Not_Culty
JoinedPosts by Not_Culty
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Double post
by Not_Culty indouble post .
sorry.
https://cronicaglobal.elespanol.com/vida/multan-testigos-jehova-robar-datos-medicos-pacientes_221865_102.html.
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Ministers are called for consultation regarding Jehovah’s Witness revelations
by Not_Culty inhttps://avoidjw.org/en/news/ministers-are-called-for-consultation-regarding-jehovahs-witness-revelations/.
the jehovah’s witnesses branch office in holbæk does not want to be interviewed, but states that in some cases they go to the authorities.. the recognized religious community of jehovah’s witnesses has an internal set of rules where religious leaders can judge on everything from smoking to killing.. this is according to a secret manual for the elders – religious leaders of jehovah’s witnesses – that tv 2 has in its possession.. precisely that fact is a testament that this is a parallel legal community, one of denmark’s leading experts in religious law believes.. and now the social democrats are calling the responsible ministers for consultation:.
– for us, it is subordinate to what god you believe in.
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Ministers are called for consultation regarding Jehovah’s Witness revelations
by Not_Culty inhttps://avoidjw.org/en/news/ministers-are-called-for-consultation-regarding-jehovahs-witness-revelations/.
the jehovah’s witnesses branch office in holbæk does not want to be interviewed, but states that in some cases they go to the authorities.. the recognized religious community of jehovah’s witnesses has an internal set of rules where religious leaders can judge on everything from smoking to killing.. this is according to a secret manual for the elders – religious leaders of jehovah’s witnesses – that tv 2 has in its possession.. precisely that fact is a testament that this is a parallel legal community, one of denmark’s leading experts in religious law believes.. and now the social democrats are calling the responsible ministers for consultation:.
– for us, it is subordinate to what god you believe in.
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Not_Culty
https://avoidjw.org/en/news/ministers-are-called-for-consultation-regarding-jehovahs-witness-revelations/
The Jehovah’s Witnesses branch office in Holbæk does not want to be interviewed, but states that in some cases they go to the authorities.
The recognized religious community of Jehovah’s Witnesses has an internal set of rules where religious leaders can judge on everything from smoking to killing.
This is according to a secret manual for the elders – religious leaders of Jehovah’s Witnesses – that TV 2 has in its possession.
Precisely that fact is a testament that this is a parallel legal community, one of Denmark’s leading experts in religious law believes.
And now the Social Democrats are calling the responsible ministers for consultation:
– For us, it is subordinate to what god you believe in. You must comply with the law and we refuse to accept that children and young people should grow up in social control.
– And therefore, we want the ministers to explain what they are going to do to prevent this phenomenon of a parallel legal system from occurring. And it is both the Minister of the Interior and the Minister for Religious Affairs who must be on the field and who we will convene for consultation on this. It is so vital that we stop it, and when we have a suspicion that something so wrong is happening, we must take political action, says lawyer Trine Bramsen (S).
“You must comply with the law and we refuse to accept that children and young people should grow up in social control”
Trine Bramsen, legal counsel (S).Trine Bramsen emphasizes that the politicians must check whether the supervisors are operating as they should be, and whether the authorities have the right tools.
The Minister for Economic and Home Affairs is Simon Emil Ammitzbøll-Bille (LA), and Minister of Culture and Religious Affairs is Mette Bock (LA).
Expert: This is a parallel society
According to the elder’s handbook, once it has been proven the rules have been breached, they set up a judicial committee, which ultimately could mean exclusion for a member from the congregation. This may result in the member’s friends and family severing all contact with the outcast.
Exclusion – or disfellowshipping, as Jehovah’s Witnesses themselves refer to it – must be seen as an expression of love, according to the organization’s own magazine “Watchtower”:
One of Denmark’s leading experts on religious law, Lisbet Christoffersen, professor at Roskilde University, believes that this judicial system is at odds with the individual’s religious freedoms.
“It is not recognizing the individual’s religious freedom”
Lisbet Christoffersen, professor at Roskilde University.– Not only for the religious community, but also for the family and all members, one vanishes into thin air. You become non-existent. It is not recognizing the individual’s religious freedom, she says.
Lisbeth Christoffersen believes that in general, there is a parallel legal community, which can be problematic for several reasons.
When one expresses their religious freedom within the religious group, the problem here is that they are taking on a general legislative approach that they should not have, she says.
Lawyer Trine Torp also believes that, like the Social Democratic Party, there is a lack of attention in relation to social coercion and crime within religious communities.
“They must know that, for example, they are required to use the public legal system for offenses”
Tine Torp, lawyer (Religious Freedom).– This is about ensuring that the authorities are fully aware of what is happening in these societies. And especially if there are children who are part of these societies.
– One is the moral standards they hold that I think are extreme and dissociate, but what is vital is that they must know that, for example, with regard to offenses, they are required to use the public legal system, says Trine Torp, legal counsel for religious freedom.
Jehovah’s Witnesses would not interview
Jehovah’s Witnesses branch office in Holbæk did not want to be interviewed, but wrote in an email that the elders, for example, always go to the authorities in Denmark when it comes to child abuse.
– It is … dishonest to confuse the secular authorities’ investigation of a crime with the congregation’s internal judicial system. We do not interfere in the secular authorities’ investigation of a case.
According to the Branch Office, since 2003, Jehovah’s Witnesses in Denmark have advised the elders that all child abuse charges must be reported to the authorities.
– We have done this consistently, and if appropriate, we can provide documents to the authorities.
The branch office further writes that if a person is accused of child abuse, the elders will investigate in harmony with the Bible’s guidance.
If you ask Trine Bramsen, however, it is not a defense that they also comply with Danish legislation:
– We have one legal system in Denmark, and that is what applies. We do not permit parallel penalties. Therefore, we must make sure to fight it, and then I think it is very serious when children and young people grow up in social control and cannot live the life they want, she says.
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Denmark - a wave against JW policy on national TV and web
by Not_Culty inhttps://old.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/apr7fh/denmark_is_on_fire_a_massive_wave_against_jw/.
post below.
" a wave of exjw-stories have hit national news in denmark this week.
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Not_Culty
Norwegian media, today another exjw tells her story. No paywall, so you can try to google translate: The story is number 1 on "today's most read" on the website.
https://www.dagsavisen.no/innenriks/marit-brot-med-jehovas-vitner-som-18-aring-na-har-hun-en-melding-til-sosialarbeidere-1.1278409
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Denmark - a wave against JW policy on national TV and web
by Not_Culty inhttps://old.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/apr7fh/denmark_is_on_fire_a_massive_wave_against_jw/.
post below.
" a wave of exjw-stories have hit national news in denmark this week.
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Not_Culty
Story 3
Elders in Jehovah's Witnesses suspected child abuse - did not go to the police
Feb 12 2019, 05:44 Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share by email
'Elder' avoided going to the police, although Lotus Lucca told about 1:08
Ministers are called in consultation with Jehovah's revelations
Jehovah's Witness Expert: It's an invisible prison by Jonas HR Moestrup
Police and expert believe that the eldest in Jehovah's Witnesses was required to go to the authorities with their knowledge.
