Posts by undercover

39

(Not so) Subliminal Shave Your Beard Message

by Funchback in

i'm in the middle of dissecting the june 2017 jw broadcasting video.. in the first minute, they summarize a story about a guy who apparently was a one-time bad ass (showed a picture of him with a beard while posing on a chopper).

then, they show him shaving at the exact same moment the narrator is saying how he regained "a clean conscience".. this no-beard obsession by the jws is beyond nuts.. .

undercover

I posted this thought on another 'beard' thread a couple of months ago. Cut/pasted from that post:

...the 'beard rule' is a microcosm of the WTS/JWs. We've latched on to this seemingly innocent thing because it demonstrates the authoritarian rule of the WTS over it's members. One cannot dictate to oneself this simple grooming choice. It has to be made for you. The same for your entertainment choices. Your celebrations. Even your level of education.

When you're inside the religion, and allowing them to control your thinking and actions, you don't think about it. But as soon as you exert your freedom, this one minor thing sticks out as a huge signal that something is wrong with the ruling body of this group.

56

Would You Outlaw Jehovah's Witnesses If You Had Your Way?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i still believe in freedom of religion even if i disagree with the beliefsof the religion.

what about you?.

undercover

No. Freedom of religion.

I would like to see religions held more accountable for harm that is caused by their authoritarian structure. Child abuse issue mainly. Not just the individual priest, preacher, deacon, elder... but hold the entire system accountable. It's being focused on more in some countries (Australia), but in the US, religion is a sacred institution that is protected, even if the occasional follower/leader is found guilty of horrendous crimes.

Lawsuits are damning, but too easily hushed up with gag orders, and payoffs with agreement to keep quiet.

No easy answer.

39

(Not so) Subliminal Shave Your Beard Message

by Funchback in

i'm in the middle of dissecting the june 2017 jw broadcasting video.. in the first minute, they summarize a story about a guy who apparently was a one-time bad ass (showed a picture of him with a beard while posing on a chopper).

then, they show him shaving at the exact same moment the narrator is saying how he regained "a clean conscience".. this no-beard obsession by the jws is beyond nuts.. .

undercover

There are employers who make rules like that. If you want to be part of an organisation and they have a rule like that, you have to follow the rule.

True. Employers, especially large, in the public eye, ones, have specific grooming rules for employees. If you want to work there, then you have to follow the rule.

But, as mentioned, you can always quit your job at that company and find another one in a similar position, or even something better. Not so in Watchtower World. The catch at this company is that without them, you will be destroyed, along with all the evil people, at Armageddon. So, basically it boils down to, 'obey and shave - live; or disobey, grow a beard - die'. That's a simplistic equation, but that's how it's presented, so that's how you have to accept it.

True story: when I was first waking up to the lies of the WTS, I had sheparding calls from elders. In these calls, I questioned some WTS rules that aren't biblical. Beards was one of them. One elder mentioned a large US company that had similar grooming rules, as they wanted their employees to represent them in a certain way, similarly for JWs. They should want to represent the organization in a good way. That's when it hit me - we weren't representing Jehovah, able to use Christian Freedom in our day to day lives, we were representing the WTS as door to door magazine sales reps, and had to obey company rules.

27

Dealing with Elderly Parents Who Still Believe the jw Religion is the truth

by lancelink in

i left the religion back in 2008 right after my mother died,( the total lack of natural love/ affection was the final straw for me).. but my dad has become more and more focused on doing the wt bidding.. it just amazes me how he gushes on and on about the last days, his new bible studies, and meeting parts .

but yet he makes no effort to have any type of relationship with his grandkids, there are 5 of them , non are witnesses.

they are the children from several different sisters of mine, and myself.. so how do you deal with the witness stuff always being presented in conversations?.

undercover

My parents and in-laws both are quite satisfied, and happy as JWs. At this late stage in their life, why bust that bubble? They have friends, a support system, a reason to stay busy. I'd rather they go out happy, than realize they wasted 80 years believing in a lie.

The same could be said for Catholics, Baptists, Mormons, Lutherans, the list goes on. If they're happy, satisfied, why mess with them? Freedom of choice goes both ways. I choose not to follow that path. If they choose it, they have every right to. (as long as they don't abuse their position and power, but that's another discussion)

116

What is behind your choice of forum user name?

by stuckinarut2 in

jw
friends

just curious how we all think.. what prompted or influenced your choice of username for this forum?.

there are some really amazing names, and it would be great to hear the stories behind them.... mine was nothing fancy.

i just felt "stuck in a rut too" along with so many others.

undercover

I was still somewhat 'in' when I joined, but had doubts and was questioning everything. And thus scared shitless about being found out. So I had to stay undercover as much as possible.

52

What "Rules" Did The Elders In Your KH Make?

by minimus in

jw
friends

some congregations were known as liberal and others were considered very conservative.

back in the 1970s a nearby congregation made all speakers who gave public talks a white shirt to wear.

if a speaker came in wearing anything but white they were brought into the library and were given a white shirt!

undercover

Hah! What rules didn't they make would be a shorter list.

From movies to music to cars to clothes to hair to where you were allowed to sit in a KH, they covered it all.

A couple of notables: no necklaces or bracelets for brothers. Gay men wear them, thus, it was wrong (no one ever asked about pirates). I used to give a pioneer sister a ride home from service. She had to ride in the back seat. The age difference wasn't insurmountable, but she was...

20

How many JWs would Disassociate if their were no family sanctions?

by Chook in

i think the swamp would empty overnight .

undercover

I think it was Farkel that once said that if DFing/DAing and shunning were not part of the make up of the JW religion, there would be no exJW forums and groups.

There would be no reason to bemoan our fate at having learned the truth about 'the truth'. There would only be minor, if any, debates or arguments with family still attending. We'd just drift away, no different than people who drift away from the Baptist church they grew up in.

28

Have You Ever Found Yourself Really Not Liking Someone Here?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i've been on this board for years.

99% of the posters here i do not personally know.

a few, maybe not so much...lol..... do posters here get you upset to the point that you really don't like them?

undercover

There once was a red dot

Who asked questions a lot

Mostly likable he could be

For those who chose to see

His opinion mattered not

22

Jehovah's Witnesses denial of what they are supposed to believe from Watchtower

by jambon1 in

jw
friends

one of the most frustrating things.

when you confront jw's about what they believe they will often deny it.

such as "if your child is disfellowshipped then you can't have contact with them ever again".

undercover

They're actually embarrassed by their own beliefs, so much so that most will deny or water them down.

Cognitive dissonance: psychological conflict resulting from incongruous beliefs and attitudes held simultaneously

5

Armenia’s Jehovah’s Witnesses: ‘enemies of the state’

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

tp://oc-media.org/armenias-jehovahs-witnesses-enemies-of-the-state/.

http://oc-media.org/armenias-jehovahs-witnesses-enemies-of-the-state/.

armenia’s jehovah’s witnesses: ‘enemies of the state’.

undercover

While I abhor religious (among other kinds of) intolerance, I find it hard to sympathize with this:

After she decided to join the Jehovah’s Witnesses, her life changed.
When Kristine’s in-laws found out that she had embraced a new faith, they first tried to convince her to abandon it. Later, they stopped visiting her family home.

That reads like it's right out of the WTS playbook. If you leave our faith, we will shun you. Wait until you raise your kid, and he leaves the JWs. You gonna treat him just like you were treated?