Viviane: I don't presume or pretend anything (except when it's role playing/dress up night
Now THIS is the most interesting thing posted on this thread in the last 8 pages!!!
Oubliette
JoinedPosts by Oubliette
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
“We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.”
― Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion -
233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
That definition comes from an official page on atheism.
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
That definition comes from an official page on atheism.
Um, who appointed the owner of that website as the final authority on what "atheism" is and what all atheists believe.
Just because Austin Cline writes what he thinks an atheist is or isn't, hardly settles the issue for all time.
I know was not invited to vote on it! -
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Today's (4/12) WT study - all about Jesus
by OneEyedJoe intoday's watchtower study article is all about jesus.
this stuck out to me after a year of hanging out on here where one frequent point of criticism is that jws claim to be christians but never talk about jesus.. anyone think it's a coincidence that today was the "special talk" follow-up to the memorial?
i think not - this is the most attended sunday meeting of the year, complete with many ubms, studies, and miscellaneous other potential victims who have been subjected to a coordinated effort to pressure them into attending.
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Oubliette
OEJ: It quickly got to the point that there was no challenge to it and I got bored.
Shooting fish in a barrel.
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
Xanthippe: No Oub both statements are about belief, neither are about knowledge. Sorry, going to watch Horizon now- astronomy programme.
I guess you missed my point about neither statement needing to be true or accurate.
Enjoy your tv show!
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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-
Oubliette
Xanthippe: I think they are the same statement grammatically and semantically.
How can you think that?
One explicitly asserts possessing knowledge whereas the other states not having that knowledge.
I suggest you reread my analogy of the murder trial.
Saying you believe someone is innocent of a crime is NOT the same as saying you do not believe they are guilty. (Note that neither of these beliefs need be correct. The person might actually be guilty, but this is irrelevant to the point I am making).
One person is convinced of the accused person's innocence, the other is unconvinced of his guilt.
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25
Today's (4/12) WT study - all about Jesus
by OneEyedJoe intoday's watchtower study article is all about jesus.
this stuck out to me after a year of hanging out on here where one frequent point of criticism is that jws claim to be christians but never talk about jesus.. anyone think it's a coincidence that today was the "special talk" follow-up to the memorial?
i think not - this is the most attended sunday meeting of the year, complete with many ubms, studies, and miscellaneous other potential victims who have been subjected to a coordinated effort to pressure them into attending.
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Oubliette
OEJ: it took me a while after waking up to realize the level of deceptive recruiting that goes on, and I'm obviously still noticing new layers to it all the time.
Good for you!
As I was "waking up" I committed to really studying every WT "Study Article" intensely, scrutinizing it as carefully as possible, looking for any and all instances of logical fallacies, assertions made without evidence, contradictions and dishonest/misleading statements. I did this religiously for almost two years.
This exercise was eye-opening to say the least.
I found that every single WT study article is an exercise in propaganda. In that two year period, I was not able to find a single solitary article that was not rife with propaganda, lies, fallacies and deceptions. Not one.
Let's review: It's a cult!
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
FMF: Lack of belief in god is not a claim that there is NO god. This is where people can't understand atheists.
Yes.
Imagine a person is accused of committing a brutal murder. During the trial, evidence is presented by both sides, the prosecution and the defense, to the jury.
At the conclusion of the trial, the jury deliberates. One juror says, "I believe he is innocent." Another says, "I do not believe he is guilty."
Although these may superficially seem to be equivalent statements, they are not. Juror #1 is asserting that the evidence presented convinced her of the accused's innocence, whereas Juror #2 is stating that the evidence was not enough to persuade her of his guilt beyond the proverbial reasonable doubt.
It is similar when people discuss their belief about whether or not God exists.
Some assert a belief that there is no God. God does not exist.
Others may state that they do not believe God exists. These are not equivalent statements.
"I believe there is no God," is not equal to: "I do not believe in God."
I've quoted it before on this forum, but I think it's appropriate to repeat it here, Carl Sagan's thoughts on the subject:
Those who raise questions about the God hypothesis and the soul hypothesis are by no means all atheists. An atheist is someone who is certain that God does not exist, someone who has compelling evidence against the existence of God. I know of no such compelling evidence. Because God can be relegated to remote times and places and to ultimate causes, we would have to know a great deal more about the universe than we do to be sure that no such God exists. To be certain of the existence of God and to be certain of the nonexistence of God seem to me to be the confident extremes in a subject so riddled with doubt and uncertainty as to inspire very little confidence indeed. - Conversations with Carl Sagan (2006), edited by Tom Head, p. 70
The subject of evidence, what it is and what it is not, is another subject for another time.
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233
What is BELIEF ?
by EdenOne instemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.
what exactly is "belief"?.
is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?
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Oubliette
Simon: we don't believe the pope is some divine representative of an imaginary super-being.
But some people do.