Lotus Luca from Næstved was 14 years old when one day she came home and told her mother that she had been subjected to an assault.
According to Lotus Luca, she had been forced to have oral sex with a young man.
ALSO SEE Abandoned by his children - they believe God will kill her in a great war
The mother contacted one of the so-called 'elders' in the Witnesses' congregation in which the family was affiliated. 'Elder' is the religious leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses. A meeting was arranged where Lotus Luca told the eldest what had happened.
According to Lotus Luca, who is now 19 years old, there was a man from another congregation in Jehovah's Witnesses who attacked her in 2014.
A case that, according to Jehovah's Witnesses handbook, is serious and must be dealt with by the elders for the possible exclusion of the offender. Therefore, Lotus Luca and her mother went to an elder.
ALSO SEE Former Jehovah's Witnesses were to oversee others: - As if I were part of the police
- As Jehovah's Witnesses, we learn that when something happens, we go to the elders if there is a problem. And we don't mix the authorities into it, says Lotus Luca.
She remembers that she told the elders about the assault, but that no more happened after the meeting.
Not informed the police The eldest who attended the meeting confirmed that Lotus Luca told him there was an assault.
TV 2 has been in contact with him, but he does not want to participate in an interview. He refers to the Jehovah's Witnesses Scandinavian branch office in Holbæk.
ALSO SEE Hear the meeting with religious leaders who 'judge' Jehovah's Witnesses for having a boyfriend
In a mail, the office of TV 2 writes that since 2003, Jehovah's Witnesses in Denmark have consistently "advised the elders that all child abuse charges should be reported to the authorities".
But insights into Lotus Lucas documents with the municipality and the police show that no notification of violations to relevant authorities has been filed in her case.
Crime must be investigated by the police At South Zealand and Lolland-Falsters Police, police inspector Kim Kliver believes that it is completely unacceptable that the elders did not immediately go to the police.
If a person tells some adults that they have been subjected to an assault, then - no matter how closed an environment you are in - you must understand the seriousness of such a crime and have it reported to the police. Crime must be investigated by the police, he says to TV 2.
ALSO SEE Secret Jehovah's Book: Religious Advice Should Judge in Drug and Sex Before Marriage
Kim Kliver emphasizes that all suspicions of such crimes must be transferred to the police:
- According to the Administration of Justice Act, it is the police and only the police that can investigate such cases, and if you have a suspicion, you must give it to the police, who will probably have to use the energy needed to determine whether it is a real crime.
Didn't think about reporting it yourself Lotus Luca tells TV 2 that the elder asked about what relationship she had with the young man. She said they had written messages to each other and that it was their first meeting when the assault took place.
- He (the oldest, ed.) Asked why I had done it and why I didn't say no. I felt very much that it was my own fault, says Lotus Luca.
Did you even talk about going to the police?
ALSO SEE Chat: Ann Celina was expelled by Jehovah's Witnesses to have a boyfriend
- The police did not speak at any time. I don't even think it was something we were considering.
Did you ask yourself not to report it?
"I remember not giving it a thought at all that the police could get involved in this," she says.
Professor: There should have been reaction One of Denmark's leading experts in religious law and professor at Roskilde University, Lisbet Christoffersen, is completely in line with the police. She refers to the duty of notification of the service law.
- The whole idea of the notification duty is that one has a special responsibility for caring for those who have come to one, she says.
Lisbeth Christoffersen does not believe that this will change anything about whether Lotus Luca himself had chosen to go to the police.
"We are talking about a person who was under the age of sexuality and who informs some leaders of the religious community who have a duty to inform the authorities that there has been an assault on her - that should have been responded to," she says. .
ALSO SEE "Parallel jurisdiction" in Jehovah's Witnesses on the verge of religious freedom, expert said
When Lotus Luca today looks back on the process, she is sorry that the authorities were not involved.
- Things could have looked very different. I might have been given some mental help to get it worked, so I shouldn't go with this guilty feeling all those years. It still pops up occasionally, she says.
Lotus Luca is no longer part of Jehovah's Witnesses today.
Jehovah's Witnesses: If we've done wrong, we take care of it In a mail to TV 2, Jehovah's Witnesses Scandinavian branch office in Holbæk writes that the organization apologizes if any former members of Jehovah's Witnesses believe that abuses have not been reported to the authorities.
- If so, we apologize. However, we will mention that the victims can still report this to the authorities. If the authorities then come to the conclusion that we have acted incorrectly, we will naturally take care of it. As an organization we are constantly looking to do better, it says in the mail.
TV 2 would like to ask additional questions to Jehovah's Witnesses, but the organization does not want to interview.
TV 2 has been in contact with the young man whom Lotus Luca claims forced her for oral sex. He explains that he has a different perception of the course, but he does not want to elaborate further. The man says that he was subsequently called to meet with the elders, but he does not want to tell what came out of the meeting.
TV 2 is aware of a case where a person who was not a member of Jehovah's Witnesses asked for guidance from an elder and told him that he had been abused. In that case, the person was advised to go to the police.
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[–]theart_of_psoas 1 point 7 hours ago*
Story 4
Former Jehovah's Witnesses were to oversee others: - As if I were part of the police
Feb 10 2019, 15:01 Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share by email
He was vigilant for Jehovah's Witnesses at 0:31
Ministers are called in consultation with Jehovah's revelations by Jonas HR Moestrup
A large number of former Jehovah's Witnesses say they were overseen by other members.
The Religious Organization of Jehovah's Witnesses monitors its members to oversee whether they violate the organization's internal rules.
This is the criticism of David Maagaard, who as a former Witness servant in Jehovah's Witnesses, told how the ward leaders in closed meetings instructed in the surveillance.
ALSO SEE Jehovah's Witnesses used to hide from women - asked for her sex life
- It seemed as though I was part of a police force where you had to walk and patrol the members' doings and burden, he says to TV 2.
The chairman of faith, an association of people who have come out of a religious community, Simon Ørregaard, is also formerly Jehovah's Witness and recognizes what David Maagaard tells.
"You are guided to go to the elders (religious leaders in Jehovah's Witnesses, ed.), If you see anything," he says.
"Go to the elders if we realize that serious sins have been committed"
Text from Jehovah's Witnesses
WHO ARE JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES?
Founded in the United States in 1881 It originates from Christianity, but follows its own Bible translation Believe that God's name is Jehovah Congregations do not meet in churches, but so-called Kingdom Halls Baptism takes place only after years of training and indicates that the baptized will serve Jehovah and the congregation Has, according to its own figures, over eight million members worldwide. In Denmark there are almost 15,000 Managed by a Governing Body based in New York, USA Exclusion happens if a member does not regret a serious violation of the rules of religion. Family members are encouraged not to have contact with the excluded. Source: JW.org
Fold out Would watch for any smoke cigarettes In a survey conducted by TV 2 in several closed groups on the Internet for former Witnesses, 64 percent of the 105 participants write that in their time in the organization, they have been overseen by other active ones.
