Posts by undercover

24

Dunkin Donut style KH

by GreenhornChristian in

has anyone seen one of the new design kh's and taken pics?

i'm curious to see.

undercover

Those renderings look like a doctor's office building.

But I guess that is apropos... most people look forward to going to the KH about as much as they do the dentist's office

221

Judge sanctions WTS - $4k per day penalty for not producing sex abuse documents

by Simon in

judge sanctions jehovah's witnesses.

imposes $4000-a-day penalty for not producing documents in sex-abuse case.

by dorian hargrove, june 24, 2016. a san diego superior court judge has ordered the church of jehovah's witnesses, also known as the watchtower bible and tract society of pennsylvania, to pay $4000 a day for every day that it fails to produce documents requested in a civil lawsuit brought by former parishioner, osbaldo padron, who claims a church elder sexually abused him when he was seven years old.. in a june 23 ruling, expected to be made final today, judge richard strauss admonished the church for willfully ignoring a court order to produce all documents associated with a 1997 body of elders letter that church leaders sent to parishes around the world in a quest to learn about sexual abuse of children by church leaders.. over the course of the past year, the watchtower society and its lawyers have fought hard to keep the letter confidential, claiming that turning over the documents would infringe on the privacy of those mentioned in the letter that were not associated with the case.. in march 2015, the church turned over a heavily redacted version of the letter.

undercover

Question:

Has this info been reported on anywhere but the San Diego Reader? Not to disparage the Reader, or it's journalists, but the Reader is one of the those free weekly tabloid style newspapers. I've searched the Union Tribune, and couldn't find anything. It is possible I missed it.

The reason I bring it up: should anyone want to share this info with a JW family member, I'm afraid the JW would view the source as unreliable. Yes, I know that court orders could probably be easily found to prove the judge's action if one wanted to go that far, but it would be nice if this were reported by more than one weekly freebie newspaper. And yes, I know that some JWs would question the New York Times even if they published it. But the more publicity that court actions like this get through many and more national news outlets, the better. Many people who have left the religion left because of news reports of child abuse and the cover up scandals.

25

Just a really messed up situation

by My Name is of No Consequence in

a quick summary of my situation: i have known ttatt since at least 2010. my wife and teenage son are still in.

i only mention that because it is relevant in this situation.

you can see some of my previous posts for additional details.

undercover

Did you adopt him as your own son? If so, then legally you have as much right as her when it comes to raising him. If he's 'just' your stepson, with you having no real legal rights, then you'll have to tread lightly. If she, as the legal guardian, prohibits you from interfering, then you may have to just wait it out until he's an adult and you and he can discuss things as adults without needing her permission.

26

So Are Inactives officially SHUNNED?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i've read here that inactives are the same as disfellowshipped, treatment wise.

is that correct or did i misread it??

thanks......

undercover

Wasn't there, but supposedly the convention had a part, complete with video, on how to view and treat inactive ones who are clearly, either through words or actions, demonstrating lack of 'christian' morals and values.

In other words, pretty much the same as before. No official shunning, just a heavy reminder to not associate with anyone who isn't actively supporting the organization.

15

Not on jw.org : Jehovah's Witness van driver arrested for ignoring rape of child

by JimmyPage in

jw
friends

http://5newsonline.com/2016/06/23/report-van-driver-arrested-for-not-stopping-rape-of-child/.

i don't believe the article says he's a jw, but he is..

undercover

Jimmy,

Is there a way besides pms to whoever asks to show some kind of verification that this guy was a dub?

and BTW, congrats on keeping the rights to Stairway to Heaven. You were great on the witness stand :)

135

I've been found out!

by pale.emperor in

well, thats it folks.. my identity on here has been rumbled and reported to the elders.

someone, somehow, has figured out that im a member of this site and - rather than speak to me - has promptly reported me to the elders.

i just feel sad for my daughter.

undercover

We are all pale.emperor

Seriously, we really are, or were at one point. The vast majority of us have been, maybe still are in, a position that if the wrong person found out who our real identity they could wreak havoc in our personal lives.

The fact that you have to go cloak and dagger just to visit, and partake in, an Internet discussion board to avoid punishment, persecution, being shunned and ostracized proves that we are in, or have been, in a cult.

98

Beards - September 2016 Watchtower

by Listener in

the issue of whether beards are acceptable or not is addressed in the september 2016 watchtower - well sort of.

it is as clear as mud as to whether they are allowed in places like australia, usa and britain.. 17. what are some factors that may affect whether a brother wears a beard?17 what about the propriety of brothers wearing a beard?

the mosaic law required men to wear a beard.

undercover

I'm kinda surprised they didn't snark on 'hipsters' much like they did on metrosexuals.

Just take Tony Tightpant's script and change the words 'metrosexual' and 'tight pants' with 'hipster' and 'beard'.

