Posts by trevor

60

DID GOD CREATE THE BEST OF ALL POSSIBLE WORLDS???

by Terry in

is this the best of all possible worlds?.

had god created a world in which he invested humans with adherence to inner, god designed morality guidance--wouldn't an obedient (and far better off human race) world not have been "better" than the one we are in?.

free will is only the freedom to screw up.. think about this.. everything man designs is designed to function properly.

trevor

The question you seem to be asking Terry is - Why would a loving God create man and woman with free will and then punish them for exercising choice. Of course you already know the answer - it never happened - it is just a story.

The more one looks into the whole story of Adam and Eve, the more it becomes clear that the story has been written backwards, which often happens when authors write with the benefit of hindsight.

Humans have not always been as conscious as they are now. Each advancement towards consciousness has bought greater freedom of choice. The reason we have fallen out of harmony with nature is that we have used our free will to dominate it.

We are collectively damaging the Garden of Eden, our planet, in a way that was not possible before we developed consciousness and free will.

We can not expect a God who allegedly walked in the Garden of Eden to help us.

Analysing the story of Adam and Eve is like studying the seven dwarves in an attempt to understand Snow White and her motives.

9

April Awake....signs occur "all one time period"...what is it???

by oompa in

just read in the april 2008 awake on page 5 under "what is the sign" : "the events that jesus mentioned--wars, earthquakes pestilences, food shortages---would not be new in themselves.

they have been happening since early in human history.

the difference would be that they would all occur in one time period.

trevor

‘This Generation,’ covers a contemporary period that lasts as long as is required to make sense of modern day applications of Jesus‘ words. ‘The period of unrest,’ refers to dissent among doubters who fail to grasp the flexibility of Jesus’ words. ‘The end is not yet,’ refers to the continuing murmurings among apostates that loyal members must endure until the end in order to be saved.

The Watchtower April 2008

60

DID GOD CREATE THE BEST OF ALL POSSIBLE WORLDS???

by Terry in

is this the best of all possible worlds?.

had god created a world in which he invested humans with adherence to inner, god designed morality guidance--wouldn't an obedient (and far better off human race) world not have been "better" than the one we are in?.

free will is only the freedom to screw up.. think about this.. everything man designs is designed to function properly.

trevor

Terry: The best of all possible worlds would contain humans designed with an internal guidance which exactly corresponded with what was best for humanity as programmed by the designer himself!

This thread, like the Bible, talks as though humans are the only living creatures on the planet. Animals were here for millions of years before we imploded on planet earth.

If they were created one has to ask why? They are an intrinsic part of the Eco system. If all life resolves around humans we have to ask why dangerous beasts were put here first to attack and kill the emerging human race?

Humans used to believe that the sun revolved around the earth we now know we were wrong.

Perhaps we will one day realise that the world does not resolve around us.

Perhaps even this God, that there is so much speculation about, is less real than the humble ant.

Trevor

57

Have we become like those we despise?

by boyzone in

ak jeff and i have just had a small disagreement on the charlton heston thread.

nothing important or serious, but it just struck me that in our exchanges he and brentr have used a couple of lines of false argumentation to get their point across.. i can't help but think its strange that with all our moaning about the watchtower and its false argumentation methods, are we prepared to use exactly the same methods when our views are challenged?.

i find this a bit disconcerting, especially on here of all places.

trevor

Boyzone

Welcome! Your thread title asks - Have we become like those we despise?

I am wondering who the 'we' is that despise Jehovah's Witnesses. Not everyone on this discussion board despises JWs. We see them as good people who have been been misled. They have not yet found a reason or perhaps the right time to leave the movement.

Many of us were once in their shoes and I remember that many of those who left were still prepared to have a drink with me and explain why they could no longer be JWs.

I was open minded enough to stay friends with them. Had they automatically despised me for still being a JWs, after they had left, their message would never have been put across.

It takes understanding and compassion to move beyond bitterness and see JWs as decent people who are trying to do the right thing.

87

What do we have to do to get Gods' Attention

by LouBelle in

jw
friends

this is *if* you believe in god / a god / gods.

there are moments when i sit down and have a conversation, almost with myself, because even though i am looking up at the heavens/searching my soul, there is no answer, no supernatural feeling, it is quiet and still, but i speak the words just in case there is something listening.. if there is a god and he is all that he claims to be through all the religions on this earth, why doesn't he rule us as a god should?

why doesn't he come on down and sort out this world?

trevor

AGuest

I have read your long reply to my post. You say that:

Although his motive and intent was pure, Paul was often inaccurate.

