Posts by venus

41

Watchtower Doctrines JWs most commonly don't believe

by Diogenesister in

there was a recent thread on another site where posters maintained that many of the *most* long-standing jw's don't believe at least one official watchtower doctrine.

i've even read reports from bethelites saying they've heard bethel overseers say they don't believe some watchtower theology.

this made me think - i believe there are a few official doctrines that are common for many jw's to be either in denial about or simply not really believe ( often one and the same thing).. i'd say these are pretty high in the ranking:.

venus

I know my close friend who is a long-time Witness who says: 'I simply cannot digest the teaching of no-blood transfusion.'

4

Philosophy of religion

by venus in

create a superhuman character performing amazing feats, make him speak very good proverbs and parables which find easy acceptance among people, thus make him an authority on spirituality, and then make him speak business: become rich through improper means (luke 16:1-12) and avoid going into hell by sharing a portion of the ill-gotten wealth to the poor (mathew 25:31-46; contrast luke 16:19-31) which resulted in many orphanages and similar institutions coming into existence with the rich sponsoring them and the management living in luxury while working on behalf of the poor.

or make him provide basis for adoption of rituals that ensures a luxurious living for the management..

venus

doubtfuly yours,

Thank you for that YouTube link--I watched it. Good video. I agree with his idea that every religion is a different perspective of its founder who was only catering to the need of his time, yet truth may be far away from them all.

32

After being in the so-called "Truth" makes me despise all religions.

by Fader812 in

after being a jw made me lose trust in religion, from the lies, hypocrisy and greed of this organization made me lose faith completely.

what does one do after this mind f$%@, what is there to look forward to?

do i make up my own agnostic theory in head and hope for the best?

venus

There is no point in regretting. Even religious leaders had no answers to serious questions (John 9:1-3) which means everyone has to make his own conclusion. It seems Bertrand Russell made a good attempt in this regard. He said: “Philosophical contemplation enlarges not only the objects of our thoughts, but also the objects of our actions and our affections; it makes us citizens of the universe, not only of one walled city at war with all the rest. In this citizenship of the universe exists all true freedom, and liberation from the thralldom of narrow dogmas and fears."

32

After being in the so-called "Truth" makes me despise all religions.

by Fader812 in

after being a jw made me lose trust in religion, from the lies, hypocrisy and greed of this organization made me lose faith completely.

what does one do after this mind f$%@, what is there to look forward to?

do i make up my own agnostic theory in head and hope for the best?

venus

If I had done my homework and carefully ready at least three verses of the Bible (Mathew 7:21-23) I would not have joined JWs.

Jesus had already ruled out JWs when he said: "The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’because the kingdom of God is within you." (Luke 17:21) See how JWs contradicts Jesus saying Kingdom is established in 1914, and the invisible presence of the King is here ...and these are the signs of his presence ...etc.

17

NWT - revised 1984 vs revised 2013 versions

by Tallon in

in the latest 2013 revision the footnote of john chapter 8 states; a number of ancient and authoritative manuscripts omit vs 53 (of chapter 7) to chapter 8, vs. 11.. yet the 1984 revision quotes a similar footnote, however the passage of scripture is included in the text, albeit separately at the bottom.

this passage of scripture is about the scribes and the pharisees who brought a woman that was accused of adultery before jesus to test him on the punishment to be meted out.

then came his famous reply; let the one of you that is sinless be the first to throw a stone at her.. i just found it interesting that the wtbts would leave this out in the latest revision.

venus

When ocean itself is salty, there is no point in asking why one particular drop is salty. Bible is hung on the thread that God chose a nation as His own terming others as pagan (OT) and God exalted one of His children over the rest of children (NT)--something that is impossible for God to do (Deuteronomy 10:17; Romans 2:11)

30

Comparing Total Numbers Baptized During the 1990s and the Last Ten Years:

by steve2 in

sometimes, comparing raw numbers provides a more clear-cut numerical picture of growth or otherwise than percentages.

below are the numbers for peak publishers (rounded off so that 4,1 represents more than 4,100,000) for each year throughout the 1990s and those for the last ten years.. year: peak* baptisms.

* peak publishers abbreviated - simply to show annual baptisms in relation to peak publishers.. the main point: .

venus

JWs have been applying to themselves the prophecy found in Isaiah 60:22 "the tiniest group will become a mighty nation. At the right time, I, the LORD, will speed it up." Now they are going in opposite direction to this prophecy.

4

Philosophy of religion

by venus in

create a superhuman character performing amazing feats, make him speak very good proverbs and parables which find easy acceptance among people, thus make him an authority on spirituality, and then make him speak business: become rich through improper means (luke 16:1-12) and avoid going into hell by sharing a portion of the ill-gotten wealth to the poor (mathew 25:31-46; contrast luke 16:19-31) which resulted in many orphanages and similar institutions coming into existence with the rich sponsoring them and the management living in luxury while working on behalf of the poor.

or make him provide basis for adoption of rituals that ensures a luxurious living for the management..

venus

Cold Steel,

My point is that in big picture God is not using any religion but is being used by religions--with a commercial intent.

When I approach the religious leaders for various reasons, I have noticed their reactions changing according to the nature of the request I have. They seem to be very sweet when it brings some monetary benefit to them, but seem to be irritated/even exploding when you go for things such as a birth certificate which brings them no monetary benefit. Yet in their public talk they instruct us to be sweet in our behaviour with one another.