One of those who have felt monitored is 25-year-old Ann Celina, who on TV 2 Sunday says she was extradited on the basis of a private conversation that was recorded and passed on to the ward leadership.
ALSO SEE Hear the meeting with religious leaders who 'judge' Jehovah's Witnesses for having a boyfriend
David Maagaard is not surprised that so many former Witnesses have been monitored. He says he himself has been supervised, just as he has been asked to monitor others.
As a parish servant, he was a kind of assistant to the ward leaders, the so-called elders. At the first closed meeting with the elders council, where the rest of the congregation was not present, he was surprised at the rhetoric because he experienced that the elders set out clear guidelines for ward servants to keep an eye on members.
- At the regular Kingdom Hall meetings (Jehovah's Witnesses' Assembly Houses, ed.), Where the regular members came, it was often wrapped in Bible quotes and more embracing descriptions. But when we came in to these meetings, it became much more concrete, says David Maagaard, who left Jehovah's Witnesses in 2011.
The parish servants, according to David Maagaard, should, among other things, observe whether members had overnight guests of the opposite sex and whether people were smoking cigarettes.
He compares the role of ward service to being part of a police force - he believed the task was to assist the ward in religious activities.
- You were the elders watchdog. If one discovered something, one should set a good example to Jehovah's Witnesses and show that one was loyal and faithful to the whole organization and structure. This was usually done by working with the elders around what the different members of the congregation were doing, says David Maagaard.
WHAT MUST JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES NOT?
Jehovah's Witnesses must adhere to a wide range of rules. For example, they may not:
Celebrate holidays like birthdays and Christmas Have sex before marriage Be unfaithful Grow oral and anal sex Accept blood transfusion for treatments Get an abortion Smoky tobacco Play gambling Get drunk Fold out Shepherds for God's sheep The chairman of the association Eftertro Simon Ørregaard, who is also the chairman of the Atheist Society, does not have the experience that the monitoring in Jehovah's Witnesses is put into system by the organization.
But he says that Jehovah's Witnesses from childhood are brought to each other to the elders if anyone does something wrong.
- It's an angler community. If you know someone has done something wrong, confront it with it and say, "If you don't go to the elders, I'll do it". You make sure yourself go to the elders because it is sinful to leave, he says.
Examples of members being called upon to enter each other can be found in, among other things, the Witness Watchtower, Jehovah's Witnesses, says Simon Ørregaard:
"An important way we can also work together is to preserve the moral and spiritual purity of the congregation, both by our own conduct and by going to the elders, if we realize that serious sins have been committed," in a 1992 edition.
- Jehovah's Witnesses use the term "shepherds" for the elders and "get" for their members. It is thus the elders who have to guard the flock, and here is one of the functions to keep an eye on others. The elders come to visit people they think they need guidance, says Simon Ørregaard.
Jehovah's Witnesses reject the monitoring of members According to the internal rules of Jehovah's Witnesses, there must be at least two independent witnesses before a judge of elders can decide on an offense.
For example, it means that sex before marriage must be attended by two witnesses before it can become a case. A fact that, according to David Maagaard, is central to understanding why Jehovah's Witnesses can monitor their members.
"If there are no witnesses and they cannot get a concession from the one who made the offense, then they have no case," he says.
The headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses in Denmark have declined to interview TV 2, but in an e-mail they write that they "do not monitor members of the ward".
However, this answer does not give David Maagaard much to:
- That's not true. You are trained to have to enter and stick each other.
David Maagaard says that he has never mentioned anyone to the elders himself. In cases where he has experienced members violating the rules, he has made personal contact with the persons.
- I got into it, but I didn't like being in it. I don't think I'm the only one who's had this, he says.
Several types of sanctions The strictest sanction in Jehovah's Witnesses is exclusion where the congregation and the family are encouraged not to have contact with the excluded.
According to a special manual for the elders, not all violations leading to exclusion - other forms of discipline such as public prosecution and reprimand in the ward or deprivation of duty also occur.
Rejects the offender and can convince the elders that he or she will try to change his life so that it is again within the rules, he or she will eventually be resumed after exclusion.
Jehovah's Witnesses Scandinavian branch office in Holbæk has not wanted to participate in this article.
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[–]theart_of_psoas 1 point 7 hours ago*
Story 6
POLICY
Ministers are called in consultation with Jehovah's revelations Feb. 11 2019, 16:32
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Ministers are called in consultation after Jehovah's revelations 0:49
Danny Sjøberg calls on the politicians to pull on the work clothes by Jonas HR Moestrup & Kasper B. Andreasen
The Jehovah's Witnesses branch office in Holbæk does not want to interview, but states that in some cases they go to the authorities.
The recognized religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses has an internal set of rules where religious leaders can judge in everything from smoking to killing.
It appears from a secret manual for the elders - religious leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses - that TV 2 holds.
ALSO SEE "Parallel jurisdiction" in Jehovah's Witnesses on the verge of religious freedom, expert said
Precisely that fact testifies to the fact that this is a parallel legal community, one of Denmark's leading experts in religious law believes .
And it now gets the Social Democracy to call the responsible ministers in consultation:
For us, it is subordinate to what god you believe in. You must comply with the law and we refuse to accept that children and young people grow up in social control.
And therefore we want the ministers to explain what they are doing to prevent this phenomenon of a parallel legal system from occurring. And it is both the Minister of the Interior and the Minister of the Church who are to be on the field and who we will convene in a consultation on this. It is so crucial that we stop it, and when we have a suspicion that something is happening so wrong, we must step in from the political team, says legal spokesman Trine Bramsen (S).
You must comply with the law and we refuse to accept that children and young people grow up in social control
Trine Bramsen, legal representative (S). Trine Bramsen emphasizes that one must check from the political side whether the supervisors work as they should and whether the authorities have the right tools.
The Minister for Economic and Home Affairs is Simon Emil Ammitzbøll-Bille (LA), and Minister of Culture and Church Affairs is Mette Bock (LA).
Expert: This is a parallel society According to the handbook , the elders at proven offenses must set up a convicting committee which may ultimately mean exclusion of a member of the congregation. This may cause the member's friends and family not to have contact with the excluded.
Exclusion - or exclusion, which Jehovah's Witnesses themselves refer to it - must be seen as an expression of love, according to the organization's own magazine "Watchtower ":
One of Denmark's leading experts in religious law Lisbet Christoffersen, professor at Roskilde University, believes that it is at odds with the individual religious freedom.
After all, it is not an acknowledgment of individual religious freedom
Lisbet Christoffersen, Professor Roskilde University. - Not only for the religious community, but also for the family and all members, it is simply excluded air. You become non-existent. It is not an acknowledgment of individual religious freedom, she says.
Lisbeth Christoffersen believes that there is generally a parallel legal community, which can be problematic for several reasons.
