Posts by undercover

55

Can the Bible be used to disprove the Witnesses

by jaredg in

lately i have been arguing with my father about my beliefs and such.

i belive that the wbts is not the faithful and discrete slave and i don't agree with many of the wbts techings.

the easiest way for me to do this is to discredit the bible but this isn't working with my father.

undercover

Jared, I wish you luck, but I'm afraid you may be wasting your time. To JWs who at present have no doubts or issues with the WTS, they just aren't going to listen to you. I think you can present your case better by living a good, decent life, being happy(happiness by non- and ex- JWs just boggles their minds). Keep your eyes open for when your dad may question something the WTS prints or if an elder or CO irk him over some pharisiacal(?) point. If you can crack open a doubt when you see it, you'll get much further than beating him over the head with stuff he isn't going to listen to anyway.

If you do debate with your dad, whatever subject you decide on, stick to that one subject. Don't let him jump subjects on you. God, they love doing that. They get stuck so they jump to another subject. Become an expert on your subject.. Inside out over under sideways down, know everything there is to know about that subject. Know the WTS stance in addition to what ever position you take on it. A lot of times JWs don't even know what they believe.

If I was going to argue with a JW, I would argue the issue about 607bce being the destruction of Jersualem. If you prove 607 wrong, then the whole belief system comes crashing down. Without 607, the end times prophecy of 2520 years doesn't end in 1914. That in turn means 1914 is wrong. If 1914 is wrong, it's all wrong. You don't have to prove any other date right, you just have to prove 607 wrong. This one isn't as simple as saying the Bible doesn't support not celebrating birthdays, but it carries much more weight. I mean birthdays...who cares? This is about your salvation, arguing about birthdays or can I have a beard is nothing compared to false prophecy and deception.

54

I need three good questions!

by Dansk in

jw
friends

.

if it were possible to get a jw to actually listen to us, which three good questions do you reckon might get him/her to sit down and think?

ian

undercover

1. a. (They have "a" and "b" parts in the WT questions, so can I) Using only the Bible, prove that Jerusalem was destroyed in 607bce.
b. Using only the Bible, prove that Jesus returned to earth invisibly in 1914.
c. Using only the Bible, prove that in 1918 that Jesus chose the Bible Students(later, JWs) as God's organization.

2. Prove from the Bible that Jesus is mediator only for the anointed and not for all who wish to gain salvation.

3. a. Are religions who become entangled with the world governments accepted by Jehovah?
b. What will happen to religions who align themselves with worldly governments?
c. Since the United Nations is part of the worldl governmental system and has been identified as the Wild Beast or the Image of the Wild Beast by the Watchtower Society, why did the Watchtower Society become affliated with the UN as an NGO(Non Governmental Organization)?

edited 'cause I don't know my abc's.

120

We walked out of my mom's memorial service

by tyydyy in

jw
friends

.

my brother, my sister, myself, xena and those with us walked out when we were called aside and asked not to attend the reception after the memorial.. more details to follow....... timb

undercover

My condolences on the loss of your mother...

Reading how you were treated made my blood boil. I'm not sure why, except that maybe I could see that happening to me one day when my mother dies. How dare someone ask you not to attend a reception of a funeral for your own mother. Family have first right, no matter what their stance in life at being there over anyone not related...especially in a public building. I admire how you handled the situation, you're a better man than I am. I know that I would not have handled that as well.

21

Comments You Will Not Hear at the 12-12-04 WT Study

by blondie in

those who have been persecuted for righteousness?

?1 peter 3:14.. reproached for the sake of christ (or jehovah?).

?1 peter 4:14.. 7 jesus stated that his followers should consider themselves happy even when people "lyingly say every sort of wicked thing" against them for his sake.

undercover

In modern times, Jehovah?s Witnesses have been persecuted because they refuse to stop preaching "this good news of the kingdom." (Matthew 24:14)

Or for refusing to carry a national identity card. See JWs vs. Malawi.

