undercover

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Posts by undercover

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  21

  Going clear: Scientology

  by James Mixon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  a must see if you haven't seen it.

  some scary stuff.

  they pay their workers.

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  undercover

  Scientology is just absurd. I mean you build a religion based on bad science fiction?

  And talking snakes, virgin births, and bringing dead people back to life isn't absurd?
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  20

  JW.org Lapel Pins for I.D. ?

  by ShirleyW in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  today was the first time i've seen a bro wearing a jw.

  org lapel pin, actually much, much larger than an actual lapel pin.

  square shaped, the background was olive green but the letters were white in bold letters.

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  undercover

  Here's their latest "kids-friendly" offering

  
  

  Is that actually from the WTS??? Actually supplied to privileged JWs to wear???

  
  

  I don't have the patience to look up exact book/chapter/verse, but the scripture about not making a graven image comes to mind...
  
  
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  15

  Breaking cognitive dissonance - or - how to get Bill Cosby to help a dub see the light

  by undercover in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  let me preface this by saying, i don't know if mr. cosby is guilty of all that he's being accused of.

  the number of women coming out against him is pretty damning, but no real proof has been offered (that i'm aware of anyway).

  and it is this circumstantial, hearsay evidence that can actually play into the hands of someone trying to get a jw to grasp the seriousness of the child abuse claims in the jw religion.. how so?.

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  undercover

  I'm just thinking that there is then a problem if he is found innocent . Witnesses will flip the situation and say " see lots of accusations do not add up to guilt , people just had it in for him because he is black/, famous /, rich /; just like apostates have it in for us "

  Apostates and critics of the WTS have one thing that the Cosby critics don't have: arrests, trials, convictions, imprisoned JWs, lawsuits found in favor of victims of abuse, the list goes on. And it's not just one case, it's many cases. Denying that the WTS/JWs have child abuse issues is like denying that the Catholic church has child abuse issues. I bet the average JW is very critical of the Catholic church and points to them as what a religion is like without god's spirit, not realizing their argument can be used against their own religion.
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  64

  Shutting down the Judicial Committee "invite".

  by kairos in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  judicial committee invitation comes, with be there or be square consequences.. ( come or we will df you ).

  what are the sure fire, tested and true tactics that will keep the elders off your back?

  ( for good ).

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  undercover

  The only authority that elders have is that which you allow them to have.

  If you allow them none, they have none

  You don't have to prove anything. You don't have to respond. You don't have to threaten lawsuits. Just ignore them. If you feel you must respond, keep it short and simple; "I will not be attending your tribunal. Have fun without me. Do not contact me again"

  Sure, you'll probably be DFd anyway, but if you were already going to battle with them, why care, and why get all worked up about it. The best revenge is living well, and without giving them any satisfaction of having affected you or your lifestyle.
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  68

  15 Years of Jehovahs-Witness.com

  by Simon in

  1. forum
  2. announcements

  yes, today is the forum's 15th birthday!.

  i never thought for one moment that it would survive this long or have so many people post so many great subjects over the years.. it is still humbling when i get pm's or emails from people expressing how the site has helped them and of course thanks goes to all the posters who have shared their experiences and make helpful and supportive comments to others who are in the sometimes difficult process of learning the real truth about 'the truth'.. the site has gone through several different incarnations over the last 15 years running on different platforms, different databases and different hosts but we've been able to keep all the old topics.

  the current site is still being developed and i'm hoping to push another major upgrade soon.. i also may have some other news to share soon about the future of the site so stay posted.. until then, here's the the next 15 years!

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  undercover

  Thanks for the years of putting up with all the arguments, trolls, and all around childishness that often times accompany an Internet forum board.... especially one frequented by ex-cult members.
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  15

  Breaking cognitive dissonance - or - how to get Bill Cosby to help a dub see the light

  by undercover in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  let me preface this by saying, i don't know if mr. cosby is guilty of all that he's being accused of.

  the number of women coming out against him is pretty damning, but no real proof has been offered (that i'm aware of anyway).

  and it is this circumstantial, hearsay evidence that can actually play into the hands of someone trying to get a jw to grasp the seriousness of the child abuse claims in the jw religion.. how so?.

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  undercover

  Let me preface this by saying, I don't know if Mr. Cosby is guilty of all that he's being accused of. The number of women coming out against him is pretty damning, but no real proof has been offered (that I'm aware of anyway)

  And it is this circumstantial, hearsay evidence that can actually play into the hands of someone trying to get a JW to grasp the seriousness of the child abuse claims in the JW religion.

  How so?

  Well, in my JW family, the standard reaction to the Cosby mess is one of acceptance of his guilt. Too many accusers, and too many tales from insiders for there to not be some truth to the accusations. They're saddened by it. He was a good TV dad, and seemed like a 'clean' stand up comedian that they could enjoy. But if the accusations are true, then, well, no more Cosby Show reruns, no more stand up records, no more live shows. He is no longer considered suitable entertainment.