ALSO SEE Secret Jehovah's Book: Religious Advice Should Judge in Drug and Sex Before Marriage
"The challenge is when what lies in the religious community is an expression of freedom of religion, and when it expresses that one is taking on a general legislative competence that one should not have," she says.
SF also believes that, like the Social Democratic Party, there is a lack of attention in relation to social coercion and crime in religious communities.
They must know that, for example, they are obliged to use the public legal system for offenses
Trine Torp, legal spokesman (SF). - This is very much about the fact that the authorities must be aware of what is happening in these societies. And especially if there are children who are part of these societies.
- One is what they have of moral standards that I think are extreme and dissociate, but what is crucial is that they must know that, for example, in offenses, they are required to use the public legal system, says Trine Torp, legal spokesman at SF.
Jehovah's Witnesses will not interview Jehovah's Witnesses branch office in Holbæk does not want to interview, but writes in an e-mail that the elders, for example, always go to the authorities in Denmark when it comes to child abuse.
- It seems ... unfit to blend the authorities' investigation with the ward's internal exclusion treatment of a charge. We do not interfere in the authorities' treatment of a charge.
ALSO SEE Hear the meeting with religious leaders who 'judge' Jehovah's Witnesses for having a boyfriend
According to the office, since 2003, Jehovah's Witnesses in Denmark have advised the elders that all child abuse charges must be reported to the authorities.
- We have done this consistently, and we can document this to the authorities.
The office further writes that if a person is accused of child abuse, the elders will conduct a study in harmony with the Bible's guidance.
If you ask Trine Bramsen, however, it is not a defense that they also comply with Danish legislation:
- We have one legal system in Denmark, and that is what applies. We do not have all possible parallel penalties. Therefore, we must make sure to fight it, and then I think it is very serious when children and young people grow up in social control and cannot live the life they want, she says.
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[–]theart_of_psoas 1 point 7 hours ago*
Story 7
"Parallel jurisdiction" in Jehovah's Witnesses on the verge of religious freedom, expert said
Feb. 11 2019, 14:33 Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share by email
Jehovah's Witness Expert: It's an invisible prison
Ministers are called in consultation with Jehovah's revelations by Jonas HR Moestrup
The recognized religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses has an internal set of rules where religious leaders can judge in everything from smoking to killing.
In Denmark, there are 173 congregations in Jehovah's Witnesses, each led by a religious council - a so-called elders' council.
The councils consist of up to 12 elders - religious leaders of Jehovah's Witnesses - who, according to a secret manual, must judge by a set of rules based on biblical sources.
ALSO SEE Former Jehovah's Witnesses were to oversee others: - As if I were part of the police
The types of offenses include smoking, sex before marriage, killing and sexual abuse of children. Violations that the elders according to the manual should investigate and judge if there is the right evidence. The hardest sanction is exclusion of the congregation.
The elders' councils are, according to several former Witnesses, to whom TV 2 has spoken, more significant for many members than the Danish authorities.
One of Denmark's leading experts in religious law Lisbet Christoffersen, professor at Roskilde University, believes that this is a parallel legal community, which can be problematic for several reasons.
"The challenge is when what lies in the religious community is an expression of freedom of religion, and when it expresses that one is taking on a general legislative competence that one should not have," she says.
WHO ARE JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES?
Founded in the United States in 1881 It originates from Christianity, but follows its own Bible translation Believe that God's name is Jehovah Congregations do not meet in churches, but so-called Kingdom Halls Baptism takes place only after years of training and indicates that the baptized will serve Jehovah and the congregation Has, according to its own figures, over eight million members worldwide. In Denmark there are almost 15,000 Managed by a Governing Body based in New York, USA Exclusion happens if a member does not regret a serious violation of the rules of religion. Family members are encouraged not to have contact with the excluded. Source: JW . org
Fold out Professor: On the verge of religious freedom According to the handbook, the elders at proven offenses must set up a convicting committee which may ultimately mean exclusion of a member of the congregation. This may cause the member's friends and family not to have contact with the excluded.
Exclusion - or exclusion, which Jehovah's Witnesses themselves refer to it - must be seen as an expression of love, according to the organization's own magazine "Watchtower ":
- Family members can show their love for the congregation and for the offender by respecting the exclusion, it says.
ALSO SEE Hear the meeting with religious leaders who 'judge' Jehovah's Witnesses for having a boyfriend
Precisely this finds Lisbet Christoffersen problematic because she believes it is at odds with the individual freedom of religion.
Not only for the religious community, but also for the family and all members, it is simply excluded air. You become non-existent. It is not an acknowledgment of individual religious freedom, she says.
An invisible prison Development Manager at Kristeligt Dagblad and Ph.D. in sociology of religion, Morten Thomsen Højsgaard, has in-depth knowledge of Jehovah's Witnesses. He is concerned that many members of Jehovah's Witnesses regard the councils of elders as important authorities.
In a Danish context, there is no validity in what is stated in an old book - here it is the Danish criminal law that applies. But for those who have grown up to follow Jehovah's recommendations, then in practice, it is just as important - almost larger - than current Danish law. Therefore, it becomes a parallel society, he says.
ALSO SEE Jehovah's Witnesses used to hide from women - asked for her sex life
A parallel society that creates a form of social prison, he believes.
- There is no coercion with Jehovah's Witnesses, neither violence nor militarism. They all look like decent and decent citizens. But it is an invisible prison understood in the way that if you break the rules in the handbook, people break together and break completely, says Morten Thomsen Højsgaard.
Jehovah's Witnesses: - We do not interfere with the government's treatment Another problem is, according to Lisbet Christoffersen, that, according to the handbook, the elders must handle cases that are also punishable under Danish criminal law.
- If it is about criminal offenses, then it is the task of the police and the courts. It should not be some internal justice. It is a problem we have discussed in relation to all the child cases (pedophilia cases) in the Catholic Church worldwide, and it is just as relevant to Jehovah's Witnesses, she says.
There have been several cases of abuse of children in Jehovah's Witnesses abroad, which have never been passed on to the authorities, inter alia because of the internal rules.
For example, in Australia, a major study found that over a number of years, Jehovah's Witnesses had suspected a total of 1005 children for child sexual abuse without informing the police.
In the United States, Jehovah's Witnesses have been sentenced to pay large sums of money to victims of assault because the organization did not pass on to the suspected authorities.
Jehovah's Witnesses branch office in Holbæk does not want to interview, but writes in an e-mail that the elders in cases of child abuse always go to the authorities in Denmark.
"It seems ... unfit to blend the authorities 'investigation with the ward's internal exclusion treatment of a charge. We do not interfere with the authorities' treatment of an accusation."
According to the office, since 2003, Jehovah's Witnesses in Denmark have advised the elders that all child abuse charges must be reported to the authorities.
"We have done this consistently, and we can document that to the authorities if necessary."
The office further writes that if a person is accused of child abuse, the elders will conduct a study in harmony with the Bible's guidance.
