go along with this charade is a disgrace, and will not benefit them in the long run.

So go ahead with your exciting revelations, but I think you'll find that most people see what they are, a return to a mindset and time that I had hoped was disappearing from this country. We still have a long way to go.

86

Susan Rice Sought Names of Trump Associates in Intel?

by freemindfade in

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-04-03/top-obama-adviser-sought-names-of-trump-associates-in-intel.

what can we make of this?

rice is on record being a racist and lying about benghazi, now this?

Spoletta

As usual, Occam's razor fails again when conspiracy theorists put their heads together. I see no proof presented to confirm that Rice's requests were political, aside from her being associated with Obama. She had every right to request the unmasking of individuals if it was pertinent to the understanding of the conversations being monitored. In some cases, unmasking is necessary to let an individual know if they are being discussed by other parties with ill intent. In such cases, it would be gross negligence if the third party were not informed, and then came to harm.

As I recall, the Slate article even brought out the fact that it most likely wasn't illegal for her to request that information. Also, any attempt to correlate unmasking with leaking is baseless.

From what I can see, the assumption has been made that solely because it was Susan Rice in the Obama administration who made the requests, it was automatically a nefarious plot. No proof given, only claims of malfeasance.

I found it comical that as soon as this report aired, the comment section on Slate was inundated by right wing trolls, who pounced on this little scrap of nothing like a pack of wild dogs in their need to have any confirmation of Trump's Tweet.

When you have any credible evidence to show that Susan Rice leaked the names of Trump's associates to anyone in the intelligence community who wasn't entitled to that information, I'll listen.

Till then, you are simply conspiracy theorists, with a clear bias that consumes you with hatred for anything Obama, and willingly led by any news, however baseless, that confirms your bias.