These are some of the things my "worldly" husband brought to my attention. Funny, how being raised in the "truth" doesn't really educate you on their true beliefs. Interesting to me that so many extremely intelligent people still buy into it, my parents for one. It becomes so clear when you have an open mind, and truly look for answers.
Thinkers Wife
thinker
JoinedPosts by thinker
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16
Reflection from the past...
by Scorpion in"if you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things.
because all the evidence in fulfillment of bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years.
of the generation that observed the beginning of the "last days" in 1914, jesus foretold: "this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur."-matt.
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thinker
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18
Judicial Defense ?
by thinker init occurs to me that this forum has a vast resource of knowledge and experience.
i'd like to suggest we put our heads together and find possible defenses for active witnesses facing a judicial committee.
with frenchy's intimate knowledge of committee rules and rr's huge library, along with everyone's individual experience; we we should be able to build a logical defense (assuming logic is a useful tool to jw's).. from my own research, i have put together a logical defense for an active jw who wishes to associate with a da'd friend.
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thinker
TMS,
You said:"You would be asking a Judical Committee to overturn the policies, teaching, guidelines of the WTBS and, in effect, create new teaching."
I disagree. The message I get from the quotes listed is this:
1) The Governing Body gives COUNSEL and SUGGESTIONS.
2) Principles are more important than rules. “Principles are eternal, whereas rules may apply to limited times or conditions.”
3) The rules of the past have been abandoned, bringing into question the rules of the present.
4) In questioning these rules the final authority should be Jehovah, not the GB."When there is a conflict, we must obey God as Ruler rather than men.
5) Can Jehovah "talk" to a lowly publisher? Yes. "Laws, judicial decisions, and instructions from Jehovah can be transmitted to ...Husbands, fathers, and mothers."I know this is just a mental exercise and the reality is very different. But maybe the WTBTS should write what they really mean:
1)The GB gives commands from God, not "counsel and suggestions".
2)Rules are just as important as principles.
3)The Governing Body is infallible, ignore our mistakes in the past. We have the TRUTH now (but we reserve the right to change it in the future).
4)We are not mere men, we are God's voice!
5)There is no way in hell Jehovah would talk to anyone not on the Governing Body.Edited by - thinker on 20 December 2000 12:48:18
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Jesus or Jehovah?
by Seven ini ran across this on truthsearcher.
i would appreciate anyone's thoughts on this.. __________.
who is the "alpha and omega" and the first and last"-jesus or jehovah?.
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thinker
I find these discussions concerning bible translation most interesting. It reminds me of the 3 blind men who stumble upon an elephant. The 1st touches it's trunk and says:"Elephants are long and slender, like a snake. The 2nd touches it's leg and says:"No, they're round and stout like a tree. The 3rd has it's tail and says:"Elephants are small and hairy like a mouse."
By focusing on SMALL parts, we lose sight of the WHOLE.
My opinion? The Bible is one of many good books that can help us lead "good" lives. I have read secular books which have far more meaning to me personally than the Bible.
Can anyone read the Bible and use it as a guide? Of course!! My reasoning is simple. I'm no bible scholar, but I know this: Jesus tried to teach the Elders and religious schorlars of his day and these scholars rejected Jesus's message. It was the common people who got it! IMHO the message of the Bible is available to EVERY common man. Step back and see the big picture.
Organized religions would have you believe you need them to "translate" the Bible and only their translation is correct. That's when the trouble starts.
Perhaps the NWT is the most accurate translation of the Bible, but does that give the WTBTS free rein to control your life? I hear of many people who are convinced of the accuracy of the NWT and then blindly follow ANYTHING coming from the governing body.ianao: I admire your position. If I understand you correctly, you believe the Bible should be THE book to live your life by and you study with witnesses because that translation seems most accurate to you. But, you resist getting baptised to avoid the contolling authority of an organized religion. Is this correct?
thinker
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18
Judicial Defense ?
by thinker init occurs to me that this forum has a vast resource of knowledge and experience.
i'd like to suggest we put our heads together and find possible defenses for active witnesses facing a judicial committee.
with frenchy's intimate knowledge of committee rules and rr's huge library, along with everyone's individual experience; we we should be able to build a logical defense (assuming logic is a useful tool to jw's).. from my own research, i have put together a logical defense for an active jw who wishes to associate with a da'd friend.