"The elders follow a religiously reasoned procedure whose sole purpose is to take a stand on the accused's membership of Jehovah's Witnesses."
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Denmark - a wave against JW policy on national TV and web
by Not_Culty inhttps://old.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/apr7fh/denmark_is_on_fire_a_massive_wave_against_jw/.
post below.
" a wave of exjw-stories have hit national news in denmark this week.
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Not_Culty
Google translations ~
Story 1
Jehovah's Witnesses used to hide from women - asked for her sex life
Feb 10 2019, 6:00 pm Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share by email
Religious leaders used a hidden incarnation against former Jehovah's Witnesses 1:24
Religious leaders used a hidden incarnation against former Witnesses
'Elder' avoided going to the police, although Lotus Lucca told about assault
Ministers are called in consultation with Jehovah's revelations by Jonas HR Moestrup
Religious leaders used a hidden recording against Ann Celina to expel her to have a girlfriend. Now she has no contact with her family.
Never has Ann Celina felt so offended in her life as when she was facing three men who asked for her intimate privacy.
- We are here because I have access to such a recording and have listened to it, said one of the men.
Like the other two men, he was a so-called elder - a leading member of the Witnesses in Jehovah's Witnesses, Ann Celina was affiliated with.
- It shows that you have got a new girlfriend, continued the man.
She only knew the men superficially. Yet she was now sitting with them and had to answer questions about her private and sex life on the basis of a secret recording she didn't know existed.
Ann Celina chose to record the meeting with the elders, and TV 2 can therefore document what was said .
WHO ARE THE 'ELDERS'?
"Jehovah has entrusted elders with the responsibility of taking care of his precious sheep."
Here's how the elders 'role is briefly described in Jehovah's Witnesses' internal handbook to elders called "Be Shepherds for God's flock."
Each ward has an elderly council with several elders attached. They are leaders of the congregation and guide Jehovah's Witnesses in all aspects of life for members to follow God's instructions. Only men can be appointed as elders.
The elders set up "legal" councils to investigate and judge in everything from smoking to adultery and murder.
Source: Internal manual for elders "Be shepherds for the flock of God"
Fold out Woman took private conversation and gave it to elders
Ann Celina is 25 years old and born into Jehovah's Witnesses. At the age of 18, she was married to another member of Jehovah's Witnesses, but in 2016, the marriage broke down.
She began to see a man who was not a member of Jehovah's Witnesses, and she slowly opened her eyes to the world outside of Jehovah's Witnesses, who did not feel as dangerous as she had been raised to believe.
As a member of Jehovah's Witnesses, Ann Celina knew that, according to the internal rules of the faith community, she should not have a relationship with an "outside the walls". That she risked major consequences if it was discovered.
One day Ann Celina met a woman with family relationships with her ex-husband. They were at a café in Aarhus, and Ann Celina told about the new guy she had met. She told her about their sex life.
What Ann Celina didn't know was that the woman recorded the entire conversation and sent the audio file to the elders of the congregation.
- Three men decide if I can see my family again 1:08
As an excluded member of Jehovah's Witness, Ann Celina has no way of contacting her family. Admission was shared illegally A few months later, Ann Celina was called and called for a so-called committee meeting with the three elders. Here she was to account for the conversation the woman had recorded.
The elders told them that they had listened to the conversation and began to ask for the details of it. Among other things, it was about how the new girlfriend looked and how good he was in bed.
- I just think it was so disgusting to have to talk about something like that with three men you don't even know, Ann Celina says today.
Ann Celina felt that Jehovah's Witnesses had watched her. The oldest used information from a private conversation, and now they would expel her - a punishment that meant she could no longer see her mother, father and little sister.
- To sit and be asked for very private things from three who have been listening to that you have been told about your private things. It is simply degrading and very offensive, she says.
Later, Ann Celina got the court's word that the woman's sharing of her admission was illegal because it contained private information.
- I can't possibly be the only one Just before Ann Celina entered the meeting with the elders, she chose to turn on the sound recorder on her mobile phone. She recorded the entire meeting, which took just under an hour - a recording that TV 2 extracts from .
She had several reasons to do so, but first and foremost she wanted the public's insight into the practice of Jehovah's Witnesses.
- People need to know what's going on. How it goes, what it is for some things behind these walls. Only the four people sitting at the meeting know what is happening. If I have been monitored and something is being used illegally against me, then I cannot possibly be the only one, Ann Celina says about the reason she took up the meeting.
ALSO SEE Hear the meeting with religious leaders who 'judge' Jehovah's Witnesses for having a boyfriend
Does not see his mother, father and little sister The elders sentenced Ann Celina to exclusion because she would not give up her new life outside of Jehovah's Witnesses.
- Unfortunately, we have not been able to see other possibilities than to exclude you as the situation is. We have not been able to find the change of mind that you really wanted to find. In order for us to do so, just as you regret what you have done and wish and change it, the explanation of the verdict, which can be heard on Ann Celinas' inclusion of the meeting .
April 6, 2017, the decision was announced to the congregation. This means, according to the internal rules of Jehovah's Witnesses, that members may risk being evicted if they contact Ann Celina.
Since then she has not seen her mother, father and little sister.
She is not angry with her parents because she knows their world view - that it is against the rules of Jehovah's Witnesses to see his outcast family members.
- On a bad day, I am really sorry that they have chosen their daughter for a religion. But on a good day when my reason speaks, then I think that they do what they have learned is right. Therefore, it is difficult for me to get angry with them, she says
Jehovah's Witnesses will not interview TV 2 has talked to two of the elders who sentenced Ann Celina to exclusion, but they do not want to interview.
Nor does the Scandinavian branch office of Jehovah's Witnesses want to make an interview. In a mail they write that they "do not monitor members of the congregation".
Ann Celina lives today in Aarhus with her boyfriend and loves her new life. She has no doubt that she made the right choice by leaving Jehovah's Witnesses.
- I suddenly became a completely different person - could feel myself and be able to think for myself. I hope that one day my family will have the same experience, she says.
For the sake of her family, Ann Celina does not want her last name mentioned. The editors are familiar with her full name.
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Story 2
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COMMUNITY
Abandoned by his children - they believe God will kill her in a great war Feb. 11 2019, 12:36 by Jonas HR Moestrup She raised her children to reject apostates. Now she herself is apostate and struggles for the children to accept her choice.
Maria Alexander sat opposite her two youngest children at the dining table and was supposed to eat dinner.
In what she was about to take the first bite, her 13-year-old son broke in.
May we pray for prayer?
You may like it, but I don't want to be there, replied Maria Alexander.
"But mother, why don't you think of God anymore?" Asked her 11-year-old daughter.
A few months earlier, Maria Alexander had made a choice that her children had difficulty accepting. Time and again they brought it up when they were with their mother. She no longer wanted to follow God's word.
- That means you are going to die. You are going to die in Armageddon, said the son.
This is how Maria Alexander remembers the dialogue about the dining table a spring day in 2015.