Or for carrying out the wishes of a nut-job religious leader who, after his trying to placate the national leader failed, insulted and bad-mouthed the same national leader who also was a nut-job and had in his power the means to kill millions of people. See JWs vs. Hitler.

21

Comments You Will Not Hear at the 12-12-04 WT Study

by blondie in

those who have been persecuted for righteousness?

?1 peter 3:14.. reproached for the sake of christ (or jehovah?).

?1 peter 4:14.. 7 jesus stated that his followers should consider themselves happy even when people "lyingly say every sort of wicked thing" against them for his sake.

undercover

When their Christian meetings are banned, they are willing to suffer rather than stop gathering together as the Bible commands. (Hebrews 10:24,25)

Right. How the WTS suffered in Mexico back when the Mexican government didn't allow religions to own property. JWs met together without Bibles or songbooks, they didn't call their buildings Kingdom Halls or "places of worship" and the they registered as a social group instead of a religion. Oh, the suffering our brothers endured so the the WTS wouldn't have to give up their property. I'm sure Jehovah was pleased with the long-suffering of our dear brothers, so that his earthly organization would not have to lose their holdings.

63

it's funny how people who hate the jw's so much stick around the forum..

by jwbloodline in

not hating or directing this at anyone.

but if you guys hate the jw ways so much, why stick around the forum.

the internet is full of things to do.

undercover

Okay....I hate to use this word...but it applys

TROLL

blood...you haven't responded to any of the people that took time to give you honest, sincere answers without getting angry at you, but you don't respond to them, you keep trying to egg those on that you think you have gotten under their skin.

fuck ya, I'm done with ya.

3

2004 Service Report Stats

by Cameron in

jw
friends

would someone who has the february 2005 watchtower please give me the following information regarding the 2004 annual report... .

1) number of witnesses.

2) number of hours.

undercover

Actually it is February. They delayed it a month this year. There have been a couple of threads about it.

Cameron, if you look around some you might can find those threads and it might have some of the numbers you'r looking for. Sorry, I don't have that info.

63

it's funny how people who hate the jw's so much stick around the forum..

by jwbloodline in

not hating or directing this at anyone.

but if you guys hate the jw ways so much, why stick around the forum.

the internet is full of things to do.

undercover

why undercover? who you hidin from? Jehovah can see you!

When I first came here...I was a somewhat believing JW but with lots of questions and doubts. Like many others I wanted answers but was afraid of being found out by other JWs and elders that I was looking into apostate information about JWs.

Now I do not consider myself a JW, but I am not DFd or DAd, I faded away so as to keep family contact. I choose to not play by the WTS rules and allow myself to be shunned for not believing anymore.

I chose the name early on and now that I have posted so much with it, I just live with it.

If there is a God, which I doubt, I don't much care what he sees me do. If he can see me, he must not care too much anyway, cause he ain't done nuthin about it.

63

it's funny how people who hate the jw's so much stick around the forum..

by jwbloodline in

not hating or directing this at anyone.

but if you guys hate the jw ways so much, why stick around the forum.

the internet is full of things to do.

undercover

But if you guys hate the Jw ways so much, why stick around the forum. the internet is full of things to do. Why stick around here if you are disfellowshiped or just fell off. Why stick around to a place where peeps don't really want you around?

As has been explained, this forum is for anyone who wishes to discuss anything JW, but most people here are ex-JWs. The site is owned and run by an ex-JW. He welcomes all as long as they behave.

So, you are incorrect in thinking that we aren't wanted here, we are wanted here. You are too as long as you behave.

How much clearer can anyone make it?

(Were we all this thick when we were still JWs?)

63

it's funny how people who hate the jw's so much stick around the forum..

by jwbloodline in

not hating or directing this at anyone.

but if you guys hate the jw ways so much, why stick around the forum.

the internet is full of things to do.

undercover

negative response to a question that i didn't understand... that you didn't understand..
I'm sorry if i offended anyone.. i'm done with this..

You asked a question and you got answers...what else did you want?

You must be an elder or a future elder...shouting makes you feel important