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thinker
It occurs to me that this forum has a vast resource of knowledge and experience. I'd like to suggest we put our heads together and find possible defenses for active witnesses facing a judicial committee. With Frenchy's intimate knowledge of committee rules and RR's huge library, along with everyone's individual experience; we we should be able to build a logical defense (assuming logic is a useful tool to JW's).
From my own research, I have put together a logical defense for an active JW who wishes to associate with a DA'd friend. I don't hold much hope that logic would help during a JC meeting, but here it is...1) The Governing Body gives counsel and suggestions.
"The faithful and discreet slave" is used by Jehovah to
give us good counsel. (Matt. 24:45)
This slave class not only helps us to understand the
meaning of Scripture texts but also gives us valuable
counsel and suggestions, indicating how to apply Bible
principles so as to remain spiritually strong.
Counsel from the faithful slave comes to us through
Bible-based literature published by the Watch Tower Soci-
ety and through congregation meetings. (PAY ATTENTION
TO YOURSELVES
AND TO
ALL THE FLOCK)2) “Jehovah’s perfect Organization is administered by imperfect men.” This has at times caused us to abandon or modify past practices. The abandonment of past practices indicates that today’s practices are subject to scrutiny.
“ *** jv 200 14 "They Are No Part of the World" ***
Practices That Have Been Abandoned
This Christmas celebration at Brooklyn Bethel in 1926 was their last. The Bible Students gradually came to appreciate that neither the origin of this holiday nor the practices associated with it honored God
For years, Bible Students wore a cross and crown as a badge of identification, and this symbol was on the front cover of the “Watch Tower” from 1891 to 1931. But in 1928 it was emphasized that not a decorative symbol but one’s activity as a witness showed he was a Christian. In 1936 it was pointed out that the evidence indicates that Christ died on a stake, not a two-beamed cross
In their “Daily Manna” book, Bible Students kept a list of birthdays. But after they quit celebrating Christmas and when they realized that birthday celebrations were giving undue honor to creatures (one reason that early Christians never celebrated birthdays), the Bible Students quit this practice too
For some 35 years, Pastor Russell thought that the Great Pyramid of Gizeh was God’s stone witness, corroborating Biblical time periods. (Isa. 19:19) But Jehovah’s Witnesses have abandoned the idea that an Egyptian pyramid has anything to do with true worship. (See “Watchtower” issues of November 15 and December 1, 1928)” (proclaimers book)3) Laws, judicial decisions, and instructions from Jehovah can be transmitted
to ...Husbands, fathers, and mothers.Laws, judicial decisions, and instructions from Jehovah
are transmitted through various levels of household (or-
ganizational ) management. (Eph. 1: l0, Ref. Bi., ftn. )
Jesus Christ, the King and High Priest. (Heb. 3 :1,6)
"The faithful and discreet slave" and its Governing Body
and traveling representatives. (Matt. 24:45-47; Acts 15:
23, 28, 29; 16:4)
Congregation elders. (Heb. 13 :17 )
Husbands, fathers, and mothers. (Prov. 1:8; Eph. 5:22,
23; 6:1, 4) (PAY ATTENTION
TO YOURSELVES
AND TO
ALL THE FLOCK)4) After considerable prayer, Jehovah has transmitted the information that the following quotes are correct and should be my guiding principle when addressing my disassociated friends:
“We would not refuse to treat one as a brother because he did not believe the Society is the Lord's channel.
If others see it in a different way, that is their privilege. There should be full liberty of conscience. WT April 1, 1920, p. 100, 101. “5) I have abandoned no principle in my decision.