  Yet, when a (or if) a JW sees news reports and expose stores on child abuse within the WTS/JWs, they stick their head in the sand. Why not the same reaction as to the Cosby revelations? We know the answer to that, but if...IF...you could open dialogue with that JW, who gave up supporting Cosby, yet still defends the WTS, you can ask them to compare the situations.

  "You no longer support Cosby, with no absolute proof even, but yet, when JWs are sentenced and imprisoned; when the WTS is found negligent, and ordered to pay millions, how can you continue to support an organization that IS guilty? Without evidence or a court case, you've judged Cosby, yet after many court cases, and judgments against JWs and the WTS leadership, you continue to defend them. How can you do that?"

  
  

  Would it work? Who knows, depending on the level of cognitive dissonance. Yet, I saw a glimmer of light in one JWs eyes that made the connection. That one little doubt could lead to more doubts and questions. In time, with critical thinking skills, it could lead to a JW to judge the WTS guilty, and walk away from ever supporting them again.
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  14

  Current U.S Federal Judge is a Jehovah Witness... How does this guy not get forced to quit his job and not get in trouble?

  by paulmolark in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  current u.s. federal judge is one of jehovah's witnesses - see more at: http://www.jw-archive.org/post/114109639783/current-u-s-federal-judge-is-one-of-jehovahs#sthash.pz6qywnk.dpuf.

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  undercover

  JWs don't vote, don't get involved in politics, don't join the military, don't pledge allegiance to the flag...

  but they can be US federal judges.

  If an active JW went around promoting doing any of the aforementioned things, he'd be hauled in front of a JC faster'n you can say UN NGO.

  But having a US federal judge might come in handy to the ole corporation. So, after prayerful consideration, tis okay by the leaders in their ivory tower.

  Bastards.
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  64

  POLL: Will You Be Attending The Memorial & If You Are---Why?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was just invited.

  i thanked my old elder friend and he left.

  (i'm not going).

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  undercover

  Just saw from Blues Brother when it is. Not sure if I'm going or not. I posted part of this on another thread:

  Some years I've gone, some I haven't. ...

  As much as I'm forever out of their control, I really don't have a problem with going to the memorial, if it makes elderly parents happy. It's one hour a year. Big deal. No different than a name only Catholic showing up for xmas mass once a year. I don't like going to cheap cafeteria style restaurants either, but the old folks like it, so that's where I take em to eat. Their time is limited. Let em enjoy it, even if it isn't my thing.
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  27

  Has anybody been guilted/emotionally blackmailed into attending the 2015 Memorial?

  by Bucholz in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  hello everybody, i was wondering if anyone has been guilted or emotionally blackmailed into attending the memorial this year.

  something along the lines of "if you loved your family you would at least attend the memorial".

  i myself haven't attended in 5 years.

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  undercover

  Some years I've gone, some I haven't. I don't even know when it is this year. Suppose I'll find out the week of, when well-meaning, but clueless JW family invite me.

  As much as I'm forever out of their control, I really don't have a problem with going to the memorial, if it makes elderly parents happy. It's one hour a year. Big deal. No different than a name only Catholic showing up for xmas mass once a year. I don't like going to cheap cafeteria style restaurants either, but the old folks like it, so that's where I take em to eat. Their time is limited. Let em enjoy it, even if it isn't my thing.

  Some comments mention that 'once-a-year' attendees are looked down on by the rest of the JWs. That doesn't bother me a bit. I'm already looked down on. My being there or not being there isn't going to change that. If I decide to go, I wear my independence from their control on my sleeve. No tie, no suit jacket, beard in place. Be confident, don't shirk from talking to anyone, let em know that being away from religious fanaticism has done you well.
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  27

  Why do people "come back"?

  by kairos in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i know of several examples of ones that "left the truth" for up to 20 years, only to suffer through the reinstatement process and feel like they are finally back on track.. how does this happen?.

  i personally know of one example where a father of three, leaves jws, abandons wife and family, lives as a gay man then comes back 20 years later as a partaking member of the anointed..

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  undercover

  People who leave, become 'inactive', but at some point come back, really never left. Sure, they didn't go to meetings, or go out in service, or attend the conventions, but the prior mind control was still there in some small way. Enough so that when things in life took a turn that caused them to question either themselves or the world they live in, they came back.

  A friend of mine, DFd, has been away for decades. Lived his life away from any JW contact, not attended any meetings for years and years. He has not lived an exemplary lifestyle in this time, but he does attempt to avoid holidays, politics, and supports the blood transfusion ban.

  At one point, I thought he might be finally freeing his mind of the JW mess, but he told that he thinks the JWs are right. He's just not strong enough, worthy enough to join back. So this guy is living his entire life with a guilt complex that he's not good enough for a religious cult.

  He may never go back and be an active member, but the WTS controls him every bit as much as they control the active JWs.

  If that's not a cult, I don't know what is