It wasn't the cozy night she had hoped for. It ended in a quarrel and she broke down. She called her children brainwashed. Tried to get them to understand the world as she saw it now.
Shortly after, the children were taken by their father. A year passed before Maria Alexander saw them again.
Although this can be very difficult, we must avoid having unnecessary contact with an excluded family member
Text published by Jehovah's Witnesses
Maria Alexander Photo: Kaare Breiner / TV 2 Maria Alexander is 47 years old. She spent the first 43 years of her life in the worldwide religious organization of Jehovah's Witnesses.
This is Maria Alexander's story, which she remembers her life before, during and after the break with Jehovah's Witnesses.
The fear of God's wrath
As a daughter of a so-called elder, a leading member of the congregation, Maria Alexander grew up in a home in Ishøj, which she herself describes as safe and good. But her life was not like most other peers.
WHO ARE THE 'ELDERS'? "Jehovah has entrusted elders with the responsibility of taking care of his precious sheep."
Here's how the elders 'role is briefly described in Jehovah's Witnesses' internal handbook to elders called "Be Shepherds for God's flock."
Each ward has an elderly council with several elders attached. They are leaders of the congregation and guide Jehovah's Witnesses in all aspects of life for members to follow God's instructions. Only men can be appointed as elders.
The elders set up "legal" councils to investigate and judge in everything from smoking to adultery and murder.
Source: Internal manual for elders "Be shepherds for the flock of God"
Fold out As a child, she did not have to have classmates home to play, unless the comrades first attended Bible studies.
The older she became, the more filled the religion. When she came home from school, her spare time was mostly Bible studies, volunteer work and congregation meetings.
Birthdays, Christmas, and many other festivals were outraged, and Jehovah's Witnesses greatly controlled what movies, books, and other entertainment she needed to spend time on.
Paradise is for Jehovah's Witnesses the ultimate goal. Here there is no war and animals and people live in harmony with each other. Photo: JW.org Maria Alexender regarded her non-believing classmates as poor. Without the right faith, they would not come into paradise and live an eternal life. She was convinced of that.
Even though she was most often happy, it was also an upbringing with a permanent conscience and guilt, for just a wrong thought or action led to a fear of God's punishment by both themselves and their families.
A punishment that would come in the Great War, Armageddon, which, according to Jehovah's Witnesses, will arise throughout the world, where God will kill all people who refuse to know the word of the Bible more wisely.
Maria Alexander never doubted - on a brief teenage age - on this world view.
New job became an eye-opener
At the age of 18, Maria Alexander was married to an ambitious man who quickly rose in the ranks of Jehovah's Witnesses. He became so-called ward servant and later elders. Together they had three children, and Maria Alexander was happy for the life she had.
She worked for the first many years in the cleaning industry, but in her mid-thirties she got a job in a municipality.
The colleagues at the new job were not part of Jehovah's Witnesses, and it became her first real meeting with the outside world in her adult life. She began to reflect on her own perception of the world.
Maria Alexander was a young strong believer in Jehovah's Witnesses. She spent much of her time in service - spreading the faith of Jehovah's Witnesses. Photo: Private The doubt came creeping. For how could it be that God would punish these sweet and good people? Kill them? It was not the merciful God she knew.
The years passed, and she became friends with more people outside of Jehovah's Witnesses. When she asked her husband or others in the ward, they could not give her a meaningful answer to how God could punish these people.
Doubt became paramount, but she knew what it could mean if she left her religion. She developed what she herself describes as panic disorder. Everything on her body struggled when she went to congregation meetings.
The words sounded hollow. They didn't fit with reality. It didn't make any sense anymore. But could she live with the consequences?
Story 2
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"Exclusion helps to protect the purity of the congregation"
Text from Jehovah's Witnesses
The conversation that changed everything A warm summer evening just over six years ago, Maria Alexander and her husband sat and enjoyed a glass of wine in their house in Faxe Ladeplads, while the kids were playing in their rooms.
She remembers trying to persuade her to come back to the congregation meetings she hadn't been to for months.
- I'm about to get my eyes on something wrong here. There is something wrong with this organization, said Maria Alexander.
WHO ARE JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES?
Founded in the United States in 1881 It originates from Christianity, but follows its own Bible translation Believe that God's name is Jehovah Congregations do not meet in churches, but so-called Kingdom Halls Baptism takes place only after years of training and indicates that the baptized will serve Jehovah and the congregation Has, according to its own figures, over eight million members worldwide. In Denmark there are almost 15,000 Managed by a Governing Body based in New York, USA Exclusion happens if a member does not regret a serious violation of the rules of religion. Family members are encouraged not to have contact with the excluded. Source: JW.org
Fold out Her husband thought she had become spiritually weak. That, by coming to the meetings, she could regain the love of Jehovah.
- You know what? I would like to know who you love most. Me or Jehovah, Maria Alexander asked.
She knew the answer well, but she would hear it from his own mouth. The answer was Jehovah.
"Then I want a divorce," she said.
This is how Maria Alexander remembers the conversation which became a turning point for her. She had made her decision. She would no longer be part of Jehovah's Witnesses .
Her eldest son distanced her from the moment he became aware of his mother's decision. Soon the rest of the family also began to turn her back.
But she was convinced that she could still have contact with her two youngest children.
Maria Alexander, a member of Jehovah's Witnesses, often attended a family meeting. Here with his daughter on the left. Photo: Private photo - Do you think I'm an evil mother? After the divorce in 2014, Maria Alexander moved for herself in a small house in Faxe Ladeplads - near the ex-husband's house, so she was close to her children.
She had clearly stated to the congregation that she was no longer part of Jehovah's Witnesses, yet they continued to seek her.
One day, her two youngest children came home to her after being with their father for seven days. They came dancing in the door and hugged their mother. Ten minutes later, it rang the door.
There were two habitually dressed men. Two elders from the congregation. They asked Maria Alexander to come back to the meetings. Warned her that she would not survive Armageddon.
She got angry and slammed the door. They should not interfere with her life, she thought. As she turned around, she saw her son crying. He had overheard the conversation with the elders and shook his body.
- Mom, that's what I've said. You're going to die at Armageddon, Maria Alexander remembers that he said.
[–]theart_of_psoas 2 points 7 hours ago*
Story 2
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Maria Alexander, 25, with her eldest son on his arm. Photo: Private She hugged him and said quietly:
Do you think I'm an evil mother?
No.
Do you think Jehovah will kill me?
No, but you don't believe in Jehovah anymore.
"If Jehovah exists, he won't kill me," said Mary Alexander.
The following two times, she got the children home, the elders came again. It stopped first when she threatened to call the police.
A few months later, a selection of elders sentenced her to exclusion for having been with another man.
She lost all contact with family and friends. But she was eager to keep in touch with her children.
"Family members can show their love for the congregation and for the offender by respecting the exclusion"
Text from Jehovah's Witnesses
Requires answers from the elders
After the evening at the dining table, which ended in quarrel, a year passed before she saw her children again. No one refused her directly to see them - it was their own choice.
