"I do not answer to Watchtower. … Watchtower does not have, and never has had, any authority over me" - Declaration of Gerrit Lösch to the Superior Court of the State of California, County of San Diego, signed and dated the 4th day of February 2014
Oubliette
JoinedPosts by Oubliette
-
31
Bro Loesch's talk.
by New day inrecently i heard through video link to our kh a talk by bro loesch where he attacked university study (again) but this time he prefaced his remarks by saying, and i quote, "the faithful slave does not forbid you to go to university.
" so this was a bad start as his following remarks made it clear that this was just a way of seeming reasonable while basically saying that we shouldn't do it.
he went on to use an illustration i think he has used before about a man with ocd who decided to kill himself.
-
-
-
15
Any good answers at this Sunday's WT?
by Lemonp inobviously this weeks' wt has been part 3 of big changes in the doctrine.
at the end i answered up saying along the lines of: "as we can see from the illustration box, when it comes to the reward being given to the slaves, divine appointment was not given in 1919. this will happen in future when the anointed get taken before armageddon".
i couldn't bring myself to say "raptured at armageddon" as i think people might have taken a closer look at me...but it felt good to call out publicly the bull sh#t date of 1919 .
-
-
Oubliette
TornInTwo: It seems to me that the GB used the illustration to promote themselves and to promote the preaching work of JWs, without clear scriptural backing for either.
Bingo!
Let's review: It's a cult!
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
Not one of the points you made in your previous post is an accurate description of any of the "changes" made by the WT leadership. I asked you for two specific things and you "responded" with a dozen different things and failed to give both the exact quotations and a reference.FT,
no I'm not going to spend my entire off day to provide you the exact page numbers of each change
Typical evasive bullshit. You're just like the GB. You give what appears to be an answer, but really isn't.
BTW, if you ever find yourself in a Judicial Committee, I suggest you try demonstrating your "repentance" using the language the WTBTS uses when it "admits its mistakes." See how that works for you.
-
15
Any good answers at this Sunday's WT?
by Lemonp inobviously this weeks' wt has been part 3 of big changes in the doctrine.
at the end i answered up saying along the lines of: "as we can see from the illustration box, when it comes to the reward being given to the slaves, divine appointment was not given in 1919. this will happen in future when the anointed get taken before armageddon".
i couldn't bring myself to say "raptured at armageddon" as i think people might have taken a closer look at me...but it felt good to call out publicly the bull sh#t date of 1919 .
-
-
Oubliette
Splash: The article starts by saying that this parable of the talents applies to the anointed.
Wouldn't that be applying the type/antitype method of interpretation they JUST said they don't do anymore!
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
Steve2: The mistake here, as on other similar threads before, is to assume that the poster whose OP has elicited so many responses is actually going through these one by one, thoughtfully weighing up the arguments.
I don't know if your comments are in relation to my most recent post and others like them, but I don't post expecting a response from FT.
I post for the benefit of lurkers.
People like FT never respond to questions like mine for a very simple reason. If they did, it would only prove my point. Their silence is a second best approximation of acknowledgement.
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
Fusion Theism, on the first page of this thread I asked you to respond to two points:
- Just exactly what "positive" changes have they made recently? Please be specific, emphasizing how each and every said change is in fact "positive."
- Could you please provide quotes and references in where "the Society" has "admitted to errors" and that "they've been wrong in big ways." I would appreciate seeing those exact words, or even anything remotely close to that, in print in a WTBTS publication as I am unaware of "the Society" or any of their high-level representatives (ie: the Governing Body members) ever making such an honest admission.
-
We are now on page seven and you have yet to respond. Why is that?
Oubliette
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
Pete Zahut: They condemn other religions for teaching falsehoods yet have done the same thing themselves from the very beginning. Unlike the Catholics, they have never come out and formally apologized for the falsehoods and wrongdoings of those who went before them nor for the ones they taught or committed themselves.
Exactly!
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
Island Man: Do you think Watchower is unaware that 607 BCE is false? They know it's false! Carl Johnson wrote a book logically showing its false and sent them a copy.
You forgot to mention that Johnson was disfellowshipped as a result of his efforts to correct this false teaching.
THAT is how the WT leadership responds to genuine efforts from its members to correct errors.
Let's review: It's a cult!
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
FT, Read what Irish Catholic Archbishop, Diarmuid Martin, the archbishop of Dublin recently said in response to Ireland's legalizing of same-sex marriage by popular vote:
“We [the church] have to stop and have a reality check, not move into denial of the realities."
The leaders of the WTBTS have NEVER said anything remotely as honest or enlightened.
-
88
Damned if they do, Damned if they don't
by FusionTheism ini see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.
i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.
also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.
-
-
Oubliette
FT: you also condemn them when they DO change in a positive way
Just exactly what "positive" changes have they made recently? Please be specific, emphasizing how each and every said change is in fact "positive."
FT: they recently have admitted to errors and say they've been wrong in big ways in the past
Could you please provide quotes and references in where "the Society" has "admitted to errors" and that "they've been wrong in big ways." I would appreciate seeing those exact words, or even anything remotely close to that, in print in a WTBTS publication as I am unaware of "the Society" or any of their high-level representatives (ie: the Governing Body members) ever making such an honest admission.
Thank you in advance.
Oubliette