This I have observed among JWs too. If you invite the elders/COs for meal, or give them gifts, they know how to be sweet with you.

4

Philosophy of religion

by venus in

create a superhuman character performing amazing feats, make him speak very good proverbs and parables which find easy acceptance among people, thus make him an authority on spirituality, and then make him speak business: become rich through improper means (luke 16:1-12) and avoid going into hell by sharing a portion of the ill-gotten wealth to the poor (mathew 25:31-46; contrast luke 16:19-31) which resulted in many orphanages and similar institutions coming into existence with the rich sponsoring them and the management living in luxury while working on behalf of the poor.

or make him provide basis for adoption of rituals that ensures a luxurious living for the management..

venus

Create a superhuman character performing amazing feats, make him speak very good proverbs and parables which find easy acceptance among people, thus make him an authority on spirituality, and then make him speak business: Become rich through improper means (Luke 16:1-12) and avoid going into hell by sharing a portion of the ill-gotten wealth to the poor (Mathew 25:31-46; contrast Luke 16:19-31) which resulted in many orphanages and similar institutions coming into existence with the rich sponsoring them and the management living in luxury while working on behalf of the poor. Or make him provide basis for adoption of rituals that ensures a luxurious living for the management.

37

Illogical illustration of “the rich man and the poor man Lazarus” (Luke 16:19-31)

by venus in

illustration of the rich man and the poor man lazarus indirectly hints that the materially rich would go to hell and the poor ones to heaven.

if one reads between the lines, one can discern that this illustration is a later adoption intended to exploit the rich using the poor as a means.. i have friends who are extremely rich (net-worth in billions) and also who are materially very poor, and have found both are living in hell because of their attitude.

the excess the rich have prevents them from enjoying it (and even the affluent find a huge gap between income and desires, hence find themselves often in conflict and competition) and whereas the deprived compare themselves with the haves which prevents them also from enjoying their lives.. jesus would not provide an illustration that undermines his own most favored statement: “happy are those poor in spirit because kingdom of heavens belongs to them” (mathew 5:3) and his own explanation that heaven is the condition of one’s heart (luke 17:21) obviously he had in mind those who do not have the baggage of attachment and sense of possession, those few people of simplicity that belong to both the categories—the rich and the poor. simplicity is the ultimate sophistication, a stage where every possession serves a purpose living a life that is deliberate and intentional (not one that someone else has scripted for them) and wanting to feel more complete (not more objects of the world), at ease.

venus

TheWonderofYou,

If Jesus symbolized the Pharisees through the rich man in the illustration of “The Rich man and Lazarus,” what did he gain by that except that it made them more revengeful that ultimately resulted in the murder of the messenger himself? If an act is going to increase the problem, why should one initiate it in the first place? In this way also, illustration served no purpose!

In the big picture, this is what happens. The selfish people take advantage of a supernatural person who has supposedly spoken some good proverbs and performed some super-human feats—presenting things (parables and proverbs) through such authority to get easy acceptance from readers. One can see such motives behind some of the parables/illustrations Jesus supposedly used. For example, some people wanted to convey the following:

Fraud in business is ok (16:1-12); but such fraudulent ones will end up in hell (Luke 16:19-31); yet there is a way to work around this situation—the rich have to give a portion of their ill-gotten wealth to the poor, and can go to heaven. (Mathew 25:31-46). See how the rich have responded to such a message—many orphanages and similar institutions came into existence with the rich sponsoring them and the management living in luxury while working in the name of the poor.

37

Illogical illustration of “the rich man and the poor man Lazarus” (Luke 16:19-31)

by venus in

illustration of the rich man and the poor man lazarus indirectly hints that the materially rich would go to hell and the poor ones to heaven.

if one reads between the lines, one can discern that this illustration is a later adoption intended to exploit the rich using the poor as a means.. i have friends who are extremely rich (net-worth in billions) and also who are materially very poor, and have found both are living in hell because of their attitude.

the excess the rich have prevents them from enjoying it (and even the affluent find a huge gap between income and desires, hence find themselves often in conflict and competition) and whereas the deprived compare themselves with the haves which prevents them also from enjoying their lives.. jesus would not provide an illustration that undermines his own most favored statement: “happy are those poor in spirit because kingdom of heavens belongs to them” (mathew 5:3) and his own explanation that heaven is the condition of one’s heart (luke 17:21) obviously he had in mind those who do not have the baggage of attachment and sense of possession, those few people of simplicity that belong to both the categories—the rich and the poor. simplicity is the ultimate sophistication, a stage where every possession serves a purpose living a life that is deliberate and intentional (not one that someone else has scripted for them) and wanting to feel more complete (not more objects of the world), at ease.

venus

If something is open for interpretation, it cannot be from God because "For God is not a God of disorder ." (1Cor 14:33)

Any interpretation is just the perspective of the one who interprets it. If a teacher comes from heaven, and leaves behind something for anyone to interpret in any way each one likes, what is the purpose of communication? Can an interpreter be absolutely sure that what he says is what Jesus really had in his mind?

If something is crystal clear, then it would be one of the signs that it may be from God.