According to her, the children could not accommodate that their mother had chosen religion from in favor of a life in the worldly world.
She sent them text messages almost every day, but most often no answer came. When that did, the children were not interested in talking to her. Sometimes they met, but it never became more.
Maria Alexander to raise her children to believe in Jehovah 0:54
Maria Alexander says that she herself has brought up her children so that they cannot have contact with excluded members. Video: Kim Hess It was difficult to accept that the children would no longer be part of her life. But she still had the hope that one day they would return home.
At the same time, she was angry and felt impotent because she felt that the children were influenced by Jehovah's Witnesses. That it was the organization, the elders, the congregation and her own family that influenced the children to expel their own mother.
She demanded answers from the elders herself, and she decided to go down to the ward where she used to come. Here she also hoped to catch a glimpse of her children.
Exclusion is equal to love
Jehovah's Witnesses in Denmark and the rest of the world are governed by the so-called New York Governing Body. From here, material - both texts, magazines and films - is produced that is sent out to the branch offices in various countries that translate the material into local languages.
Jehovah's Witnesses Central Magazine, The Watchtower. In this release from 2012 you can read about Judgment Day, Armageddon. Photo: jw . org This applies, among other things, to the known magazines 'Awake!' and the 'Watchtower', which is often distributed on the street and on the citizens' personal addresses.
The material is about how, according to Jehovah's Witnesses, living and covering almost every aspect of life.
When members meet in their ward, they tell each other what they have read. One of the key points is that Jehovah's Witnesses must not associate with apostates - because they have actively waived the word of God.
For example, in various texts from Jehovah's Witnesses, it says:
"Although it can be very difficult, we must avoid having unnecessary contact with an excluded family member" "Exclusion helps protect the purity of the congregation" "Family members can show their love for the church and for the offender by respecting the exclusion" "Everyone in the congregation can show principled love by avoiding joining or talking to the excluded. In this way, they support the discipline Jehovah has given him through the elders." Rules that Maria Alexander himself was trained in and passed on to her children.
She therefore blamed herself that her children did not want anything to do with her. But she also greatly blamed the entire organization that, with her words, brainwash her members.
Maria requires answers
In the fall of 2018, Maria Alexander sat on a chair at the back of the Kingdom Hall - the Assembly Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses - she used to come near Faxe. It was the first time since the panic disaster made her stay away from the meetings more than six years ago.
She welcomed several former friends and acquaintances when she came in. Friendly, but meticulously greeted again.
The meeting started. Changing speakers went up the stage and read out selected texts.
Maria Alexander's heart pounded. Most of the wrath that the whole congregation sat and accepted all that was said and read from the organization's books. But she was also nervous about the confrontation she had planned.
For her disappointment, the kids were not looking anywhere. But the ex-husband was there. He ignored her.
Maria Alexander, when she was pregnant with her daughter, who is 15 years old today. Photo: Private When the meeting was over, Maria Alexander went up to an elderly man in gray suit and striped tie. It was one of the elders who helped expel her just under four years ago. Reluctantly, he agreed to ask some questions. He seemed tense. They went into a smaller room and closed the door.
"And you say, Mary?" He said with crossed arms.
- I need to know if you urge my children not to have contact with me?
"No," replied the elder.
That's how I see it.
No. We have nothing to do with that at all. We do not interfere in that.
There was nothing to come by.
But it was not surprising. In fact, Maria Alexander was relieved. For even though the children had not been to the meeting and the eldest would not answer in depth to her question, she felt that she had been sent a sentence.
She had been confirmed that she had made the right choice. Never again would she return to the organization she felt had wasted 43 years of her life.
Maria Alexander after meeting with her old congregation 0:49
Maria Alexander sought out her old congregation to try and find out why her children would not see her. Video: Kim Hess Freedom stands above everything else Today, the whole of Maria Alexander's family refuses to see her - both parents and sister have turned her back. The same applies to her three children. Since that night at the dining table for almost four years, she has only seen her two youngest children a few times. Last time two and a half years ago, she says.
The daughter is today 15 and the youngest son is 17 years old. Her eldest son is 26. She does not know much about what is happening in their lives, but sometimes gets a little to know via SMS when the children answer her.
The loss of the children is a deep wound. But Maria Alexander refuses to return to Jehovah's Witnesses to be with them. Today she lives with her boyfriend in Copenhagen and has built up a network of friends that she regards as family.
- I'm not going back to that prison. My freedom is above everything else. But of course I wanted to bring my children along. I think one day they find out that this world outside is not dangerous, she says.
TV 2 has been in contact with Maria Alexander's ex-husband and her eldest son. None of them want to participate in the article.
Jehovah's Witnesses do not want to comment on the article.
SHARE WITH YOUR FRIENDS Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share by email Prepared by
Jonas HR Moestrup
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9
Denmark - a wave against JW policy on national TV and web
by Not_Culty inhttps://old.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/apr7fh/denmark_is_on_fire_a_massive_wave_against_jw/.
post below.
" a wave of exjw-stories have hit national news in denmark this week.
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Not_Culty
https://old.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/apr7fh/denmark_is_on_fire_a_massive_wave_against_jw/
POST below
" A wave of exJW-stories have hit national news in Denmark this week. They have been published as news on national TV and stories on web. On Facebook every story has received thousands of comments and interactions.
I will link to the stories here, there is no paywall, but they are in the Danish language, of course. You can read them through Google Translate. If anyone want to translate some of the stories, feel free to do so in the comments.The wave still goes on, I will edit this post and include more links if they get published.
Story 1 - Ann Cecilia - She recorded her JC and it is published in the article
The JC is published here, for those who understand the language:http://nyheder.tv2.dk/samfund/2019-01-23-hoer-moedet-med-religioese-ledere-der-doemmer-jehovas-vidne-for-at-have-en
Story 2 - Maria Alexander - She lost contact with her three children after divorcing her elder husband and leaving JW
Story 3 - CSA - Lotus Luca was 14 years when she was sexually assaulted and told the elders, they never told the police
Story 4 - David Maagaard - former MS telling about the surveillance of members
Story 5 - The Shepherd-book
Google translate here: https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/aplpvx/the_elders_handbook_in_the_news_in_denmark/
Story 6 - The Danish government will meet and discuss these stories and what to do about this
http://nyheder.tv2.dk/politik/2019-02-11-ministre-kaldes-i-samraad-efter-jehova-afsloeringer
Story 7 - JW's parallel legal system is breaching the freedom of religion, expert says.
As always, the Branch Office and every other JW refuse to comment or do an interview. They hide away and let the R&F take the hit alone in their field service.
Edit Google Translate is now in the comments, thanks to u/theart_of_psoas
Just scroll down a little. "
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Past 12 months, #watchtower has obtained more than 36 unique subpoenas
by Not_Culty inhttps://twitter.com/mark_j_odonnell/status/1095514606657851392.