33

Field Service Privilege Can Be Taken Away Due to Hairstyle and Tight Pants???

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

millie2105 hours agohere is something i just found out this week.former belief - field service is a publishers inalienable right new belief - field service privilege can be taken away if person styles hair or wears clothing in a way that is deemed metrosexual.i was pretty much dumbfounded.. this was posted on another thread, so i decided to start a new topic about this.

i think this is amazing!

i wish this was in place when i was a kid.

undercover

If a guy dresses as a "metrosexual" just going down to the local Piggly-Wiggly to pick up a case of PBR...

That's funny as hell... though somewhat mixed up. I imagine a guy who goes to the Piggly-Wiggly to pick up a case of PBR is going to be dressed more like the guys from Florida Georgia Line than a 'metrosexual'. Your 'metrosexual' types are going to Whole Foods or Trader Joe's and purchasing a case of Pinot Grigio

But, I digress... your overall statement is correct from what I recollect. I remember guys getting sent home to shave (one brother was told to take one step closer to his razor), several of us were counciled over the style of overcoat we were, or weren't I should say, wearing. But to bar someone one from participating in the preaching work based on overall grooming is a new wrinkle.

I think there's a connection to the preaching work becoming more robotic than personal. As they move more and more to the literature cart, all a dub has to do is stand there, and answer questions... meaning, all they have to do is stand there. First impression is important, so instead of freedom of choice in style or personality, they want a bunch of Stepford Wives to man the carts. Dress in cult approved attire, your hair and jewelry all approved by the cult wardrobe dept, and you stay on script, repeating the cult mantra, never deviating from the approved playbook.

57

RUSSIA: Jehovah's Witnesses face possible liquidation

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=2181.

24 may 2016. russia: jehovah's witnesses face possible liquidation.

by victoria arnold, forum 18. if prosecutors proceed with their threat to liquidate the jehovah's witness headquarters near st petersburg, thousands of local congregations across russia could also face prohibition of their activities and individuals could be vulnerable to criminal charges for expressing their beliefs, forum 18 notes.. the jehovah's witnesses' principal body in russia is under threat of dissolution as an "extremist" organisation after the deadline in an official warning from the general prosecutor's office expired on 10 may, forum 18 notes.

undercover

It's a conundrum for sure. You have a totalitarian style government looking to ban a totalitarian style religion.

While the dubs will definitely play the persecution card should this happen, and get exposure in the West, it is an opportunity to point out the flaws of the WTS to JW family/friends.

When a JW carries on about being persecuted/banned in Russia, agree with them. Yes, it is a humans right violation. Every human should have the right to believe and serve the religion of their choice - without persecution or punishment. Any organization, be it governmental, or religious or private, that looks to punish, black list or shun someone who chooses to worship differently than their collective should be held accountable for their human rights violations. Emphasize the word 'shun', and leave that thought hanging.

4

Should all the JW`s who ever took part in a quick build/renovations take out a class action against the WTB&TS for compensation ?

by smiddy in

let`s face it , the people who took part in quick builds / renovations of kingdom halls , etc, never expected the wtb&ts to sell off the buildings they were so sure was for furthering kingdom interests in this system of things .. they gave their time, effort, money, labour ,free of charge , and then some years later the society sells it off for a profit ?

to the wt ?.

kingdom halls , assembly halls , etc.

undercover

Nope. Waste of time and effort. You volunteered your time to an organization. They fact that they sold that properly later is just business. Lesson learned... make sure of the organization and how their set up before volunteering time and/or money.

What a lot of JWs didn't know, and I didn't either when I first started working on quick build projects, is that some 'brothers' are hired as contractors to provide services. I volunteered to help build items that were installed in KHs, and helped install them. I found out (thru an elder who knew the real scoop) that the brother in charge of this area was contracted and being paid to provide and install the items. This guy had over half the KH helping him construct the items in his shop, and installing at KH projects. He was getting free labor, and pocketing quite the profit. Once I learned this, I stopped volunteering. In fact, I stopped helping in any of the building projects, and this was when I was still active and mostly believing. If I could volunteer my time to help, why couldn't these so-called skilled 'brothers'.

It was a racket. The biggest racket was the WTS getting free building labor from thousands of people, but on the local level some 'brothers' found an angle on how to make a profit themselves and fleeced congregations. I knew one brother who was kicked out of the building committee because he found cheaper quotes from 'worldly' sources for renovating a KH, but the committee said it had to be done by approved contractors (read: fellow JWs). The JW contractors were quoting up to 50% more than non-JWs. The brother complained and was subsequently booted. But in time, the committee brothers were found out by the WTS and the committee was disbanded and some of them DFd. I guess they didn't like small timers weaseling in on their turf. It's like a bad Mafia movie...