“Principles are eternal, whereas rules may apply to limit-
ed times or conditions.”(PAY ATTENTION
TO YOURSELVES
AND TO
ALL THE FLOCK)6) By ignoring a man-made rule, I am following Jehovah’s principles.
“Principles are settled guidelines based on fundamental
truths. (w57 9/1 p. 524; w52 7/1 p. 407)Example of principles based on a fundamental truth:
Fundamental truth: Jehovah God is the Sovereign Lord
of heaven and earth. (Acts 4:24)
Principles based on this fundamental truth:
We owe Jehovah total obedience in everything.
(1 Sam. 15:22; Jer. 7:23)
When there is a conflict, we must obey God as
Ruler rather than men. (Acts 5:29)”(PAY ATTENTION
TO YOURSELVES
AND TO
ALL THE FLOCK)Comments?
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The New World
by larc inearlier, i had asked about changes under the thread, "new truth".
your replies were interesting and informative, or should i say it was meat in due season and i found it upbuilding.
i have another question: is the new world view still the same.
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thinker
Waiting,
"And the ultimate jw speculation: The earth was his first experience in populating. Once it's brought to Paradise condition (for a proper showing of Almighty Right to Rule the Universe to the Angels)then God can populate the other planets with his followers from the earth - which might be well populated with the birthings from generations of children from the survivors of Armageddon - Jehovah's True Worshipers. And who - as a group - worships Jehovah God? Jehovah's Witnesses only."
Did you see the exerpt in the 192 page book, grey, about populating other planets? Which book was it? Within the last seven to ten years.
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Watchtower History
by RR ini once offered this to obed, and he did seem interested, however, because of my being a free thinker, it didn't go too well with the jw moderators on witnet.. i had propose a history forum, where the history of the watchtower society could be analyzed, their beliefs, and practices, how they evolved, why they believe as they did or do.
such a forum will enlighten many to the organization they either once called or currently call 'jehovah's visible organization.'.
"people in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones"
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thinker
RR,
Excellent idea!!! I've been collecting info. online for about 6 months. When I read of your 6000+ books library I was thrilled. To actually hold this stuff in your hands...I would love to see a massive online "library" with every word ever printed. I would like to suggest that anyone posting to this thread CLEARLY state if the info. is backed up IN PRINT. I enjoy the "hearsay" as much as the printed stuff, but I like to know the source.Thinker
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Re: Hi...Another newbie
by Pathofthorns inawwww.. come on dude!!
that handle is a bit over-the-top lol.
what's your story?
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thinker
Calm down Anti Christ. Some of us are more patient and are natural born care givers. Don't get so excited. Just share. Maybe some of your questions will be answered eventually.
Thinkers Wife -
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'Deaden your body members'
by Maxee ini recently read a post on the net regarding how often men think about sex.
i started to think about how often i did.
i followed this up with a survey on antoher site and found i ranked low and they told me i had sexual problems.
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thinker
What is imho? Help us please. TW
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Re: May Jesus forgive me..
by Frenchy inroy, .
your absolution if you have any coming will be from god and not from humans.
your confession needs to be directed toward him and not us.. -seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
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thinker
Nelly,
I'm definitely interested in the previous life thing. If you ever want to discuss your views personally let me know.
Thinkers Wife -
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Re: May Jesus forgive me..
by Frenchy inroy, .
your absolution if you have any coming will be from god and not from humans.
your confession needs to be directed toward him and not us.. -seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
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thinker
Roy and Anti, definitely seek some professional guidance. You might be surprised how much a good therapist can do. Many of us here have experienced some terrible things. Some of us have been to professionals. They are equipped to deal with many things. Just make sure you pick a good one. It may be necessary to delve into your pasts in order to get to the root. Could even be things you don't consiously remember. Commendable that you both reconize it as a problem and want help. First step.
Thinkers Wife