I had made the mistake of thinking that you believed that ALL scripture is inspired or God?

Thank you for taking the trouble to reply. Your approach to belief and reality remind me why I moved beyond the things written in the Bible.

I gain the impression that you are a sincere and kind person who is happy to be a believer. You should treasure your faith because the harsh glare of reality is not for everyone.

May your God go with you.

Trevor

44

Witness Kids - Scared silly by the WTBTS

by misspeaches in

i wonder if anyone else who grew up as a jw can relate with me on this subject.. i grew up hearing stories of 'faithful brothers & sisters' being tortured to a point where they were almost dead.

all they had to do to be set free was renounce jehovah and their religon.

the stories i heard of torture were graphic in nature and to this day i can not handle hearing about torture or watch it being portrayed in movies.

trevor

I was concerned about this persecution business and needed to know more about what was going to happen. I decided to ask father about it all when we got home.

Looking at me gravely father explained. ‘Many of us would be tortured and killed. If you are captured and break down under torture you might give away the whereabouts of our Brothers and Sisters. You must be prepared to endure pain. Getting very cold going from door-to-door will help you to develop endurance, which will put you in good stead for The Great Tribulation. Holding out under torture will please Jehovah. If you pray hard enough and do as we tell you, he may protect you.’

Scary stuff. It was all a bit like The French Resistance but we were to be fighting invisible forces. ‘But what if I do breakdown under torture?’ I asked fearfully.

Father opened his Bible and read to me. ‘You will not be tested beyond what you can bear.’ ‘He that endures to the end is the one that will be saved.’ He showed me other verses confirming that The Great Tribulation was definitely on its way. It was all in the Bible so it must be true.

Trevor

384

A STUNNINGLY simple question about JOHN 3:16 "For God so Loved the world."

by Terry in

on what basis did god so love the world?.

the world of mankind had been condemned to death by god's curse in eden!.

god viewed mankind as "dust on the scales".

trevor

Perry

Why don't you go and start your own thread about a man going fishing, instead of trying to sabotage Terry's thread because you have been unable make a single sensible reply to his question.

You have already explained to us that you are a troll.

There is really no need to go out of your way to prove it. We get the picture.

67

Athiests please answer these questions

by Mrs Smith in

jw
friends

i'm not trying to pick a fight i was just sitting at my desk pondering on some threads on jwd and i would very much like this question answered.. why is it that athiest often (not always) direct their argument for athiesism towards christians?

why not direct your argument towards buddists or muslims or even new-agers?

i mean they also believe in a higher power so why is it that only christains seem to get knocked?

trevor

Mrs Smith

Before Athiests can answer your question you will need to prove to them that you really exist.

42

Why did Death not stop as soon as the RANSOM was paid?

by jwfacts in

terry's recent thread about god's love made me start wondering the above question.

normally a ransom is done as a swap, the payment is made on exchange.

2000 years ago jesus made payment by dieing.

trevor

Jwfacts - Your question is valid.

When Adam an eve sinned ALL mankind were plunged into sin. Mankind was not obliged to put faith in Adam or Eve in order share in their sin - it was automatic. When the debt was repaid by Christ, ALL mankind should have been restored automatically.

A catch has been added. We have to subject ourselves to Christ and become his slaves.

Jesus did not pay of the debt. He merely bought the debt and now owns those who were deemed to owe the debt. The proof - Anyone who refuses to become a slave of Christ instead of a slave of sin faces the death penalty. It looks more like a buyout than an act of love.

Thank goodness it is all just a badly told and contradictory story written to amuse shepherds and fisher men.

Trevor

35

Was Jesus really without sin?

by Terry in

he violated the sabbath law and he saved a condemned woman from being stoned in compliance with the law.. does it matter he had scruples and self-justifying theological arguments?.

would those arguments have saved anybody else from being put to death?.

technically speaking (the letter of the law) could we truly speak of jesus as really without sin?.

trevor

According to the Bible Jesus came to abolish the law covenant so he can not be held to account for disregarding it.

Alas, the Bible also explains that all humans are born into sin as they come from a couple who fell from grace.

Jesus was born by an imperfect woman. A baby in the womb shares the mothers blood and is born with any defects that she has in her blood. This means that Jesus was contaminated before birth.

He was born in sin just like any other human, born of woman, who chooses to accept the Bible as God’s word.

Those who dismiss the Bible as no more than an entertaining story, can enjoy freedom from sin right now at this very moment - the only reality that exists.

Trevor