"in the past 12 months, #watchtower has obtained more than 36 unique subpoenas to identify the people who have posted their documents, leaked videos, & images from their publications.
this #watchhunt is a coordinated effort to locate & punish the leak sources.".
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Not_Culty
https://twitter.com/Mark_J_ODonnell/status/1095514606657851392
"In the past 12 months, #watchtower has obtained more than 36 unique subpoenas to identify the people who have posted their documents, leaked videos, & images from their publications. This #WatchHunt is a coordinated effort to locate & punish the leak sources."
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Experts say new definitions of cults are not cut and dry
by Not_Culty inhttp://www.the-standard.org/life/experts-say-new-definitions-of-cults-are-not-cut-and/article_85c22fb2-2e7b-11e9-8135-a7edf05c3843.html.
terry chapman, staff reporter february 2019. .
cebook.
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Not_Culty
http://www.the-standard.org/life/experts-say-new-definitions-of-cults-are-not-cut-and/article_85c22fb2-2e7b-11e9-8135-a7edf05c3843.html
- Terry Chapman, Staff Reporter February 2019
In November of 1978, over 900 members of The People’s Temple died after drinking cyanide-laced juice in an event that would shock the world. To this day, “The Jonestown Massacre” has gone down as one of the most infamous cult-related events in human history.
Cult hysteria, and those who fear these groups, often label religious organizations that don’t fit any typical religious standpoints as a “cult.” However, the definition of a cult in pop culture has changed, according to some religious experts.
Dave Embree, a professor of religion at Missouri State University, is an expert on this topic. Embree teaches a class called “New Religious Movements,” which talks about many of the groups commonly labeled by the public as cults.
“The term ‘cult’ is interesting because it has become sort of a universally pejorative and negative term,” Embree said. “I have people dropping into this office on a regular basis, and they’re saying things like, ‘I think this group is a cult.’ Generally, what this really means is ‘this is a group that I don’t trust and that’s up to something dangerous.’”
Embree says the fear of danger comes from the tragedies that many see in the news. Events like The Jonestown Massacre are still in the minds of those who fear these religious groups.
“Consequently, the term cult has been used to measure the danger of a particular group,” Embree said. “There are hundreds of books with the word cult in the title. If they’re written from a particular doctrinal perspective, then a cult is just ‘anything that doesn’t agree with me.’”
In the ‘80s, however, there was a strong anti-cult movement, which saw a cult as anything that robbed people of their choice or free will. During this time period, the word “brainwashing” was thrown around a lot.
Embree cautions skeptics to stay away from the word cult, opting to use “new religious movements” instead.
“New religious movements is a safer term because there are a lot of different views out there, many of which have originated since 1800,” Embree said. “However, they don’t all fit the same structure. Many of those cult books talk about specific requirements, like a charismatic leader who controls people’s lives or who asks for a lot of money. Well, that’s sort of like a lot of the health clubs around. That’s a lot like the Army. That’s a lot like multi-level sales organizations that are out there.”
To Embree, there is a distinction between structure and belief system.
"You have to think about whether or not what they believe will put you dangerously out of sync with what you already believe."
“When you meet a group, it’s important to ask what they believe,” Embree said. “You have to think about whether or not what they believe will put you dangerously out of sync with what you already believe.”
It’s also important to consider if there are real emotional, physical and financial dangers when getting involved with these groups.
A new religious movement is a religious organization that began after the year 1800. Groups that fit the category of a new religious movement would include, but are not limited to, Jehovah’s Witnesses, The Satanic Temple — which doesn’t actually believe in Satan — The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the traditional medical storefronts seen around town.
Locally, several new religious movements are present. The Satanic Temple, LDS Church, Kingdom Hall of Jehovah’s Witnesses, and many “new eastern medicine” storefronts that serve as ways of “modern healing” have locations in Springfield, to name a few.
“These groups all say, ‘We want to give you a new way of looking at reality and a new way of coping with the world in which you live,’” Embree said. “Probably none of these groups that I just named are particularly physically threatening, nor all that financially threatening.”
There are other groups, like white supremacist groups, that advocate violence against others who aren’t white. Such groups argue that those of white skin with “white brains” are superior, according to Embree.
“Flip that around, and you’ll see groups like Nation of Islam, which on the surface talks about how they believe Allah is black and how white people are blue-eyed devils with genetic mutations created by mad scientists,” Embree said. “Throughout the last 30 or 40 years, however, they have not been pursuing violent repercussions. However, in prisons, where some recruitment takes place with both white and black supremacy groups, there is a propensity for violence, assuring mutual protection if you get involved in one of these groups.”
Rob Rook, a member of the Temple of Set, said that groups often get labeled as cults because people don’t bother to understand their ideologies. Rook also said that groups that use coercion and push people away from others who aren’t in the group would meet the cult criteria.
“When I first came to Missouri State University, there was a church that I became involved with called the International Church of Christ, which is not longer around,” Rook said. “Pretty much every other church in town considered them a cult. I think that they pretty much epitomize what people expect of a cult.”
Rook said the church was like any other church at first.
“They become a part of your life like any church,” Rook said. “Things start to get strange as you get more involved. The pastor, for instance, took all of the single guys and told us that we could serve God better by asking a new girl out every week, so that by Sunday, we could ask her to church. He wanted more young women to join the church.”
Rook says that he got kicked out of the church at one point because a pastor ordered him not to go home to his mother for Christmas because she believed that International Church of Christ was a cult. He said he was then marked, which meant he was a tool of the devil.
“Nobody in the church was allowed to talk to me after that,” Rook said. “It’s coercion like that that makes people think different groups are cults.”
Ted Vaggalis, a professor of philosophy at Drury University, also weighed in on what he believes the term cult really means.
“Cult comes from the Latin term ‘cultus,’ and it refers to groups of believers who have a ‘kite religious connection together,’” Vaggalis said. “Any sect of Christianity that fits the idea of a cult relates to culture.”
Vaggalis said the term became associated with Walter Martin and his book “Kingdom of the Cults” that wanted to paint a sinister portrayal of religious groups, such as Mormons, Seventh-day Adventists and others.
Vaggalis said people who believe the books labelling different groups as cults are not the typical paranoid people that you would expect.
“They’re usually bright people, who, not knowing whether or not the authors are competent in the subject, accept the books for what they are,” Vaggalis said. “It’s not a matter of education, but rather, a lot of people don’t have time to pay attention to anything besides this one book, because it has a lot of information.
“What they don’t account for is the motive. Faiths are a refuge from the world, and when things are called into question, they are frightened.”
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2018 Branch Manual Leaked
by Not_Culty inthe branch manual (august 2018) can be downloaded here: https://faithleaks.org/wiki/documents/f/f6/2018-08-branch_organization.pdf.
https://truthandtransparency.org/news/2019/2/11/leaked-branch-and-elders-manuals-pull-back-the-curtain-of-inner-workings-of-jehovahs-witnesses-top-leaders.
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